Front recovery points - what's the worst that could happen?

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Originally Posted by Yerok30

the hook is no where near safe.
no one was within 50m of the recovery.
I am getting some rated recovery points professionally installed ASAP.
Thank you for your comment

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Actually that is most probably a rated aftermarket hook which is in use by many, safely, BUT it is attached to a totally unsuitable point, the factory tow ring. This is a classic example of a tear out failure caused by too much load, causing a moment about the top bolt. In order for that tow ring bracket to be anywhere suitable to anchor a recovery hook to, in excess of M12 Grade 8.8 bolts and plate exceeding 6mm will be required. Then you would face the possibility of a failure of the front chassis fixing points as you would have to drill out the existing holes etc to accomodate the M12 bolts...See where this is heading???

Using this bracket for a recovery is very dangerous, As you have seen.

I'm glad decent points are being installed Pronto, I am hoping others are seeing this and taking heed.


I have some decent ones for my ARB bar, I'll try and take pics and post them up sometime soon, they aren't installed yet. As usual I have fitted many sets to customers cars, but mine waits , and waits, and waits:(

JC :)

The other issue with the D2 is,it is often difficult to fit a good recovery point,depending what type of bar you have fitted.

From memory i think it is the ECB bar that causes issues as it has a low skirt across the front and actually makes the factory tow point impossible to use as well.

At the Perth 4wd show I spoke to a rep from ARB. He had a d2 as well. I asked about recovery points.
He said that ARB sells optional recovery points for the d2.

I asked about the bar recovery points, if you need the option ones, why were they on there at all?

He said that the bars are designed for recovery, remember the winch is within the bar and the crush cans etc are all engineered to withstand recovery operations. ARB has been making bars like this for many years and could not survive legally as liability for bars breaking and any injuries would be theirs as the bar designer and accreditor.

He said a bridle was recommended for snatching situations. I then posed the question if the bar was ok, why did they then make the optional recovery hooks?

He said because people always abuse and go outside guidelines and don't use proper gear when doing recoveries, so therefore a idiot proof hook was needed.
But for people who actually do things correctly, the bar is well within its limits for recovery (using the built in recovery points). He himself only uses the bar. He pointed out that the bar design is now over 10 years old and if there was any serious design issues, it would have been fixed long before now.

I have an ARB bar, but as yet not needed to hook up to it, so I don't know. Common sense tells me that a professional bar designed for the purpose should be ok......maybe the bar for normal recoveries and some option hooks for extra safety when in the poo....

Cheers
Kev

So my ARB deluxe bar (non winch) recovery points are also ok?
Deluxe bull bar | Products | ARB 4x4 Accessories

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Originally Posted by northiam

So my ARB deluxe bar (non winch) recovery points are also ok?
Deluxe bull bar | Products | ARB 4x4 Accessories

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I have no idea mate......you'd have to ask ARB I guess, is there a difference between a winch and non winch bar in mounts? Strength?

Cheers
Kev

If you're referring to the eyelets on the bar, the debate about using them as dedicated recovery points is pretty extensive.
Theoretically you shouldn't use them, as the bar is secured by the crush cans, which are kinda important, and supposedly the forces of a strenuous recovery can have a negative impact on the crush cans.
However in practice, I know several people who recover off their bar and have no dramas.
Then again, the only way to observe any impaired crush can performance would be to have them crash and then look at how the crush cans performed, which is something we like to avoid :D
Personally (completely non professional opinion) I'd avoid using them, and go for some dedicated recovery points mounted BEHIND the concertina point on the crush cans :)
The ones on the bar might be easier to access if you're nose down in mud, but a snatch or winch recovery isn't really something you want to take shortcuts with :)
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/verandah/1...ery-1-2-a.html
Have a squiz, I've got a pair of these and they're tops.
Cheers
Muppet

Cheers Muppet, I understand what you are saying about the crush cans, rather have then in perfect order if they are ever required......

I did ask about them and was told that the forces required to cause any issues to the crush cans was unlikely to be reach in a recovery situation as this had been considered already, remember the winch is already pulling on those even if you hook the wire on a tree, or return to another off bar point.

The design of the bar has been developed to cover those forces.....

But, I think I will get some others just for insurance, considering my understanding of the srs system and crush cans, I'd rather have them perfect than chance some damage.

I have emailed ARB to get something in writing though....just out of curiosity.

I'll have a look at your link in a minute.

Cheers
Kev

You'll get different responses from different ARB stores, some say it's fine, some say no, some say it's fine but as long as you do XY and Z.
AFAIK the crush cans are set to deform at 18t applied pressure, however that's when it's pushing into the cans, as opposed to pulling on them.
You can get them engineered so that they have the same rating for pulls, but it's not worth it.
Besides, I think it's more of an issue with the SRS sensors :)

There's only one SRS sensor. Inside the vehicle, under the centre consul.

The xrox crush cans are massive steel units. Especially by comparison to the alloy/steel pinned original parts fitted. They have two holes in the bar outside the hawse hole for the winch to allow two eye bolts to be fitted. The bar has extra plating behind these. I have winched and been winched off these (equalised) and nevr had an issue. I have also fitted larger bolts (12mm from 10mm) as the 10mm were just too small in the holes, 12mm it the chassis and only a little filing was needed on the rough cut mount holes. Doesn't move on the mounts and the eyes are at a level that can be reached.

The ARB ayes on the underside of the bar I see more than not bent in from using an equalising strap.

Yep, fair call fellas, this is my first ARB bar, I have a TJM on my other car.

Will get some "real" points and fit up, better to err on the side of caution methinks.;)

Cheers
Kev