Thread: Front recovery points - what's the worst that could happen?

Originally Posted by Lotz-A-Landies

Just had a look at the packaging on the recovery points I got last night, they are exactly the same as the ones ones posted by "R2D2"



The original packaging has a label "Vehicle specific heavy duty tow point" a part number "TP-DiscoII" "ARB Osborne Park WA".

Inside the pack is an ARB leaflet with a list of pack contents (including 1/2" unc x 5 1/2" bolts) and instructions that it wont fit with a standard bumper and not to use a rattle gun.

My guess they are or at least were genuine ARB (engineered) parts.
Whether ARB sells its parts without testing the design I have no idea!

And a pair was purchased years ago by 4x4DE and copied.

I know this because I purchased them at the same time from ARB WA.
They were not common to any other ARB store.

Back then I used to sell D2 SLS lift kits to ARB...

Originally Posted by bob10

Please read my earlier post, Bob

Why?

I'm only describing the parts and packaging.

I have the ARB WA recovery points fitted, with Black Rat 4.7t rated bow shackles. Haven't had any issues on the couple of times I've been recovered.

I have these ARB hooks fitted, bought off a fellow forumite in the west on here a while back.

Originally Posted by Lotz-A-Landies

Why?

I'm only describing the parts and packaging.

ok, it's just that the points in the photo are the same as other recovery points , supplied by a number of sources, and they seem to be the accepted type for D2's , but according to ARB they have no engineered or rated recovery points for D2's. Nor are any of the others engineered or rated, as far as I know. Where does that leave us , insurance wise, if there is a major problem during recovery? Or , indeed , if someone is hurt? Bob

Hi Bob

There are so many variables when it comes to legal responsibility. When a manufacturer sells an item for a specific purpose, they retain the responsibility for its safety AS long as it is fitted and used within their specifications or guidelines.
If they don't supply any details, and the details are not readily available at your request (yes you have a responsibility to ask) then they leave themselves wide open.
If you use or fit the item outside the intended use or direction, the responsibility becomes yours. That's why it's important to ask what limitations are on their goods. This way you know what you can safely use the item for.
The issue is proving how the item was used and what caused the damage. As ARB state, the recovery points are just one item in the chain of recovery so to speak. If you use the correctly rated gear for your vehicle, eg snatch strap rated for a disco, not a mack truck, it should give way before the mounts.
This applies to all your recovery gear and it's the only way to prove which item failed, how it failed and where the responsibility should lay.
Any gear, tested and rated or not can be pushed to failure in extreme situations, but as long as you do things properly, then at least your legal arguement is not stuffed before you even start.....and it's better to break a strap rather than rip off a steel recovery point and launch it into someone isn't it....

As I said, there are many variables when it comes to the law, and the above is just a generalisation of the basics, be aware of the limits of your gear, use it properly and don't abuse it, you can't go to far wrong.

In the case of the above recovery points, the vendor/manufacturer has a responsibility to supply an item that is safe for its intended use. If the was no details supplied with the item, contact the vendor to get them. If there are no guidelines, more fool the vendor/manufacturer, and as long as you use them as I described above, if you are unfortunate to have one let go and someone gets hurt, at least your legal arguement shows you used them appropriately and with reasonable expectation of function.....
On the opposite side, anyone can cut out a bit of steel and call it a recovery point. If they tell you exactly that, and that it's not tested and they will not accept any responsibility if it goes bang, and you subsequently fit it, use it and it does go bang, then you will bare the responsibility because you knowingly fitted an item that was dangerous, likely to cause injury, or not otherwise suitable for purpose.

The law can be complicate, IS very expensive, and can cost you everything you own, or even put you on a little holiday, that's why it's so important to only fit gear, or use gear within the manufacturers specs, or legally approved items. Whilst most of us will go through our lives without coming unstuck, some of us will, and that's when you find out about lawyers......

Please don't take any of this as legal advice, it's just my experience only.

I'm not a lawyer, but I've had 22years dealing with them, learnt a few things on the way...

The issue with creating something thats legal is when there's no legal guidelines, approval process or regulatory body no matter what you make and say it's for someone will use it outside it's "approved standard" and the system (read first lawyer on the scene) will ream whoever they think they can because it doesn't meet a standard that doesn't exist.

This will come up in court and it will eventually be thrown out as you can't nail someone for doing something outside a standard that doesn't exits but the lawyers are richer, the seller is bankrupt and someone got hurt but is no better off.

Originally Posted by AndyW

I have made three attempts to order the RP4 recovery points by phone now from UV4X4 Enoggera and each time I have spoken to someone who didn't know what I was talking about and was told that the guy who looked after the Landrover stuff would call me back ASAP. In every instance I have not received a return call at all. Not my idea of good service.

Hey Andy,
Apologies mate, first I have known of this.
I'd love to hear about it, and I'll get you sorted.
I've sent you a PM.
Cheers
Matt