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Thread: NNN ECU PROBLEM

  1. #11
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    OK, the main differences between the 10P/EU2 and 18P/EU3 motors that require differences in ECU mapping:

    - Injector pressure increased from 1500bar (22,500spi) to 1750bar (25,500psi)

    - Ambient pressure and pressure sensor on air filter box changed from 3 pin to 4 pin

    Using an EU3 map (i.e. the map programmed into the NNN500250) on an EU2 motor will mean that;

    a) there will be less fuel injected than required by the motor, and;
    b) the ambient pressure sensor will not function resulting in the following symptoms:

    • Altitude compensation inoperative (engine will produce black smoke).
    • Active boost control inoperative.
    • Turbocharger boost pressure limited to 1 bar (14.5 lbf.in2).
    • EGR altitude compensation inoperative.
    If you check Tombies website there is a pdf document listing the suitable stock maps for the EU2 motor. Under the entry for NNN500250 there are exactly ZERO compatible maps, and unfortunately that means the NNN500250 has ZERO remaps to suit an EU2 motor.

    The NNN000120 or NNN500020 are the only two ECU's that can be remapped to correctly support the EU2/10P motor with manual box.

    FWIW there is a big difference between running and running properly.

    cheers
    Paul

  2. #12
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    I have the NNN ECU in my 1999 D2 manual.It was actually a Defender ECU,changed to D2 spec.
    Mine has an auto logic tune,runs REALLY well.Some smoke,NOT EXSESSIVE.Active boost control works and I have it producing 1.4BAR,also have a big intercooler.Producing PLENTY of power

    Bronson,easy to check if it is Defender spec,along with no cruise,no aircon,temp gauge reads backwards.A D2 spec tune will fix it.You need to security match the new ECU and enter the Injector Codes.As mentioned,you need to check the throttle sensor/change to 2 way.
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  3. #13
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    But which nnn?

    There are at least five different ECU's that begin with that prefix.

    NNN000120
    NNN000130
    NNN500020
    NNN500030
    NNN500250

    The *20 are for manual TD5, *30 for auto td5.

    There are stock map files for the 20 and 30 ecu's that support both EU2 and EU3 TD5 motors.

    The NNN500250 has one map, and that suits a Manual EU3 TD5 motor.

    If you want to upgrade the ECU on an EU2 motor (which will have a MSB prefix ECU) avoid the NNN500250 like the plague!!!

    The NNN500250 was only fitted to manual D2a's, so there is no Defender version.

    Cheers
    Paul

  4. #14
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    Cheers Paul,

    Ive managed to sort the reving issue out by bridging out the clutch switch after disconnecting it. Well what do you know it has stopped the dramas I was having.
    By the way what exactly does the Clutch switch actually do??
    Anyway for the moment she is running better that ever seen before and goes
    like ****e ofa shovelMight give the NNN ECU remap a spell unless I could be gauranteed that it will increase in performance. So looks like Ive got a NNN500250 ECU collectiung dust on the shelves now


    bronson

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by bronson View Post
    Cheers Paul,

    Ive managed to sort the reving issue out by bridging out the clutch switch after disconnecting it. Well what do you know it has stopped the dramas I was having.
    By the way what exactly does the Clutch switch actually do??
    Anyway for the moment she is running better that ever seen before and goes
    like ****e ofa shovelMight give the NNN ECU remap a spell unless I could be gauranteed that it will increase in performance. So looks like Ive got a NNN500250 ECU collectiung dust on the shelves now


    bronson
    Hi bronson,

    Good to hear the D2 is going well now Are you running a chipped ECU in the D2 or is it stock?

    cheers
    Paul

  6. #16
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    Yeah its had a TRS chipped ecu in it for a while now, but Ive always had little dramas with the car. Seems like after fixing numeruos probs Ive finally got it running well.
    By the way what exactly does the Clutch switch actually do??

    I see we are neighbours......probably seen each other around home???


    cheers bronson
    Last edited by bronson; 25th December 2011 at 08:36 PM. Reason: more info

  7. #17
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    But which nnn?

    There are at least five different ECU's that begin with that prefix.

    NNN000120
    NNN000130
    NNN500020
    NNN500030
    NNN500250

    The *20 are for manual TD5, *30 for auto td5.

    There are stock map files for the 20 and 30 ecu's that support both EU2 and EU3 TD5 motors.

    The NNN500250 has one map, and that suits a Manual EU3 TD5 motor.

    If you want to upgrade the ECU on an EU2 motor (which will have a MSB prefix ECU) avoid the NNN500250 like the plague!!!

    The NNN500250 was only fitted to manual D2a's, so there is no Defender version.

    Cheers
    Paul



    So if you use this ECU with a different file on it would it be ok a manual 99 td5, in other words a hotter map file downloaded onto it??

    cheers

    bronson

  8. #18
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    So if you use this ECU with a different file on it would it be ok a manual 99 td5, in other words a hotter map file downloaded onto it??

    cheers

    bronson
    Hi Bronson,

    Yes, we are virtually neighbours.

    I'm running a Bruce Davis chipped ECU and have been seriously considering changing to a NNN*30 ECU so I can try some alternative remaps.

    The NNN500250 won't really be ok, unless you have a 18P/EU3 motor in your D2 and given that it's a 1999 model that is highly unlikely. As I've tried to explain the remapping process uses the factory map the car is running as a basis for modification. So as a starting point you need to have an ECU which can load a factory map which suits your motor.

    I have a copy of a file used by the LR diagnostic tools which lists all the D2 ECU variants and factory maps. There is a single entry for the NNN500250. In contrast the NNN000120 has 35 factory maps, while the NNN500020 has 11. For the Auto's the NNN000130 has 12 factory maps and the NNN500030 has 6.

    Because the only factory map for the NNN500250 is designed for the later 18P/EU3 motor it won't run correctly on a EU2 motor. This is primarily due to the difference in injector pressures and the changed wiring to the Ambient Air Pressure sensor.

    The NNN*20 (or NNN*30 for the auto) series ECU's have factory maps which support both EU2 and EU3 motors, so you can select a base map which suits the version of the TD5 motor fitted to your D2.

    My advice would be to sell the NNN500250 and track down either a NNN000120 to NNN500020. Unfortunately the demand for the NNN*20 and NNN*30 series ecu's means they are generally a lot more pricey than the NNN500250.

    Add: The NNN500250 seems to cause a lot of confusion as it is advertised as being a general fit for TD5 manual by places like Britpart. See for example this post: Disco 2 TD5 ECU heeeelp!!! - LR4x4 - The Land Rover Forum . In the case of that thread it's a bit of a case of the baffled being advised by the clueless, as so often happens on the UK LR forums.

    cheers
    Paul

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by bronson View Post
    By the way what exactly does the Clutch switch actually do??
    From RAVE pg 18-1-27 (Engine management system td5 > Description and operation > Clutch Switch)

    The clutch switch is located at the rear of the engine compartment on the RH side. The switch is operated by hydraulic pressure when the clutch pedal is pressed. The ECM uses the signal from the clutch switch for the following functions:
    • To cancel cruise control if operating.
    • To provide surge damping during gear change.


    Surge damping stops engine speed rising dramatically (engine flaring) during gear change. Surge damping assists driveability as follows:
    • Smoother gear change.
    • Greater exhaust gas emission control.
    • Improved fuel consumption.


    Input/Output
    The clutch switch receives battery voltage from the BCU. With the clutch pedal in the rest position the switch is closed, allowing battery voltage to pin 35 of the ECM connector C0658. When the clutch pedal is pressed the switch contacts open, interrupting the power supply to the ECM. The ECM receives 0 Volts.

    The clutch switch can fail in the following ways:
    • Switch open circuit.
    • Short circuit to vehicle supply.
    • Short circuit to earth.


    In the event of a clutch switch failure the ECM will react as follows:
    • Surge damping will be inactive.
    • Cruise control will be inactive.

  10. #20
    TOUTERRAIN Guest

    NNN

    Hi all I have just had a look at my map file on the Disco and it is
    svdxe008 svtnp0052 which is Disco Manual europe !
    any further advice would be appreciated, I understand it is possibly written for the later injectors, but I cannot see why this would affect the cruse?
    Anthony

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