Ineos Grenadier, do you reckon it'll take off?

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Originally Posted by grey_ghost

Comparing a new Defender with an MG is not even logical.
* The new Defender is designed and made by Land Rover.
* The MG was a company name - sold off to the chinese - and has nothing at all to do with the old car.
* I'm not sure that the rust proofing on a new MG is any better than the old one... ;-)

LR are still selling more new Defenders that they can make. The stopped making the old one - because it wasn't profitable. Not enough 'traditionalists' were buying the old Defender. If they were - then the new one wouldn't exist. Hence the traditionalists have noone to blame but themselves... :)

As for my collection - my wife got sick a few years ago and life's focus has changed. Over the last few years I have slowly been downsizing the fleet..
101 - Sold
1955 - 86" Sold
1956 - 107" Sold.
1960 - Series 2 88" Sold
1961 - Series 2a 109" Sold
1976 - 2 Door Range Rover Sold
1981 - Stage One V8 Wagon Sold
1990 - 4 Door Range Rover Sold
Freelander - sent to the wreckers after one too many mechanical failures. The worst vehicle that I have ever owned, bar none.
No.5 trailer - Sold
Crump & Cornish trailer - Sold.

What's left?
1988 - Perentie (I love it to bits - it's taken me across Australia on one trip)
1990 - 200tdi Manual D1 (used weekly)
2003 - 130 td5 single cab (project - plan to put a slide on camper on the back of it)
2006 - D3 petrol (project - just needs head lining done and it's ready for RWC)
2021 - Defender (146,000km on the clock and going strong. Best vehicle that I have ever owned)

Not much of a Land Rover collection anymore... :(

But that's life!

I hope that your OKA is going well - I always wanted one.

Cheers,
GG.

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All pretty much true. However, the main reasons include : the production line was antiquated ... even if they had demand, they couldn't meet it; the vehicle structure could not be adapted to meet more stringent crash testing without huge redesign costs and a new production line; the engine/transmission was way behind Euro 5 let alone meeting Euro 6 demands.... So if you are lucky enough to own on enjoy it. By the time the last ones were for sale, they were A$60k plus....

I was tempted but had become obsessed with maintaining a pre-loved RR P38, which a history of my posts over the 9- 10yrs I owned it will testify. The Grenadier sort of makes up for it... But it has its quirks :-) Trouble is, age and health have caught up so it's not getting the outings it deserves...but I live in hope![thumbsupbig]

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Originally Posted by Hoges

All pretty much true. However, the main reasons include : the production line was antiquated ... even if they had demand, they couldn't meet it; the vehicle structure could not be adapted to meet more stringent crash testing without huge redesign costs and a new production line; the engine/transmission was way behind Euro 5 let alone meeting Euro 6 demands.... So if you are lucky enough to own on enjoy it. By the time the last ones were for sale, they were A$60k plus....

I was tempted but had become obsessed with maintaining a pre-loved RR P38, which a history of my posts over the 9- 10yrs I owned it will testify. The Grenadier sort of makes up for it... But it has its quirks :-) Trouble is, age and health have caught up so it's not getting the outings it deserves...but I live in hope![thumbsupbig]

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Interestingly I don't think Ineos has a crash rating. It must me selling under a low volume type exemption. .No doubt it would be strong, but that doesn't translate directly to occupant safety (woildnt worry me too much as i drive a D2). Cheers

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Originally Posted by ozscott

Interestingly I don't think Ineos has a crash rating. It must me selling under a low volume type exemption. .No doubt it would be strong, but that doesn't translate directly to occupant safety (woildnt worry me too much as i drive a D2). Cheers

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Ineligible for an ANCAP rating as the GVM is over 3550kg = light truck rating.

If I was after a car to drive in populated areas, hands down I would pick the "Defender" over the grenadier. I think it would be a better car. Much nicer to drive like all the Discoveries before it.

If I was after a car to drive in remote areas and to keep a long time I wouldn't touch a "Defender". I'm really not sure I'd go for a Grenadier either. I think I'd pick a 76 series wagon. For the price difference you could do all sorts of things to make it yours, plus when you are remote there is much more support inertia.

As I've said before. IMHO at the price they have set for the Grenadier I doubt it will ever gain market momentum in Australia. It wouldn't surprise me at all if they give up trying after a few years, or significantly discount the price. Charging more for less is a really really tough thing to pull off. I don't think the Grenadier is capable of that. LR just gave up that market entirely.

If they had priced the Grenadier close to the 76 which was the initial promise then this would be another paradigm entirely.

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Originally Posted by Captain_Rightfoot

If I was after a car to drive in populated areas, hands down I would pick the "Defender" over the grenadier. I think it would be a better car. Much nicer to drive like all the Discoveries before it.

If I was after a car to drive in remote areas and to keep a long time I wouldn't touch a "Defender". I'm really not sure I'd go for a Grenadier either. I think I'd pick a 76 series wagon. For the price difference you could do all sorts of things to make it yours, plus when you are remote there is much more support inertia.

As I've said before. IMHO at the price they have set for the Grenadier I doubt it will ever gain market momentum in Australia. It wouldn't surprise me at all if they give up trying after a few years, or significantly discount the price. Charging more for less is a really really tough thing to pull off. I don't think the Grenadier is capable of that. LR just gave up that market entirely.

If they had priced the Grenadier close to the 76, which was the initial promise then this would be another paradigm entirely.

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The reality in Australia is that most of the population can drive just about everywhere they need to get to on bitumen or well-maintained unsealed roads in a Hilux. Neither a Defender nor a Grenadier is required to get places normally. Even a 76 is overkill, even for a farmer. A Grenadier like the classic Defender is now seen as a fashion statement driven by celebrity YouTube chefs and others for whom appearance is more important than application. Both are good for towing horse floats (but the new Defender is better).

https://youtu.be/_QpJAO_Ksao'si=IdJhcfRtWyTxVLtj

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Originally Posted by one_iota

The reality in Australia is that most of the population can drive just about everywhere they need to get to on bitumen or well-maintained unsealed roads in a Hilux. Neither a Defender nor a Grenadier is required to get places normally. Even a 76 is overkill, even for a farmer. A Grenadier like the classic Defender is now seen as a fashion statement driven by celebrity YouTube chefs and others for whom appearance is more important than application. Both are good for towing horse floats (but the new Defender is better).

https://youtu.be/_QpJAO_Ksao'si=IdJhcfRtWyTxVLtj

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Interestingly, the 76 is not very good offroad without some serious mods. I think a Hilux (just sticking with Toyota) is better offroad in most situations than a 79. You can get a lot more ground clearance and flex and ability from a 79 once it has longer coils and different leaf packs and 34 inch tyres but they typically build them up to be way too heavy and then that compromises them a little. I still like the 79 though. It's fairly honest, but I just don't see the value, especially second hand. Cheers

Oh look.. the perma sale continues at my local dealer. I see I can buy a GXL 70 wagon in auto for 85k DA. Still need to try harder Ineos

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To get a "76" anywhere near a Grenadier you would have to spend a fortune on it.

Which then equalises the cost proposition.

Had a 76 for a while and while it was great off road spent a fair bit getting it there.

Ronny Dahl did a comparison off both.

Took a test drive of a Grenadier over Easter & loved it.

Bought a smile to my face & my wife loved the seats & comfort.

Her opinion is more comfortable than our Defender.

Ended up buying a MY 24 Sela Green Trailmaster demonstrator (3000km) with some great options for very little more than new 76.

P300 110 with offroad pack, bullbar etc for sale soon.

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Originally Posted by chuck

To get a "76" anywhere near a Grenadier you would have to spend a fortune on it.

Which then equalises the cost proposition.

Had a 76 for a while and while it was great off road spent a fair bit getting it there.

Ronny Dahl did a comparison off both.

Took a test drive of a Grenadier over Easter & loved it.

Bought a smile to my face & my wife loved the seats & comfort.

Her opinion is more comfortable than our Defender.

Ended up buying a MY 24 Sela Green Trailmaster demonstrator (3000km) with some great options for very little more than new 76.

P300 110 with offroad pack, bullbar etc for sale soon.

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Nice mate. Congratulations. It's a Trialmaster. Cheers

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Originally Posted by chuck

To get a "76" anywhere near a Grenadier you would have to spend a fortune on it.

Which then equalises the cost proposition.

Had a 76 for a while and while it was great off road spent a fair bit getting it there.

Ronny Dahl did a comparison off both.

Took a test drive of a Grenadier over Easter & loved it.

Bought a smile to my face & my wife loved the seats & comfort.

Her opinion is more comfortable than our Defender.

Ended up buying a MY 24 Sela Green Trailmaster demonstrator (3000km) with some great options for very little more than new 76.

P300 110 with offroad pack, bullbar etc for sale soon.

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I sure don't doubt the Grenadier is a good car. If you can buy one for much the same as a 76 then you'd be crazy not to.

My issue with them is at launch they were promising prices which were very close to the 76, but then they did multiple price rises. At one point I plugged in a trialmaster with virtually no options and I was nudging 140k. Sure good luck with that.

Once they finished delivering the ones they had sold before the price rises sales must have stopped as they have been trying to walk it back ever since without actually biting the bullet and properly cutting them. They are trying all the tricks in the book to lower the price, without lowering the price. Constant sales for whatever excuse they can come up with. All sorts of free stuff. [bigwhistle]