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Thread: Ethiopian air lines flight goes down all killed

  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDNSW View Post
    Thanks again for your explanation Hugh. Reminds me of the one really serious in-flight emergency I have faced while PIC. (not including the Bonanza with electrical failure leading to hand-cranked gear extension!)

    This was flying a Grumman AA-5 from Lilydale to Dubbo - over The Rock it dropped a valve. My immediate thought was I'd lost a prop blade, but quickly realised the vibration was power dependent not rpm dependent, and I managed to stretch the glide to do a straight in landing at Wagga. Communications were not exactly top priority, especially since the panel was shaking so violently that changing channels was not feasible. Lesson - in a single, plan as high as possible - gives you more choice if the fan stops.
    Clear weather over the Kilmore Gap, I presume?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]



    Real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time. Sir Terry Pratchett

    2000 D2 TD5 Auto: Tins
    1994 D1 300TDi Manual: Dave
    1980 SIII Petrol Tray: Doris

  2. #122
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    Sydney
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    285
    Quote Originally Posted by johntins View Post
    Could you clear something up for me? I have read elsewhere that short and medium haul airliners do not have fuel dump capability at all. Only long haul. Is that true in all cases?
    Hi John,
    Itís more determined by the manufacturer/variant, I think, rather than a hard and fast rule.
    Age and cunning will ALWAYS overcome youth and skill.

  3. #123
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Bangkok
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    396
    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh Jars View Post
    Hi John,
    Itís more determined by the manufacturer/variant, I think, rather than a hard and fast rule.
    Hmm, pre-grey hair studies on this one! It is entirely a structural consideration, and SHOULD be determined during design and certification.
    As a general rule most narrow body types do not have a fuel dumping system.

    Not all planes are equipped with this sophisticated system, however. FAA spokesperson Alison Duquette says that narrow-body planes, like the Airbus A320 or the Boeing 757, aren't built with fuel dumping abilities. But larger, wide-body planes, like the Boeing 777 and 747, which have added tanks, can dump fuel. In fact, the FAA requires certain planes to have fuel jettison systems
    Also, before somebody wonders, the dumping is via a "standpipe" in the tanks that protrude well above the bottom of the tank, so not all the fuel can be inadvertently dumped.

  4. #124
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Central West NSW
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    Quote Originally Posted by johntins View Post
    Clear weather over the Kilmore Gap, I presume?
    This was thirty years or more ago, and I'm afraid I can't remember the weather in the Melbourne area. It is unlikely I would have flown via Kilmore from Lilydale though - except in low cloud conditions my first navigation point would have been Alexandra - flying VFR I tended to fly a great circle when possible. I remember the weather at The Rock - clear, and I was at 9,000ft.
    John

    JDNSW
    1986 110 County 3.9 diesel
    1970 2a 109 2.25 petrol

  5. #125
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDNSW View Post
    This was thirty years or more ago, and I'm afraid I can't remember the weather in the Melbourne area. It is unlikely I would have flown via Kilmore from Lilydale though - except in low cloud conditions my first navigation point would have been Alexandra - flying VFR I tended to fly a great circle when possible. I remember the weather at The Rock - clear, and I was at 9,000ft.
    Thanks. Flying north(ish) out of LIL would usually take you out over the Kilmore Gap, which isn't at Kilmore btw. A few aircraft have been lost by flying up the wrong path, mistaking the valleys. *VFR is the usual culprit*, combined with low cloud ceiling over the 'mountains'. LIL was my training area, and I was warned countless times. A ceiling of 1,500 is not uncommon. Nor is visibility up to the stars. 1,500, however, is a reason not to fly, but people still do.

    I regret that I didn't keep flying. It's an experience I will not forget. But I've never been good with money, and money is needed to fly.


    *I need to qualify. VFR isn't the culprit, it is how people make decisions based on it that is. I've heard pilots debating whether it's 'worth the risk' to fly out of LIL going north. Sometimes they find that it is. Sometimes they don't. I don't mean to describe the GDR north of Lilydale as some sort of local Bermuda triangle, but it is dangerous, mostly due to complacency. In recent years there haven't been many light aircraft losses there. Let's hope that trend continues.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]



    Real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time. Sir Terry Pratchett

    2000 D2 TD5 Auto: Tins
    1994 D1 300TDi Manual: Dave
    1980 SIII Petrol Tray: Doris

  6. #126
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Central West NSW
    Posts
    22,631
    I flew out of Lilydale for over twenty years, so I am quite familiar with the area. Normal route would be Glenburn gap if cloud prevented a direct route over the west flank of Mt St Leonard. On the other hand, I remember spending half a day on the ground at Mangalore (with about a dozen other planes, including an F-27), waiting for the fog to clear south of the ranges on my way back. On that occasion I did fly via Kilmore gap, as it lifted leaving a marginal gap under it.
    John

    JDNSW
    1986 110 County 3.9 diesel
    1970 2a 109 2.25 petrol

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