who are the 21 retailers?

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Originally Posted by KarlB

Every thing I have read on the issue point to it costing more to collect the GST than it would generate. That can only lead to less money for public hospitals and schools, not more.

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Yep, heard this old story many times, but the problem is that it is quite popular in most other countries like the USA, UK, France Canada, Germany, Norway and so on, but your saying they are all loosing money.

I don’t think so. This one liner is nothing more than a whinge from those not wanting a level playing field.

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Originally Posted by Fluids

... and in the final shakedown, the ONLY tax the gov' finally collects is 10% of the value of the final sale in the hands of the END USER. HN paid $2k tax at the time of import ... they collect $4k at the time of sale .... they remit the difference between what they collect, and what they paid ie:$2k .... the gov' gets its 10% / $4k tax. The retailer/supply chain pays no tax on the supply of the goods ... they pay tax on their profits.

VAT is value added tax, where the tax is added EVERY time the goods change hands ... without any tax being credited back ... so it's tax on tax on tax on tax on ... the GST system certainly is fairer. If there is 4 changes of ownership in the supply chain for an item in the UK, than tax gets charged 4x at the same %, but also an ever increasing $ value.

The US $ will eventually strengthen again, and our dollar will fall, and the advantage of buying OS will diminish .... then who's going to fund the new GST offshore collections division ? :p

MY GOD!! ... Government employee's might loose their jobs ! :eek:

;) :twisted::twisted::twisted:

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In the end thats it. Everyone is in a state of panic because the dollar is high and everyone seems to be buying overseas. It wont stay high forever and when it goes back down people might be inclined to buy in Aus. Coming up with this new tax system might work in the short term but what will happen when the Aussie dollar drops against the US$ again.

Don't ya'll loose sight of the fact that the supposed gst on overseas purchases is for END USER customers ... the final link in the supply chain ... who miss out on paying any tax on their purchases to the gov' .... duty free sub $1000.

... BUT the HN's of the world DO already pay import duty on all the product they import ... and import duty is a TAX ... if the importer then ALSO has to pay GST on the imported goods (and that would lead to a VAT style tax on tax on tax), guess what ? That becomes a COST of doing business and increases the products cost price ... which ultimatley would mean a price rise in YOUR hands ... the END USER.

Remember the proposal for an "Internet GST" is for END USER purchases from the internet/overseas ... the big guys already pay import duty (TAX) on all the import .... and GST is levied at the point of sale in the hands of the END USER. The supplier doesn't pay GST on ITEMS they subsequently resale/wholesale down the distribution chain. The GST is ultimatley transparent in the hands of the supply chain ... it's the END USER who pays the 10% to the gov' of the day.

The proposal is aimed directly at the likes of US who purchase from overseas ... not the reatil/import supply chain.

The BIG problem for Australian Retailers is as outlined earlier ... the cost of doing business is way too high ... rent, wages, super, workers comp', insurances, accountants fees, lease costs, vehicles, plant, equipment, IT, point of sale & shop fitout, warehousing, workshop consumables, uniforms, OH&S, fire control systems, alarm & security, electricity, phone, internet, first aid, etc, etc .... it goes on & on.

Anyone going into a business for themselves these days is a very brave person !

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Originally Posted by hook

I wonder if there is an alternative motive.
I have a laugh at their claim of job losses, .:angel:

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We lost the jobs because the importers (Gerry & his mates) figured they could buy it overseas cheaper, which in turn killed our manufacturing & service industries as they could no longer compete. SO it's their business model that killed Australian Industry and laid waste to a very large number of our jobs.

... so all those job seekers have now moved into the retail sector ... :angel: ... everybody's selling something !

Interesting thread as I have several friends who work at a HN store.

Ive seen their costs on some goods and their margins are good but not huge in the grand scheme of things.

Also puzzled as almost all electronics supplied through HN stores come from the Fujitsu/Samsung/Denon etc etc warehouses in Vic/NSW so not direct imports.

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Originally Posted by Slunnie

Would you support the notion of increasing the GST then - a much more efficient way to provide for all of this.

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This has nothing to do with whats being discussed in this thread.

As posted, just about every country I export to has some form of import and/or GST on goods imported into these countries.

These offshore sellers are making a profit from selling into Australia but contribute nothing to this country’s wealth.

Australian based retailer contribute to this countries wealth through a number of taxes, not just GST.

I pay GST, Income Tax, Company Tax, Super and so. All this benefits this country one way or another.

My taxes go towards this country’s wealth base which helps to employ other Australians, who also pay a number of taxes, again all contributing to this country’s wealth base

So why the hell should some offshore seller who is also benefiting from this country’s wealth, not have to put some of their profit back into the country, where they are making the profit from.

GST on ALL imported goods would do that.

No don’t get them to contribute to this country’s wealth, just help them steal our jobs, just as long as a few of you save a buck or two.

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Originally Posted by Tombie2

Also puzzled as almost all electronics supplied through HN stores come from the Fujitsu/Samsung/Denon etc etc warehouses in Vic/NSW so not direct imports.

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Excellent point and all helping to employ more Australians ( who will all be paying taxes ).

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Originally Posted by drivesafe

Again, I think the sooner these imports attract GST the better.

I don’t give a rats A why good old Gerry and his mates want it.

It's totally warranted. Most of you have used our public hospitals, GST pays for them.

You happily drive on our major highways and main roads, GST pays for them.

Your children and/or grand children attend public schools, GST pays for that too and many other thing, little things, like our armed forces and so on.

But what many of you are saying is as long as you save money and do other Australians out of a job, it’s all fine by you.

This is nothing more than sheer bloody minded selfishness and unfortunately a very common Australian trait.

We will all pay for these freebies eventually.

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Tim,
I for one have no issue paying gst even on imported items, but my main issue is with the blatant government misappropriation of revenue. If I could be sure that it was to be used on basic services such as infrastructure (to which QLD is seeing the lack of at present) and health and education I would have no issue, but the absolute **** that governments spend taxpayers money on at present makes me really doubt that. It would be just a bigger excuse to waste and squander money on projects of no real value.
As I have said most stuff I buy from os are smaller items under $1000 value and if items are only a bit dearer in Aust then I will buy here. What I do find shameful is there are a lot of businesses that dont seem to want customers.
I am a firm believer on supporting Aust business if they are playing fair and I know you for one do so. I know items I have bought from you I have seen in local stores at more than 500% over your prices and these are major chain stores, so what is their markuP/

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Originally Posted by drivesafe

This has nothing to do with whats being discussed in this thread.

As posted, just about every country I export to has some form of import and/or GST on goods imported into these countries.

These offshore sellers are making a profit from selling into Australia but contribute nothing to this country’s wealth.

Australian based retailer contribute to this countries wealth through a number of taxes, not just GST.

I pay GST, Income Tax, Company Tax, Super and so. All this benefits this country one way or another.

My taxes go towards this country’s wealth base which helps to employ other Australians, who also pay a number of taxes, again all contributing to this country’s wealth base

So why the hell should some offshore seller who is also benefiting from this country’s wealth, not have to put some of their profit back into the country, where they are making the profit from.

GST on ALL imported goods would do that.

No don’t get them to contribute to this country’s wealth, just help hem steal our jobs, just as long as a few of you save a buck or two.

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I was just seeing how genuinely you believed in you own arguement for GST to be imposed on imports due to it's benefits for public resources as opposed to just a genuine need to generate increased funding for public resources.

This said, if the prices from OS and Australia were comparable, then this discussion wouldn't be happening.

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Originally Posted by sashadidi

Yes the old rule at 50% markup.. buy in 12 items cost =to 8 items so you need to sell 8!!!!!!!! before you have paid your costs!!!, if you say only sell one of the remaining four (quite normal) at full profit and take 20% off the other 3 you are stuffed without factoring in any overheads
so had better hope you do not have say 12 series ones coils etc in which there is a extremely limited market (as a theoretical example )and you may have to hold the stock for years and if you are on a overdraft watch out !!! let alone pay wages, holiday pay, rent tax etc
Disclaimer I buy from overseas also but understand it"s not always clear cut as people make out

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Ok and that is a fair point, though businesses overseas also still have these costs and when an item is less than half price of an item in Australia delivered to your door something is not right and if that is what you call normal business and expect consumers to accept that well I am afraid it is time the business owner considers a different form of employment.
Ofcourse there are issues with wholesalers and volume costs. A good example of this is Coca-Cola, shops like take aways and delis can often buy it cheaper from Woolies than they can from a distributor and woolies are still making a profit. Things like that should be simplified by legislation that ensures all retailers can buy the same product fro the same price, irrelevant of volume the only variance should be freight. This would make a lot more business viable and profitable.