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All the guys I knew who were press ganged into the army in the 60's resented the interuption to their lives and most still consider that two years of their life was stolen from them.
Many of them used the term "reg" as in regular soldier as a term of derision, meaning a dumb person, someone who was stupid enough to volunteer to join.
I think you'll find the "aimless without not much direction" crowd are not the ones the pro-nasho debate want to be drafted. It's more the lawless youth...the 14 - 18 year olds getting ****ed and stoned on a Friday and Saturday night because of a dose of "mummy didn't cut my lunch right" blues - they are the ones they want to see straightened out. The problem is, those same youths get involved in low level street crime, and gravitate very quickly to bigger things. The broken windows theory needs to be implemented. Extinguish the small fires before they get bigger. You spit on the footpath, you get pinged.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ausfree
The Swiss have it sussed. Mandatory conscription. Once you are old enough to understand, you KNOW you will be entering the military, and will continue to be part of it throughout your life. Mind you, it helps being a neutral country :lol2:
Yes, it should be re-introduced.
And for those Bogans as they have been called, they need to have RESPECT and DISCIPLINE drilled into them.
Also when you have left school and dont have a full time job, its the nashos for you.
Would improve this country no end.
cheers
As opposed too....??????????? ummm...errr...;) ahh that's right, couldn't really call our political leaders politicians...:cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by Ausfree
Like that idea, and see how many of these dropouts would suddenly find full time employment.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian
And make voluntary but a case of No Nashos, No Dole
nope
the defence force doesn't have enough money as it is for the regs....dont get me started on chocko's 'reserves' as i reckon its a massive waste of money
why should the defence have to put up with the un-employeed, fair chance they wont want to be there.............can you imagine your work taking on the unemployed, training them, and teaching them respect and discipline and them off loading them...more than likely back on the jam roll
the army may teach you respect and discipline however..............i best not go there
i enjoyed my 9 years in the regs, enlisted, got a trade, had a ball, transferred while i was still enjoying it.........not sure i respected the person wearing the rank 'in most cases i didn't' and i failed on discipline 'within the army that is' and 23 years on i am still doing chocko's 'WOFTAM's'
i reckon i have turned out alright, i joined the army because i wanted a trade and a guaranteed job for nine years and a whole lot more if i wanted, i didn't join for the army stuff and two way ranges were not on my list of things to do......for the boys that deploy, i salute them
i doubt that i would ever have been in a position where i was out of work and forced into a job i didnt want to do
Maybe make a reality TV show instead...specifically of the kind that constitutes a historically derived social experiment based on the premise of subjecting today's delinquent individuals to the conditions of the Australian national service of the 1950s in order to see if this could rehabilitate them..........bugger, already been done :lol2:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PietA82qU08"]YouTube - Bad Lads Army: Private Woodend & His Beasting[/ame]
I was in the last ballot in 1972 and would you believe it, it is the only lottery I have ever won. I was studying Civil Engineering at the time and they deferred my enlistment for a few months while I finished my Course.
During that time I had a medical and as soon as I graduated I was going in.
At that time we were still sending our boys to Vietnam. Some didn't come home and some came home with real problems. The Country did not do much to look after them.
When you consider we did not even have the right to vote, but we could be drawn out of a barrel and sent to a conflict like Vietnam whilst our mates who were lucky enough to miss having their marbles drawn out enjoyed life as normal.
As it turned out I did not go because Gough Whitlam won the election and conscription was abolished.
Interestingly, my wife and I have since travelled to Vietnam for a holiday, and i took a lot of interest in the war history while over there. I can tell you that it was not very pleasant. We saw the tunnels at CuChi and to think our guys had to go down them and try and ferret out the VietCong is frightening. We saw some of the traps used by the Vietnamese as well.
We saw people who have been maimed by land mines in Cambodia. Land mines are the most hideous aspect of war I can think of. So many civilians are still being killed or badly injured by them even now.
If you ever reintroduced it, a fairer system would be needed. Perhaps everyone should do 12 months but not be made prop up the professional armed forces. There is no way you can substitute a National Service trainee for a regular.
Just my two cents worth.
Russ
Y'all are on drugs....just like the derros and drongos and mispent youth and bogans we are all talking about.
We are trying to RAISE the education standard of Soldiers, not lower it to accept societies dregs!
That and the fact that I am not a counsellor, not a child minder nor are we running an institution for naughty boys or unemployed young people.
The Military is a profession, not a community service.
That being said, I would have no problem if other professions had a similar scheme.....perhaps all unemployed should spend a year as a house painter (outdoors, plenty of time to contemplate life and of course refining ones patience). Or maybe all should be trained as mechanics (eye hand skills, oil appreciation and they get to behave whilst test driving your car).
On second thoughts, maybe it would have been better to have had conscripts assist with the floods. I am sure they would have had their minds right on the job! Particularly after knock off time when still working.
Sorry for my cynicism, but I have served through 2 or 3 various youth schemes in the Military over the past 28 years and the effort has far outweighed the gain in all cases, slurping scarce resources from the front line.
The army is no longer '3 hots and a cot', it is very much 'pay as you go'. You have to be able to manage your own affairs, find your own accomodation, manage a lease and rent schemes, budget for your own meal expenses, much as a civilian citizen, get yourself to work, on time, every time...the list goes on.
I also apologise to all the nashos, I hope you weren't scarred and I respect your contribution, but now is not the time. We need good quality volunteers, happy to put their lives on the line.
Rant over!
Cheers
Ralph
Hi weeds, I did the same thing.
When Whitlam did away with National Service in the early 70s, the Army did a huge advertising SCAM, tell you you could join the army and get a trade.
I like many hundreds of others joined up so, like you, I could get a trade. Being a train driver was great, but it wasn’t a trade you could take with you.
24 hours into rookie training and my platoon was in a Q & A session. One of the guys asked the officer “how long after basic training do we find out what trade apprenticeships we can do?”
The officer stated that “ unless you were doing an apprenticeship before you joined up, we were not eligible for an apprenticeship in the army.
You could have heard a pin drop.
Like most of the guys in my platoon, I had joined up to get one of the many trades being offered in the ads.
And like most of the guys in my platoon, my army career went down hill rapidly from that point.
Thanks to someone’s son in another platoon, who's father was a barrister, and did the army for false advertising, I and many others ended our army careers 7 months later, ( and in my case, with the help of some AWOL time ).
So the army was as bad as any other crooked institute at that time and my Point being, the army can be as bad as the bogans that need to do some time in the army..
Things have changed and while I would expect the REAL army could be maintained separately from the weekend warriors, I still think the modern army could easily be used to get dole bluggers on the straight and narrow and their dole money could be used to finance that part of the army.
BTW, to give you an idea of how ridiculous things were in the army in the mid 70s. I was stationed at Watsons Bay for a few months and at that time there were 14 privates and 34 Non Commissioned Officers. You reckon they weren’t short of solders?