The standard of P-plate drivers getting worse?

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Originally Posted by V8Ian

And if the vehicle or plates are stolen? If the police were banned from chasing runners, there would be far more runners. Fail to stop should attract a five year driving ban for the first offence instead of a slap on the wrist.

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Cause and effect Ian. Realistically, so what if the bike or plates were stolen. A pursuit at those speeds is unlikely to end well, if the person doing a runner was wanted or guilty of a major crime (running an RBT isn't) then fill your boots but remember that there is risk to all involved, including other road users.

Regarding pursuits, I believe that anecdotal evidence suggests that there has been an increase in the number of pursuits in the last couple of years. There is also a suggestion that there is a correlation between that and the 'hoon laws'. If someone is facing having their car impounded or crushed (the legalities of which are still being debated) then they are more likely to have a go at running. The result is that you have police command calling for tougher penalties for those who do a runner. It becomes a vicious circle.

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Originally Posted by Chops

The roads might be made for a good speed, but with bad attitudes and a lack of experience, most drivers can't handle it, let alone those on P plates.
And I say "most" because when you look closely at drivers in the city, their always abusing someone, road rage is starting to go berserk.

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Yep, and I believe that those who patently cannot or should not be driving should have their licence removed from them. They can take a taxi or public transport.

What you're forgetting is that in the vast majority of cases these ****tards are driving like idiots and putting everyone else on the road at risk anyway - That's how they generally attract our attention ;)

It's unfortunate that the position of police can't be changed.
By this I'm refering to how they get around doing their job.
They drive flash cars that any idiot can see for miles, which by the way makes for an excellent armed guard :D , cause it's the only time I know I'm not going to be cut off, all around will use a blinker, and they get off their phones. I was lucky to have this happen again on the way up last week, but what he didn't see was what was going on before he joined us.
My view,, get more police on the road,, in unmarked cars, even on bikes etc, but not in uniform. Then you can nab the ******* on the phones more, and if your driving around in peak periods, I believe you'll see more of what the "average" driver is doing wrong. Then maybe, with a few more fines etc, Mr Average will start to behave a bit better, and the ******* will start to sit up and take notice too.
I feel bad for the coppers, they get a hiding from us all, we always think we're hard done by, because generally we get nailed right after we've just been passed by some clown, "who's just got away with it" :mad:
But, you do the crime, you do the time. :angel: It's just too bad they can't always get their man.
And it still leaves us with the problems of juniors attitude.

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Originally Posted by Brian Hjelm

150 kmh may be in excess of the arbitrarily set speed limit, but I don't consider it fast. Subject to traffic volume, most of the Hume in Victoria can be safely driven faster than that....

....Remember, speed limits are arbitrarily set by bureaucrats, politicians, and police and mostly are set with no regard to the conditions.

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Refer my previous post:

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“I am the police, and I'm here to arrest you. You've broken the law. I did not write the law. I may disagree with the law; but I will enforce it. No matter how you plead, cajole, beg or attempt to stir my sympathy. Nothing you do will stop me from placing you in a steel cage with gray bars.

If you run away I will chase you. If you fight me I will fight back. If you shoot at me I will shoot back. By law I am unable to walk away. I am a consequence. I am the unpaid bill. I am fate with a badge and a gun.

Behind my badge is a heart like yours. I bleed, I think, I love, and yes I can be killed. And although I am but one man, I have thousands of brothers and sisters who are the same as me. They will lay down their lives for me and I them. We stand watch together. The thin-blue-line, protecting the prey from the predators, the good from the bad. We are the police.”

-End of Watch

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;)




The views expressed are my own and not those of my employer

Just a friendly reminder to everyone - do not turn this thread into a slanging match about the police.

There are quite a few serving and ex-police on this forum and by attacking the police, you are, ipso facto, attacking them. I have met nearly all of them and can say, without reservation, they are very nice people who would be welcome at my table or campfire any time.

Hmm, on second thoughts, I might exclude certain gun-buggy luvvin' South Aussies! :D

Only 'cos he is South Aussie, of course.

:wasntme:

When I was a p plater I did things that with 13 years of driving now I would not. I think this would be true of pretty much everyone. I loved cars, and driving, and while I knew e rules there were a few occasions where I drove out to remote roads (not hard considering where I grew up) to experience the handing limits of my car.

To me, there are two things at play - careless driving, and 'spirited' driving. They must be dealt with separately.

The driving test has little to no content about careless driving. Most drivers (of any age) have any idea about how to position their seat, or why it should be in a certain position. Nor do they know about the blind spots of their eyes, or how long it takes for an image to be seen and acted upon. I fact I would go so far as to say that most would not be able to answer these as well as being able to state how many metres it took their car/4x4 to stop in different conditions.

I am less concerned about a p plater darting in and out of traffic than I am of someone who is driving along with the seat too far back, who is thinking about an argument they had at work, and not properly checking their blind spots.

In a sense, driving with care is more important than having driving skill.. As superior judgement and skill will get you out of trouble before you need to use your superior skills.

Speaking of skills... I instantly lost interest in driving on the road in a 'spirited' manner when I joined a car club and did my first track day. A day of being thought how to drive, experiencing the handling limits, hearing the glorious inline 6 at max RPM down a straight and feeling the brake fade after hitting the anchors from 200 down to 60 as hard as you can, I simply had no interest in doing it on a road.

Every time I see a boy racer car being flogged down the road I get really sad that people these days just don't have access to the tracks that old generations did.. And every year the remaining ones are closing. It is a real tragedy.

The combination of this, and the current road safely message being about speed, booze and mobile phones (all of which are easily enforced with fines) has shaped the state of play.

Tl;dr the problem is larger than p platers, of course, but the real problem is that most p platers will follow the example of other road users and those who teach them.

I think that you suggestion, although doubling the cost of gaining ones privilage to drive on Australian roads is the greatest idea I have ever heard, bring'm back in after 6, 9 or 12 months restest them and if they fail they get to live in there reduced "P's" for another year. No of us were perfect in our younger days, I am self taught throwing an old Falcon ute around the clay pans out at the Lucas heights reactor, had a ball, did some damage, never hurt anyone but every one in our group could drive by the time we left school.
May I please point out one fact that is coming across very strongly here, cars don't kill but the person behind the wheel with the wrong attitude does. When I went for my B Double licence not only was I tested on my ability to drive one but the compnay employing us put us through an "APPITUDE" test to see that we had the correct "ATTITUDE" to deal with the other drivers around us.

I agree its the driver and not the car but modern buzz boxes handle and accelerate far better than any LJ Torry or TD cortina and i believe its too easy for them to just plant the foot at every opportunity , even an old ****box commodore outguns pretty much everything that was affordable when i started out driving.

I think that you're doing a good job Treads.