Thread: license to handle R22a refrigerant gas ?

Originally Posted by Ratel10mm

[snip]

My fellow fridgies are right in that you can change the oil in a hermetic system, however it's a lot more difficult. I have done it a few times, most memorably on a large order of Trane packaged units. It's a lot of work, & you may end up damaging the compressor beyond repair. I reckon it's a prohibitively expensive option in

It makes it much easier when the can has a sight glass

Originally Posted by scarry

Agreed,but we were doing many Govt. jobs and had their inspecters checking up on us,everything had to be documented.

We also had to drain the oil separaters on all systems that had them,and refill with the new oil.If this wasn't done,many systems took over 5(sump) oil changes to get less than 3%,which was specified.


[snip]

Now we all have the same challenge again,replacing R22......

Yep, still change out the oil sep in bad burnouts too.

PITA.

Seemed to get away without worrying about the sight-glasses and solenoids, only swapped out crank seals and never had any leaks.

I have a Terry PJ and a Bitzer IV here on a pub that another company 'converted' from R12 but I can't see where the seals have been changed

The rest of the systems are new, and I've already had several refrig leaks.
They've used bloody Leak-Lock on all the flare nuts but haven't done the bloody things up tight.
Also found every TXV feeler bulb on the wrong side of the equaliser line. (and the superheat not set, obviously)
They've lasted two years and I really can't say hand on heart the crank seals haven't been changed, but you can guarantee the call when it comes will be on a Friday night......



Which is better than another pub I went to about 80km away where the room was two years old and the feeler bulb had never been attached, it was still coiled above the power element.
The suction side of compressor was heavily iced up.

Fixed it up but the customer wouldn't believe there'd been a problem and I never did anymore work for them

Originally Posted by rick130

Many, many went through the same crap.

My TAFE certs weren't recognised by the ARC initially as they came from NSW and were from prior to 1990 even though they were the required modules for commercial/industrial a/c and refrig through the NSW TAFE system as required for the then apprenticeship programme to gain a full trades qualification
I'd been servicing, building and designing systems for years and contracted as a consultant on a couple of NSW Hospital AC jobs

When the ARC system came out it was all based on the Vic TAFE module and and course numbers. They didn't seem to recognise anything from other states, even though it was supposedly a National system.
Sheesh, I'm not that bloody old.

It was an absolute schemozzle.

I grew up in melbourne my apprenticeship and certificate were issued in Victoria

Originally Posted by northiam

I grew up in melbourne my apprenticeship and certificate were issued in Victoria

hahahaha.

Originally Posted by rick130

It makes it much easier when the can has a sight glass

No glasses on Trane beehives iirc. Had to tip 'em on the side to drain, chuck in the POE & swill around, drain, repeat as necessary.
I was impressed all the comp's survived.

Most of the tin cans we did oil changes on we measured the oil removed and refilled with the exact amount removed.Once the schrader was fitted,it was easy to do.Sure a level glass would be good,but in those days they were pretty rare in sealed units,not like today(maneuropes & the larger hermatiques come to mind)
We also had the tech data from the compresser manufacturer so checked oil quantity specs if we were concerned about quantity.You would be surprised how many cans we found with way less oil than correct and many with way to much.
Anyway,we had no failures at all,we always purged the domes with nitrogen while fitting the schraders.

As for oil separators,we always change them EVERY time we have a compresser failure,no matter why it failed.Cheap insurance.We also ALWAYS fit a glass in the oil return line,not like most,if not all manufacturers

Recently had a brand new Heldon oil separater fail on a brand new unit,luckily we went back the next day to check the plant.

Rick,some of the later Terry open drive compressers,1990 onwards had shaft seals that were compatable with POE oils.Don't know about Bitzers.Kellvies we always changed the seals,easy to do Just make sure you torque up the flywheel to the correct specs,don't use a shifter as i have seen some guys do

As for leaklock on flares,once i see that i know whoever did that had no idea what they were doing
A bit of oil is all that is needed on a good flare......and the correct torque

Originally Posted by scarry

[snip]

As for leaklock on flares,once i see that i know whoever did that had no idea what they were doing
A bit of oil is all that is needed on a good flare......and the correct torque

Yep, but geez it's common around here


I realise only a few cans have sight glasses, but they're the two makes I've mostly used for a very long time

Haven't used Trane for fifteen years, but I did find them very good with their tech support and warranty backup.
A couple of large industrial ice machines that I serviced used Trane cans and the systems weren't adequately designed for the hot gas defrost, but the Trane scrolls coped well.
Where they didn't cope was if you had a gas leak, the oil quantity in the sump was pretty minimal and as soon as you started to run short they'd start lifting the oil out of the sump and it didn't return fast enough.

I had a couple of US made Temprite oil seps fail a few years back too.
Luckily they were on a Temprite (Beer !) system that become a glycol system so it was found not long after I'd done a comp change and swapped the oil sep.

Didn't have much to do with Trane tin cans,but those Trane open drives love to continually trip on oil failure at the drop of a hat.Also their shaft seals hate a bit of copper coating,that destroys them quickly

Suppose i was brought up on a diet of Carrier opens,5H40's,60's,80's,126's,etc.
Also 6D29's,48's,75's,79's.
Now they were fantastic robust compressors

Same quality as the Kelvinator,T,K,Y,&H models.

Not like the Carrier O6E,it was a bit of a flop.....

On another note,i was looking at a couple of Trane air cooled chillers we have on a job.Total of 8 circuits,120KGs of R22 per circuit.That is well over $150000 plus GST worth of refrigerant at todays prices