Thread: The first defeat of the japanese on land in WW2

Originally Posted by 87County

Back to the Milne Bay battle - this was essentially concurrent with the Kokoda campaign.

The Japanese advance towards Port Moresby on the Kokoda Trail/Track faltered at reinforced defences at Imita Ridge (many books say "in sight of" Port Moresby but if you've been there you'll know that you cannot see Port Moresby from Imita Ridge).


The Wau-Salamaua campaign was a close run thing at times and is not nearly as well known about as Milne Bay or Kokoda but it was every bit as tough, drawn out and dangerous. Whether they would have been able to make it through is questionable but they were quite determined.

I believe they could the searchlights of the air defence, during a Japanese air raid. At least that is what one old digger told me. I have a number of books on the campaign, but two that stand out are; " the path of infinite sorrow, The Japanese on the Kokoda track," , [ in this book it says the Japanese could see the reflection of the sun off the water in the Gulf of Papua, from a peak on the Maguli range. Only 1500 of the 6,000 Jap. troops who set out on the campaign were fit enough to fight on, 6 weeks into the campaign. They were fighting, at first, just 2 Militia Battalions of the Australian Army. Poorly trained, and in the case of one, badly led. This Battalion was the one where one of the companies ran in panic, and was unfairly given a bad reputation. The Battalion more than made up for it during the Buna campaign, where, in an effort to restore their pride, the men made suicidal charges against dug in Japanese positions. Casualties were heavy, but pride restored. A horrible story of waste of life, but that's war , I guess.] by Craig Collie & Hajime Marutani ,


and " to the Bitter End The Japanese defeat at Buna & Gona 1942-43, Lex McCaulay.


It is interesting to see the Japanese version of the campaign. Bob

[QUOTE=bob10;2111108]Forget guadelcanal, forget the Chindits in Burma, the first defeat of the Japanese in the Pacific in WW2 was by the Australians at Milne Bay. Bob

I think its a massive effort from what was in essence a bunch of reserves it was the first time the imperial japanese army had ever been defeated. My great uncles were part 61st battalion which were very heavily involved in the attack on milne bay my farther who served in vietnam would tell me the stories about his uncles with great pride. The action that took place in PNG is very important as the threat of invasion was very real. captured japanese officers were found with printed japenese money that was made for use in australia thats how sure they were of invading us. but these aussie sappers with the help of a small number of yanks put a stop to that. more aussies are aware or battles in the middle east and north africa but this action that i think is the most important australia has ever seen as it was the first time the threat of invasion of australia so close to these shores largely gets ignorned. IMO this was australia at its absolute best and its these tough take no **** soldiers is why we are not speaking japenese. well done lads and those who died we owe so much.

It was a combined effort, Australian Army, RAAF, and some US Army engineers building the airstrips. Bob


Milne Bay - Battle for Australia - YouTube

[quote=disco man;2112084]

Originally Posted by bob10

Forget guadelcanal, forget the Chindits in Burma, the first defeat of the Japanese in the Pacific in WW2 was by the Australians at Milne Bay. Bob

I think its a massive effort from what was in essence a bunch of reserves it was the first time the imperial japanese army had ever been defeated. My great uncles were part 61st battalion which were very heavily involved in the attack on milne bay my farther who served in vietnam would tell me the stories about his uncles with great pride. The action that took place in PNG is very important as the threat of invasion was very real. captured japanese officers were found with printed japenese money that was made for use in australia thats how sure they were of invading us. but these aussie sappers with the help of a small number of yanks put a stop to that. more aussies are aware or battles in the middle east and north africa but this action that i think is the most important australia has ever seen as it was the first time the threat of invasion of australia so close to these shores largely gets ignorned. IMO this was australia at its absolute best and its these tough take no **** soldiers is why we are not speaking japenese. well done lads and those who died we owe so much.

Lest We Forget!!!!!!

[quote=disco man;2112084]

Originally Posted by bob10

japanese officers were found with printed japenese money that was made for use in australia thats how sure they were of invading us. is why we are not speaking japenese. well done lads and those who died we owe so much.

To quote Abe Lincoln "those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this."

Those that fought so heroically believed that they were defending Australia from invasion, they had no reason to think otherwise. However, captured documents after the war have shown that Japan had no plans to invade Australia. This does in no way detract from the feats of valour and endurance of our troops in Papua/New Guinea or Borneo, or depravations suffered but to now maintain the Japanese planned to invade Australia is, I'm afraid, simply an historical inaccuracy.

The Japanese produced Occupation Money in a variety of notes such as Guilders, Pesos, Dollars and Pounds. The Pound notes had in fact been produced by the Japanese for use in the British Islands of the Pacific Ocean (not including Australia) and adjacent seas, including New Guinea, rather than as part of a "planned occupation" of Australia.

Originally Posted by bob10

It was a combined effort, Australian Army, RAAF, and some US Army engineers building the airstrips. Bob.

Milne Bay is also remembered for a remarkable event that resulted from innovative co-operation between Aust Artillery units.


Milne Bay, at the time of the Japanese attack, was protected by 2 batteries (1 AIF, 1 Militia) of 40mm Bofors light anti-aircraft guns, 2 batteries (1 AIF, 1 Militia) of 3.7 inch heavy AA guns, and one battery (AIF) of 25pdr field guns. All the AA guns were tasked with static defence the airfields from air attack, while the 25pdrs were tasked with supporting the infantry with flexible, mobile defence against ground attack.


The 25pdr was an outstanding field gun with a range of 15 miles. Beyond "Line of Sight", the guns were aimed by a Forward Observation Post near the target providing corrections to fall of shot. Although able to be moved rapidly to new positions as required, the limited road network and the condition of those roads meant that the 25pdrs could be of little help during the phase of the battle when the Japanese were retreating back along the shores of the bay to their landing (now evacuation) sites.


The 3.7 inch AA gun was solely an anti aircraft gun that fired High Explosive or Shrapnel rounds to a maximum height of 41,000ft, and target aim and correction were normally provided by remote electric/gyroscopic Directors . However, the rounds also had a horizontal range of 24 miles, with progressively lower height limits. The Aust Army (and British Army) had no doctrine to use the 3.7 gun as anything other than an AA gun, and the majority of the Gunners had no experience or training in field gunnery, with aiming provided by Forward Observation.


It was recognised though by the more experienced gunners that the 3.7's superior range over the 25pdr could be of some use. By drawing up new Range Tables completely from scratch and using the No117 Fuzes from 25pdr ammunition in the 3.7 shells (most unorthodox, but possible due to common thread sizes), the 3.7's were able to continue engaging the Japanese for a distance well outside the range thought possible.


It was during this Japanese retreat that a 3.7inch AA gun from 2/9th HAA Bty engaged an armed Japanese landing craft that was evacuating Jap troops, at a range of over 20 miles, and sank it. This was the first recorded instance in Commonwealth Army (ie UK, Aus, Indian, Canadian, or NZ) Artillery history that an Anti-Aircraft gun, directed by an FO party, engaged and sank an enemy ship in combat.

I certainly completely agree that what happened in PNG deserves much more attention than it gets, without taking away from the importance of other fields of action.

Originally Posted by DiscoMick

I certainly completely agree that what happened in PNG deserves much more attention than it gets, without taking away from the importance of other fields of action.

There were a few of those, Bob



Far Flung Australians


http://www.ww2australia.gov.au/scrapiron/index.html


There are many more, no more nor less than sacrifices from other Nations, But our sacrifices. Bob


http://www.ww2australia.gov.au/raaf/index.html


http://www.ww2australia.gov.au/waratsea/index.html


http://www.ww2australia.gov.au/damascus/index.html