Big storm and no power in SA

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Originally Posted by superquag

What's the, um, current status of the TESLA battery powering South Australia ? Good / Bad / too early to tell ?
-( Yes, it WAS intended !)

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The Big Boofy Battery is doing quite well, thank you for asking. Being able to inject 100MW or more into the grid at the drop of a hat may have saved the day when a Victorian coal generator popped its breakers.

Tesla big battery outsmarts lumbering coal units after Loy Yang trips : RenewEconomy

It also makes good money by buying low and selling high, annoying the gas peakers who used to do all the exorbitant price rise jumps every time supply got a little tight. It also saves the grid money by doing frequency control for nothing, as it isn't contracted to do so it can't charge heaps for that as the usual operators do.

I suppose I should ask the question.
But for how long?
Suppose that Gladstone tripped its breakers also.

The battery looks like a valuable resource for short term frequency control, an unexpected benefit.

But the fact remains that without the coal base load it all falls apart very quickly.

It is still a case when the wind don't blow and the sun don't shine it will get very dark very quickly.
Regards Philip A

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Originally Posted by PhilipA

But the fact remains that without the coal base load it all falls apart very quickly.

It is still a case when the wind don't blow and the sun don't shine it will get very dark very quickly.
Regards Philip A

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Not really.

More big batteries will help, and when the air is still in one place its always blowing somewhere else.
Currently, the sources for the grid are constantly being switched anyway.
In NSW the current coal fired stations are positioned where theres coal, not where the load is, so installing wind turbines and solar plus batteries to take advantage of the weather and route it to the cities where its needed is no different.

I found it hilariously hypocritical when the Federal government that screams "let the markets decide" tried to heavily influence Macquarie Generation in NSW to upgrade at vast expense and continue burning coal when they'd decided Lidell power station in the Upper Hunter wasn't viable anymore and wanted to invest in renewables to match Lidells output as it was more cost effective!![emoji23][emoji23]

The bottom line is that governments of both colours from the last fifteen years are guilty of sitting on their hands when it's come to electricity supply nationwide.
It's got to the point of near failure/overload and all they can do is finger point.

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Originally Posted by PhilipA

I suppose I should ask the question.
But for how long?
Suppose that Gladstone tripped its breakers also.

The battery looks like a valuable resource for short term frequency control, an unexpected benefit.

But the fact remains that without the coal base load it all falls apart very quickly.

It is still a case when the wind don't blow and the sun don't shine it will get very dark very quickly.
Regards Philip A

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What would happen if Australia's coal power plants blew up all at once? Tiny but non zero chance there.

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...it will get very dark very quickly.

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Load shedding will occur, gas peakers will start up, wholesale prices will jump, all forms of storage will be called on, e.g. fuel, battery, hydro. Life would go on. For example, I wasn't prepared to wait for a 100% reliable grid to arrive so I added a lead acid battery to my house to keep the lights on, 20 years before all this wind and solar malarkey. And in the last year many thousands of Australian households and businesses have added battery capacity to their premises.

The Hornsdale Battery may be the first Big Boofy Battery in Australia, but it most definitely won't be the last. A half dozen or so are in the planning stages and within 2 years there will be many more as their speed and versatility are demonstrated. Just as it's ridiculous to suggest that all coal plants will be shut tomorrow, it's nonsense to expect the first battery to replace them all. The amount of time to transition to a coal free power grid may be an unknown, but it is nevertheless 100% inevitable judging by the recent spate of innovation in storage. Wind, solar and storage costs are still dropping, whereas coal remains much the same.

Spectacular falls for solar, wind and battery costs squeeze fossil fuels : RenewEconomy

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Originally Posted by Eevo

i'll believe it when i see it.

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Already happening.

One idea I have seen is that eventually every electricity sub-station will include a battery bank to be charged when there is cheap power and drawn on when there is a shortage or high prices. This will further stabilise the grid and moderate prices.

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Originally Posted by DiscoMick

Already happening.

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yeah no, prices keep going up.

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Originally Posted by Eevo

yeah no, retail prices keep going up.

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FTFY.

You've forgotten the foreign owned energy shifters again...

Just as a counterpoint I give a reference from WUWT about the recent extreme storm in the USA NE>
The only thing preventing blackouts and probably many freezing to death was the ramping up of coal, oil, and gas plants.

DOE: If it weren’t for coal-fired electricity plants, the Northeast would have blacked-out during recent bomb-cyclone | Watts Up With That?

Another example of fossil fuels saving the day is that during the recent extreme winter in UK , they had to import 2 shiploads of CNG from Russia to keep the gas for heating flowing. Very lucky those ships were available .

So what happens in OZ when we have a similar storm to the SA one , if all the fossil plants are gone?

Regards Philip A

Fossil plants won't disappear, but gas will replace coal.