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Thread: The real experience of a Tesla SUV

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    The real experience of a Tesla SUV

    I don't know how many subscribe to The Australian but last weekend they had a most amusing test of a Tesla SUV.
    The Weekend Australian Magazine, June 17-18, 2017
    Tesla Model X P100D review: Bill McKinnon
    Henry Ford was the great visionary car tsar of the 20th century. Tesla founder Elon Musk has inherited Ford’s mantle, as evidenced by Tesla’s share price. It has surged by 60 per cent this year in anticipation of the company’s first mass-market car – the Model 3, due next month, with prices starting at $US35,000.
    Mr Musk’s magical machines are the stuff of 21st century dreams, combining the two bright blue-sky automotive technologies – electric propulsion and autonomous driving – with Silicon Valley spin and the ultimate in corporate motherhood vision statements: We’re doing it for the planet. Tesla hasn’t turned a profit yet and currently holds 0.1 per cent of the US new car market; let’s not quibble about the details.
    But if you’re spending $306,232 – the on-road, optioned-up price of the Tesla Model X P100D we’re in today – details are important. We should look closely at them because there are a few holes in the Tesla story.
    The Model X is a big, heavy (2497kg) SUV, its styling signature a pair of vertically hinged rear doors – “Falcon Wing” doors in Tesla-speak. Five seats are standard; a seven seat option is $5800. As with any electric car, it’s actually a pretty simple machine, with only a fraction of the components of a conventional internal combustion drivetrain.




    An aluminium frame holds the liquid-cooled lithium-ion battery pack – a 100kWh unit in the P100D – with an electric motor at each end providing all-wheel drive via a single speed reduction gear. Suspension is conventional double wishbone front/multilink rear, with air springs permitting an adjustable ride height; the steering is variable ratio electric.
    Tesla claims its vehicles “have the hardware needed for full self-driving capability at a safety level substantially greater than that of a human driver”. This is misleading, because software and processing capability is what really does the driving and safe, reliable, fully autonomous vehicles, plus the billions of dollars worth of infrastructure needed to make them work, are at least several decades away.
    “Enhanced Autopilot”, Tesla’s latest semi-autonomous driving system, is a $7300 option. “Full Self Driving Capability” adds another $4400. Enhanced Autopilot is a waste of money because it doesn’t work properly. Tesla admits that it’s still in the beta testing phase. As for Full Self Driving Capability, Tesla’s disclaimer states that “functionality is dependent upon extensive software validation and regulatory approval, which may vary widely by jurisdiction”. It seems bizarre that Tesla is allowed to spruik and sell this technology, which has serious consequences for road safety if it goes wrong, while it’s still effectively in a prototype state, using its customers – and the rest of us who share the roads with them – to do the final validation.
    Around town, especially in traffic, Autopilot’s Autosteer function is erratic, unreliable and occasionally scary. The test car would not stay in its lane or negotiate corners in a predictable, safe manner, and at times the steering wheel seemed to forcefully resist attempts to maintain control. On the highway, Autosteer activation was often blocked because the road markings, barriers and other reference points used by its cameras, radar and ultrasonic sensors were insufficient, or indistinct, or the road was partly in shadow.




    On the M1 north of Sydney, radar cruise was hypersensitive to traffic in adjacent lanes, often applying the brakes when there was no reason to do so. This is dangerous.
    Tesla claims the Model X is the “safest, fastest, most capable sport utility vehicle in history”. One of these claims is true. This thing flies, especially in full power “Ludicrous” mode, where the P100D is claimed to hit 100km/h in 3.1 seconds, comparable with a Ferrari 488. Even in normal mode, acceleration is immediate and effortless. And how’s the serenity? Sublime.
    The Model X has not been crash tested by the US National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, Euro NCAP or ANCAP in Australia, so the “safest” claim is puffery. So is “most capable”. At what? Sure, for a 2.5-tonne lump the Model X is a taut, agile handler and it rides smoothly and comfortably, but there’s body flex on bumpy roads, it’s underbraked and, off-road, a Range Rover will leave it in the dust.
    Model X owners get a Tesla wall charger that can charge the battery at a claimed 81km of range per hour. Tesla claims the 100kW/h battery provides 565km of range, yet in any electric vehicle range depends on factors such as how you drive and ambient temperature. In ideal autumn weather I never got close to 565km. On several highway drives, the maximum achievable range was nearer to 350km.


    At Tesla’s free supercharger station north of Newcastle on the Pacific Highway it took 40 minutes to recharge the battery from 137km remaining to a claimed 488km of range, but after another 231km of driving I had only 118km left. It then took 48 hours on a 10 amp power point to recharge the battery to a claimed 548km of range, but I had to stop at the supercharger again on the return trip to Sydney after 220km because I wasn’t going to make the 388km distance. It took 50 minutes to recharge to a claimed 470km range. I then drove 168km to Sydney, where the display said I had 161km left.
    Our test car’s price includes $49,801 in luxury car tax. In the US and Europe, Tesla and other electric vehicle owners get thousands of dollars’ worth of incentives and rebates. Maybe if the Telsa ran on coal, Australian owners would get a few financial free kicks too?
    The Model X deal is “zero emissions”. This claim only flies if you recharge from renewable sources. The federal government’s Green Vehicle Guide lists its fuel life cycle CO2 emissions at 212g/km – almost three times those generated by BMW’s X5 40e petrol/electric hybrid – if the considerable amount of electricity it uses is generated by fossil fuels, including coal.
    Tesla proclaims the Model X is “the SUV uncompromised”. On the evidence of the test car’s misaligned panels, wide panel gaps, poorly fitted seals and trim and general lack of attention to detail in fit and finish, I would argue that the Model X is seriously compromised. In fact, by 2017 standards it’s not even production ready. It drives beautifully, but too much of the Model X’s reality does not correlate with Tesla’s spin.
    Tesla Model X P100D
    Engine:
    Twin synchronous AC electric motors/100kWh lithium-ion battery | Transmission: Single-speed automatic, all-wheel drive | Price: From $201,100 | Score: 2.5 out of 5

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    I can't say any of that surprises me.
    It's not broken. It's "Carbon Neutral".


    gone


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    Opps, wrong thread.
    If you don't like trucks, stop buying stuff.
    http://www.aulro.com/afvb/signaturepics/sigpic20865_1.gif

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    Saw one yesterday parked outside a school in the Northern Beaches.

    I'd rather a Discovery myself. Even the D5, ugly as it is, looks better than a Tesla.

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    Seems as there is a way to go yet.
    It's good that someone has looked into it from a real world point of view.
    Three times more polluting than a BMW X5 hybrid! Probably rather costly to run considering the rising electricity prices.
    And the autonomous features sound unworkable.
    I think I'll stick with my 1965 Mercedes for a while yet.

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    This is some more info that takes the gloss somewhat off the Tesla green credentials.

    From NyTeknik: h/t to Don Shaw (translated)
    Huge hopes have been tied to electric cars as the solution to automotive CO2 climate problem. But it turns out the the electric car batteries are eco-villains in the production process of creating them. Several tons of carbon dioxide has been emitted, even before the batteries leave the factory.
    IVL Swedish Environmental Research Institute was commissioned by the Swedish Transport Administration and the Swedish Energy Agency to investigate litium-ion batteries climate impact from a life cycle perspective. There are batteries designed for electric vehicles included in the study. The two authors Lisbeth Dahllöf and Mia Romare has done a meta-study that is reviewed and compiled existing studies.
    The report shows that the battery manufacturing leads to high emissions. For every kilowatt hour of storage capacity in the battery generated emissions of 150 to 200 kilos of carbon dioxide already in the factory. The researchers did not study individual brand batteries, how these were produced, or the electricity mix they use. But if we understand the great importance of the battery here is an example: Two common electric cars on the market, the Nissan Leaf and the Tesla Model S, the batteries about 30 kWh and 100 kWh.
    Even before buying the car emissions occurred, corresponding to approximately 5.3 tons and 17.5 tons of Carbon Dioxide. The numbers can be difficult to relate to. As a comparison, a trip for one person round trip from Stockholm to New York by air causes the release of more than 600 kilograms of carbon dioxide, according to the UN organization ICAO calculation.
    Another conclusion of the study is that about half the emissions arising from the production of raw materials and half the production of the battery factory. The mining accounts for only a small proportion of between 10-20 percent.
    The calculation is based on the assumption that the electricity mix used in the battery factory consists of more than half of the fossil fuels. In Sweden, the power production is mainly of fossil-nuclear and hydropower why lower emissions had been achieved.
    The study also concluded that emissions grow almost linearly with the size of the battery, even if it is pinched by the data in that field. It means that a battery of the Tesla-size contributes more than three times as much emissions as the Nissan Leaf size. It is a result that surprised Mia Romare

    Regards Philip A

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    Plug in recharging is always going to be an option but that all it will be. To be usable we are going to have to have electric vehicles that are ready to go in a few minutes rather than a few hours - this can only be done with standard size basic batteries - more power from multiple battery packs.

    You arrive in a garage - current charge in the batteries is determined - the batteries are automatically removed and fully charged batteries installed - all in a few minutes - the new charge level is measured and you are charged accordingly - including all the associated fees and taxes etc.

    This is the only way that it will work for the general driving public. For sure recharging at home will work at home when you are just driving locally but not for anything else.

    Electric cars need to be standardised as far as battery fit an change over is concerned.

    Garry

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    The thing that Teslas are especially good at is removing nitrogen oxide/particulate pollution from urban districts. These things will be in high demand for the school run where traditionally the vehicle of choice is a large diesel 4WD, usually barely up to operating temperature before turning up outside of a footpath full of kids. Professional parents love their techno toys. And because they're expensive, owners are more likely to have large amounts of solar panels to offset their consumption. And techno toys don't have to be perfect to be in high demand, just trendy. No sign yet of Tesla's pre-order list shrinking appreciably.

    Soon many vehicle manufacturers will be offering smaller simpler electric cars with less bells and whistles and these will make even more sense within a city environment. VW's e-Golf is one model that has been quietly gaining in capacity in some northern hemisphere markets. I reckon I could handle owning one for the missus to do her shopping with, short range and all. She rarely strays more than 60km from home these days so range isn't an issue just as recharge time isn't either.

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    Soon many vehicle manufacturers will be offering smaller simpler electric cars with less bells and whistles and these will make even more sense within a city environment.
    So you reckon that the school run drivers will feel "safe" in a small electric car?

    That could explain all the Priuses that are sold or the UP!s or the Suzuki tiny Indian things.

    The new Volvo wagon is a Nissan Patrol, Jeep Grand Cherokee, or some other hulking giant. You should see the Rooty Hill football centre on a Saturday and you will see what the mums like.

    The reason they have small cars in Europe is they are cheap to run with swingeing taxes on big cars.

    That does not exist in OZ and is unlikely to.

    Regards Philip A

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    Quote Originally Posted by PhilipA View Post
    So you reckon that the school run drivers will feel "safe" in a small electric car?
    I said nothing of the sort. Commuters and old people on the other hand will flock to them in droves. I know what the locals around here drive and there are plenty of small cars in the mix. People still don't believe what I used to convert to LPG a few years ago, anything above 1 litre engine capacity was fair game. I could even see a small e-car being towed behind the behemoths the grey nomads trundle about in. Charge them off the caravan power sockets and troll around the town and save the lumpy thing for between towns.

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