Thread: Holden - how long before the end?

Originally Posted by rammypluge

A hallmark of the commodore was rwd, and now that has changed, which may play a role in the future viability of the company.

If the future viability of the company is dependent on the sales of a few RWD hotrods then they are is serious Do-Do. They need to sell thousands of cars to the masses and fleets all of which either don't know or don't care which end of the stick is controlling the show.

Originally Posted by pop058

If the future viability of the company is dependent on the sales of a few RWD hotrods then they are is serious Do-Do. They need to sell thousands of cars to the masses and fleets all of which either don't know or don't care which end of the stick is controlling the show.

It's not just the hot rods.
It's the larger family sedans. These have gradually been replaced by the SUV type vehicle.
The average family now has a choice between a 4cyl buzz box and a large gas guzzling behemoth. Nothing in between unless you want a BMW or a Merc.

Bring back the Commodore and the Falcon.

Originally Posted by Mick_Marsh

It's not just the hot rods.
It's the larger family sedans. These have gradually been replaced by the SUV type vehicle.
The average family now has a choice between a 4cyl buzz box and a large gas guzzling behemoth. Nothing in between unless you want a BMW or a Merc.

Bring back the Commodore and the Falcon.

I do not believe there is a market in Oz for "large family sedans" anymore. As you said, this is being serviced by "SUVs" ( a term I detest).

On your other point, if given the choice of a new Falcon, Commodore, BMW or Merc, I think the Oz buyer has already made that decision and as a result we don't have a local car manufacturing industry anymore.

Originally Posted by rammypluge

A hallmark of the commodore was rwd, and now that has changed, which may play a role in the future viability of the company.

But why have RWD Commode sales tanked since the glory days of the VT, in 1998? Could it be that the vast percentage of Commode buyers don't give a stuff what sort of drive axles a car has? The tiny percentage of buyers looking for tyre smoke from the optional monster Chev V8 engines can't support the local manufacture of an obsolete product. Holdens couldn't even carry over the Crewman 4WD ute into the VE line.

RWD makes a lot of sense if you want a multipurpose inexpensive vehicle. It can tow. The more the boot is loaded, the more traction it has (and needs). It has excellent fundamental dynamics (although please dont hang the engine out of the front of the car aka E series falcons). It is lighter, cheaper and more fuel efficient than its next best competitor, rear biased all wheel drive.

Yes, a territory with rear biased awd and more weight is better at towing and particularly pulling a boat up a boat ramp. So if you need that, go for that.

The falcon in particular in my view but also the commodore were optimised for australian conditions. They had gearing, aerodynamics, engine choice and tuning well suited to long distance high (ish) speed driving.

Falcons often had suspension and an underbody well suited to driving dirt and rough roads often found in australia. If you live in a rural area and dont have one, why not? Subarus are just not in the running.

rwd = mad skids

Originally Posted by pop058

I do not believe there is a market in Oz for "large family sedans" anymore. As you said, this is being serviced by "SUVs" ( a term I detest).

On your other point, if given the choice of a new Falcon, Commodore, BMW or Merc, I think the Oz buyer has already made that decision and as a result we don't have a local car manufacturing industry anymore.

Quite. Everything a RWD "large family sedan" could do can be done better by a soft roader, mid size FWD sedan or mini van. Shortening, narrowing and raising the family car yet keeping interior room is facilitated by not having a whomping great transmission tunnel down the middle. It all started with the Austin 1800 way back in the 60's, pity the fact that the drive technology wasn't quite there yet.

Originally Posted by bee utey

Holdens couldn't even carry over the Crewman 4WD ute into the VE line.

If they improved the rear seat accomodation and put a turbodiesel in it i cant help thinking it would have been sufficiently popular.