Thread: Free Wheeling Hubs

Free wheel hubs were unheard of for perhaps the first ten years of Series production. They gradually appeared (in this country anyway) in the 1960s, and tended to be pushed by dealers, as they made more money from selling extras. As far as I know, they were never actually fitted by the manufacturer, although they did appear in the optional equipment lists and hence in owner manuals by Series 3 production.

I can't think of any fleet owners who used them, certainly not the Australian Army or SMHEA as examples.

Ive always considered FWH to be a total con job & marketing excersise by aftermarket, the damage done to railkos , diffs , UJ's & propshaft splines far outweigh their usefulness . Damage done by not occasionally locking them and thus providing lubrication to moving parts & the prop shaft spline moving without rotating & thus wearing unevenly, the top half of the diff crown wheel rusting from condensation, etc.

I even considered any perceived Fuel savings to be placebo effect.

However , I now have a series LandRover that is powered 100% by electricity & any efficiency gains can be measured & much more obvious than from an inefficient petrol engine (by comparison)

So I pondered the issue & machined out a flogged set of drive flanges & fitted up front so that there was no spline . DIY FWH if you like, but unlockable) The performance gain is immediate , Less noise , less vibration, & easily 10% more battery range per charge, So I Eat my words, & apologies to those that I spruked my vehement opposition to FWH use in the past.

Originally Posted by goingbush

Ive always considered FWH to be a total con job & marketing excersise by aftermarket, the damage done to railkos , diffs , UJ's & propshaft splines far outweigh their usefulness . Damage done by not occasionally locking them and thus providing lubrication to moving parts & the prop shaft spline moving without rotating & thus wearing unevenly, the top half of the diff crown wheel rusting from condensation, etc.

I even considered any perceived Fuel savings to be placebo effect.

However , I now have a series LandRover that is powered 100% by electricity & any efficiency gains can be measured & much more obvious than from an inefficient petrol engine (by comparison)

So I pondered the issue & machined out a flogged set of drive flanges & fitted up front so that there was no spline . DIY FWH if you like, but unlockable) The performance gain is immediate , Less noise , less vibration, & easily 10% more battery range per charge, So I Eat my words, & apologies to those that I spruked my vehement opposition to FWH use in the past.

Pretty handy when you have a worn front driveshaft spline. Stops it shaking the car apart on the highway.
But yes you have to remember to engage them regularly.
I know, I should replace the shaft. One day.......
Terry

Originally Posted by goingbush

Ive always considered FWH to be a total con job & marketing excersise by aftermarket, the damage done to railkos , diffs , UJ's & propshaft splines far outweigh their usefulness . Damage done by not occasionally locking them and thus providing lubrication to moving parts & the prop shaft spline moving without rotating & thus wearing unevenly, the top half of the diff crown wheel rusting from condensation, etc.

I even considered any perceived Fuel savings to be placebo effect.

However , I now have a series LandRover that is powered 100% by electricity & any efficiency gains can be measured & much more obvious than from an inefficient petrol engine (by comparison)

So I pondered the issue & machined out a flogged set of drive flanges & fitted up front so that there was no spline . DIY FWH if you like, but unlockable) The performance gain is immediate , Less noise , less vibration, & easily 10% more battery range per charge, So I Eat my words, & apologies to those that I spruked my vehement opposition to FWH use in the past.

Interesting! I tried to measure difference in fuel consumption, but as you know, there are so many variables that it is hard to come up with figures you can be sure mean anything. A lot of the variables still apply to your electric vehicle (wind, temperature, tyre pressure, driving style differences etc) so an extended test would be necessary to confirm the difference. You would also have to ensure that there is no non-standard drag in the front drive chain, such as excess bearing preload or a bent axle housing etc.

Originally Posted by JDNSW

Interesting! I tried to measure difference in fuel consumption, but as you know, there are so many variables that it is hard to come up with figures you can be sure mean anything. A lot of the variables still apply to your electric vehicle (wind, temperature, tyre pressure, driving style differences etc) so an extended test would be necessary to confirm the difference. You would also have to ensure that there is no non-standard drag in the front drive chain, such as excess bearing preload or a bent axle housing etc.

John, very true, as you say I could have a dicky front end, but it does feel nice and free when I turn the prop by hand. To substantiate my findings I'd have to substitute the front axle with another unit.

So yes, I am basing my findings on empirical data only relevant to my vehicle, I can directly view a display readout of my Power consumption and current being used rather than just bum in seat, For $1000 I can buy a data logging display that outputs a graph of various data , sort of like a inbuilt dyno, but thats would have to take a fair chunk of realestate of the series dash, I'll stick with the little 3.5" Zeva BMS screen is not so obvious (when its off)

When I switch to Eco Mode the current draw is limited in programming to not exceed 150Amps & at full throttle . Without FWH maximum Eco Mode speed in top gear is usually about 70kmh , ( dependant on wind , road surface etc ) , a couple of runs today with my DIY unlocked hubs 75kmh -80 kmh in Eco mode full throttle on the same section of highway.

On the basis of that Ive taken a punt & ordered some AVM 24spline hubs, which I'll need to do some machine work on to make fit as the half shaft setup is different on a Lightweight.

the BMS display

Originally Posted by goingbush

John, very true, as you say I could have a dicky front end, but it does feel nice and free when I turn the prop by hand. To substantiate my findings I'd have to substitute the front axle with another unit.

So yes, I am basing my findings on empirical data only relevant to my vehicle, I can directly view a display readout of my Power consumption and current being used rather than just bum in seat, For $1000 I can buy a data logging display that outputs a graph of various data , sort of like a inbuilt dyno, but thats would have to take a fair chunk of realestate of the series dash, I'll stick with the little 3.5" Zeva BMS screen is not so obvious (when its off)

When I switch to Eco Mode the current draw is limited in programming to not exceed 150Amps & at full throttle . Without FWH maximum Eco Mode speed in top gear is usually about 70kmh , ( dependant on wind , road surface etc ) , a couple of runs today with my DIY unlocked hubs 75kmh -80 kmh in Eco mode full throttle on the same section of highway.

On the basis of that Ive taken a punt & ordered some AVM 24spline hubs, which I'll need to do some machine work on to make fit as the half shaft setup is different on a Lightweight.

the BMS display

Maybe a diesel engine won't mind the additional dragging of a connected axle?

I think engine characteristics plays a role here

Good point. The electric drive system is not going to vary significantly in efficiency over a very wide range of power settings. But a diesel, and even more, a petrol engine, varies quite widely in efficiency for even small variations in power settings, and these changes in efficiency may well mask small gains in drive train efficiency when looking at fuel consumption.

Martin & John , you guys hit the nail on the Head .

Ive never noticed any difference with FWH before & any gains really were placebo effect , because the inefficiencies of the Internal Combustion & masked the FWH benefits.