That whole post is challenging for those that can actually speak English.Quote:
Originally Posted by DiscoMick
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That whole post is challenging for those that can actually speak English.Quote:
Originally Posted by DiscoMick
I think the lack of use and incorrect use of the semi-colon stems from our educators not knowing the correct usage for them. Well at least my teachers never taught me what they were or how to use them. They can be a very effective tool when used correctly. However, I feel that maybe this is yet another redundancy creeping into our language.
I guess, when we are thinking about these language things, we should keep in mind that there is 2 versions of english. You have the daily used, common english if you like, the stuff we are using now and we see all day long. Then there is the (and i can't remember the correct term for it) legal english or university style english I guess you could call it. Very different use of the language, to the extent that if you're not practised in it then it's a struggle to understand!
While we are at it! I hate the dropping of practise! I've had educators tell me it's redundant and "we just use Practice" well, my friends it's a different word! Lets use it correctly; it's the principal of the thing ;)
P.S. why can't we make "you are not", into you'rn't ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by debruiser
You omitted the 3rd version, ie. Microsoft (Yank speak) That one really shags up the English Language.
:bat:
Actually, there are many versions of English.
For a start, there are regional dialects, for example, US English, British English, Australian English, Indian English. These differ in vocabulary, pronunciation, spelling, and quite often more sbtly in common expressions and idioms. And within these regional dialects there are further regional variations, much less pronounced here in Australia than in some other regions such as the US or UK.
But as well as these variations, there are, within each dialect, a wide range of specialised variants, which are linked to specific groups within society, often occupations or sports etc, and often crossing between dialects.
And then for all these variants of English, there are variants in the way each dialect is used, according to the situation. For example, spoken English, written English, Telegraphese, Textspeak, etc, and even within these there are variations according to circumstances.
As an example, in spoken Australian English, the words and structure used would be quite different between supporting your team from the sidelines, giving the eulogy at a funeral, or giving evidence in court. Similarly, written English will be very different if writing a letter to a friend, writing a job application, or writing a scientific paper.
In some of these situations adherence to accepted rules of standard English (for the dialect you are using) are important (e.g. the scientific paper, a job application) and for others much less so, although for most people it is good practice to endeavour to always adhere to the rules, so that it is easy to ensure that you do in those cases where it really does matter!
isn't that what i said :P
Interestingly, there are also many words and expressions in many languages other than English, for which there are no satisfactory translations in English.
If only the Australian education system valued multi-lingual education more highly, I’d be able to recite many and we’d all have much bigger vocabularies and a more interesting perspective on our culturally diverse world.
An example is: gemütlich. A German word with the approximate but entirely inadequate English meaning of a cosy, comfortable, welcoming feeling.
No apostrophes needed this time, but there is an umlaut, which is equally indispensable.
Slowly accumulating some German, Italian, French, is no substitute for real linguistic diversity, so against the odds I now intend to learn more languages into my later life. Hopefully an old fella can learn some new tricks! :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeros
I agree somewhat with you, but didn't you just list 3 words that mean similar things? I'm sure that those 3 words have pretty specific meanings themselves. If we pulled a thesaurus out I'm sure we could find more. English is a ridiculously precise language which makes it stupidly hard to learn properly (and I am by NO means any good at it).
In saying that yes sometimes another language can succinctly sum up what you want to say in one word rather than a whole sentence.
Exactly. Often more elegantly too. Just as English words can also at times be more direct. I’m advocating for the coexistence of diverse languages, not whether any one language is better than another. If I could speak three languages fluently I might interchange words between all three depending on the circumstance. English becoming the world language is a simplistic and reductive state of affairs.Quote:
Originally Posted by debruiser
But one that has plenty of historical precedent, although not historically for the whole world, due to poorer communications.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeros
Some of the early examples are where Aramaic displaced most languages in the Middle East, largely being succeeded by Greek, and later Arabic and Turkish. Further west Latin displaced most other languages and became the "world language" for the Western world, only to be largely displaced by French. Further east Mandarin became dominant, and Malay further south, although South and southeastern Asia never gained a common language to the extent that occurred in Europe. Northern Asia had most local languages replaced by Russian.
In the Americas, all local languages were largely replaced by English, Spanish and Portuguese. In the British Isles, English was almost completely universal by the mid twentieth century, and the worldwide british Empire spread the language worldwide.
Today, the economic and political dominance of the USA, building on top of the language legacy of the British Empire, has meant that ability in English has become a key to personal advancement in almost every country in the world. It is possible that this may be challenged by Mandarin in the future, but I would not bet on it.
Whether the increasing dominance of English, that I have observed during my lifetime, continues, largely depends on what happens in world politics rather than anything to do with education or what governments want!
Oh let's all be pedantic :-)
That should be "i.e. Microsoft" (with a full stop after the "i") as it is an abbreviation for the Latin "id est".Quote:
Originally Posted by 4bee
Mike