Goodnight Diesel. ...Land Rover get your EV skates on!

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Originally Posted by donh54

I agree the march of EVs' appears to be an almost irresistible force, but I would like to see it "hasten slowly"

One thing I see as a possibility of this happening too quickly, is the creation of a whole "underclass" of people who cannot afford to go EV.

$5K (with Govt subsidies) to put a minimal solar setup on your house; Probably barely able to run the household, let alone adding an EV;
$20K for a powerwall-type setup;
$???K to wire it all in;
$40K + for an EV; Also needs to allow for the massive depreciation and drop in trade-in value of the existing ICE vehicle;

That's supposing you own your own home. How many renters are going to set all this up? Very few, I'd imagine. Any landlord who does, will obviously want to recoup the cost via increased rent.

Is it going to end up like tobacco? No ICE vehicles allowed in carparks, or within 10 metres of doorways? Or in transit tunnels? Or anywhere else that their noxious fumes may inconvenience people?

Just a bit of "Devils' Advocacy" [biggrin]

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ICE vehicles, like smoking, will linger around open spaces for decades. Where they are banned people will just have to park outside and take public transport, or get in an Uber.

Some people will go through life and never once buy a new car. Most poor people will see second hand EV's become affordable as new whizz bang models come out and attract the new car buyer. Sure, it'll take 20 years to whittle away 90% of the ICE fleet but it'll happen. It's like Power Kero or LPG, one has declined to zero and the other is well on the way.

I'm someone who has never hankered after a new car for various reasons, not that I couldn't afford one. I just saw no point in having a depreciating asset when I could own one at the bottom of the curve, which I could maintain myself. My current ride is a 24yo car that cost $95K when new, now worth at most $3K. And if I really wanted an EV to potter to the local shops or to the city centre tomorrow, I looked on Gumtree and found a bunch of first gen Leafs for under $10K.

Nothing much will stop the avalanche. [bigsmile1]

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Originally Posted by Zeros

How long would it take to charge an EV on a standard three-phase outlet? and how many kwh would fill a Tesla battery for example?

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Long enough to have a decent sit down meal then push out all the dents from skippy strikes... [bigrolf]

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Originally Posted by Zeros

Yes it is happening...However the maps show the majority of major central and northern Australia roadhouses have either a standard plug in facility or 3-phase - eg $0.44 per kwh. Not many have dedicated rapid chargers.

How long would it take to charge an EV on a standard three-phase outlet? and how many kwh would fill a Tesla battery for example?

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Tesla Charging Options for Australia

NB, Charge rates are km per hour , slightly confusing, means the amount of km range added per hour of charging

So is this correct? Currently most of the non-super chargers are 3-Phase at 55km/hr charging... So a 550km charge = 10hrs!

Hmm so the real question is when will there be Superchargers at every roadhouse?

The Tesla Supercharger map is not so convincing (yet). Price for supercharge = $0.35 per kWh
Find Us | Tesla Australia

But then that will change rapidly once 4x4 EV vehicles become more common after 2020.

Current charge price at a random remote roadhouse in WA for 3-phase charge is $0.44 kWh. Would require an overnight stay.

Plenty of people spend more than $40k on a vehicle so nothing will change there.
Recharging times vary from 80% in a hour depending on setup.
Drive 300 Ks to somewhere, stop for lunch and a recharge, drive some more, stop for the night, recharge overnight. All doable.

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Originally Posted by DiscoMick

Plenty of people spend more than $40k on a vehicle so nothing will change there.
Recharging times vary from 80% in a hour depending on setup.
Drive 300 Ks to somewhere, stop for lunch and a recharge, drive some more, stop for the night, recharge overnight. All doable.

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It will kill the free bush camps and extended overland trips for a while, until batteries can hold a big charge. Or the camper trailer can I guess.

Oh well get your roadtrip freedom while you can! All the more reason to hit the road sooner!

I can't imagine anything worse than having to plan to stay overnight at a charging station all the time! The 'chargers' will also upload all your conversations in the car, update your onboard apps, upload all your 360 view camera imagery for the day, give you a fine if you were speeding, critique what you had for lunch, tell you to buy a coffee at the roadhouse, ask you if you want fries with that, monitor your every move!

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Originally Posted by Zeros

It will kill the free bush camps and extended overland trips for a while, until batteries can hold a big charge. Or the camper trailer can I guess.

Oh well get your roadtrip freedom while you can! All the more reason to hit the road sooner!

I can't imagine anything worse than having to plan to stay overnight at a charging station all the time! The 'chargers' will also upload all your conversations in the car, update your onboard apps, upload all your 360 view camera imagery for the day, give you a fine if you were speeding, critique what you had for lunch, tell you to buy a coffee at the roadhouse, ask you if you want fries with that, monitor your every move!

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If you're not in a hurry put solar panels on your van and/or camper. A low tech approach:

Men driving solar-powered van to South America in race against winter | CBC News

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Originally Posted by bee utey

If you're not in a hurry put solar panels on your van and/or camper. A low tech approach:

Men driving solar-powered van to South America in race against winter | CBC News

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Yes it can be done for sure... 100km solar charge a day is not too bad. Solar is definitely the way of the future as it becomes more efficient. Once that happens, free fuel overland travel will be amazing! [thumbsupbig]

Solar paint has potential if they can make it work.

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Drive 300 Ks to somewhere, stop for lunch and a recharge, drive some more, stop for the night, recharge overnight. All doable

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Er , what if there is already somebody there?
in your brave new world everyone will have an EV.

re Supercharging How big a gennie will roadhouses have to install to have Supercharging and how will it be funded?
One takes 120Kw at 240 V (US 3 phase) so about 120KVA or 60?at 480V 3 phase, but how many will do that?
I think that is a serious size of generator and remember has to be on top of lighting,aircon etc.
Regards Philip A