Petrol VS diesel?

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Originally Posted by JDNSW

Might be worth a reminder that until about 20 years ago NSW limited the speed of all trailers over 750kg to 80kph - a nice little earner from interstate visitors! And NSW still has no problem with L and P drivers being restricted to 90, even on busy two lane roads with few overtaking opportunities and a speed of 110. So you are going to get a lot of vehicles travelling below the speed limit anyway, quite apart from those who just want to travel slower, and, of course, the ones that cannot travel anywhere near the speed limit, such as a lot of machinery, some overdimension loads, etc.

The speed limit is a limit, not a target.

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I get the P platers being restricted, also get that trucks are speed limited to 100kmph.

No problem with both those 2 points, my problem however is that if you're doing 20kms below the posted limit because your scared that your vehcile is unstable towing 3 ton or more at 100kmph or the limit for that matter then you need to consider updating that mu-x, trition, prado, ranger, everest, dmax, etc and upgrade to a vehcile that can comfortably with no concern ie yank tank, y62, range rover, 200 series (assuming they've remapped the transmission to lock up the torque converter).

I'm of the belief that a light 2 ton dual cab or medium size SUV towing 3 ton or more is not only dangerous but stupid. To tow that sort of weight the tow vehicle should really weigh more than 2.5 ton or more. It's simple; the heavier the prime mover (tow vehicle) the safer it's going to be to pull a similar size load. E.g. a y62 will be a safer tow vehicle than a mux towing 3 ton!

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Originally Posted by trout1105

We are Not living in the US (Thankfully) and once on the open highway you can travel at whatever speed you like without getting into strife with the constabulary (up to But Below) the posted limit Unless you are "Deliberately" impeding the flow of traffic.
In WA if you are towing ANYTHING, in a truck or a bus the speed limit is 100kph So even by your odd standards 80kph IS acceptable.

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My odd standards? I’ve been charged for impeding the flow of traffic - I was doing 125km/h at the time.

You’re missing the point that a large number of Wobblies are doing just that - deliberately travelling below the limit for no reasons better than “saving fuel” or “it’s only stable below x km/h”. I’ve even heard the bloody dangerous and ludicrous comment “we like to look around as we drive”.

Just because Wait Awhile has a 100km/h limit doesn’t mean all states do. And running slower than the large boys increases interactions and risk.

However, the safe logic of flowing with the majority of traffic (100km/h+) is sound.

Poor combinations are dangerous - full stop. Many Aussie designed vans are vulnerable to imbalance.

In fair conditions I can happily and with stability tow my van or my boat to well in excess of the speed limit, safely switch lanes, overtake, even take mild evasion manoeuvres with no ill effects.

That’s due to well sorted combinations.

It should be mandatory that all combinations on the road be tested at time of purchase for stability at 100km/h.
And IMO no LV should be allowed to tow heavier than itself.

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Originally Posted by Tombie

My odd standards? I’ve been charged for impeding the flow of traffic - I was doing 125km/h at the time.

You’re missing the point that a large number of Wobblies are doing just that - deliberately travelling below the limit for no reasons better than “saving fuel” or “it’s only stable below x km/h”. I’ve even heard the bloody dangerous and ludicrous comment “we like to look around as we drive”.

Just because Wait Awhile has a 100km/h limit doesn’t mean all states do. And running slower than the large boys increases interactions and risk.

However, the safe logic of flowing with the majority of traffic (100km/h+) is sound.

Poor combinations are dangerous - full stop. Many Aussie designed vans are vulnerable to imbalance.

In fair conditions I can happily and with stability tow my van or my boat to well in excess of the speed limit, safely switch lanes, overtake, even take mild evasion manoeuvres with no ill effects.

That’s due to well sorted combinations.

It should be mandatory that all combinations on the road be tested at time of purchase for stability at 100km/h.
And IMO no LV should be allowed to tow heavier than itself.

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Travelling a bit slower DOES save fuel AND puts Far less strain on the tug AND the trailer, So I personally cant see a problem.
Also IF there is a problem (roo's/livestock a blowout) travelling a bit slower is by FAR the "Safer" option.
Speed KILLS, That is a Proven FACT So travelling a bit slower is NOT dangerous even though it May annoy you[bigwhistle]

As a footnote to this discussion I am reminded of an occasion in 1963, when I was heading south from Townsville in my Series 1 on the Bruce Hwy. travelling at about 50mph, as that was as fast as it was comfortable. I was passed, almost as if I was standing still by what was then very, very rare - a van about 30ft long. It was towed by a then quite new Rolls Royce Silver Cloud II, instantly recognisable by the ugly four headlights grafted onto the original design. I estimate that it was doing at least 75mph.

I'd like to be able to say that I passed it at the next petrol station, but that was the last I saw of it. Probably got to brisbane about the time I got to Rocky!

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Originally Posted by trout1105

Travelling a bit slower DOES save fuel AND puts Far less strain on the tug AND the trailer, So I personally cant see a problem.
Also IF there is a problem (roo's/livestock a blowout) travelling a bit slower is by FAR the "Safer" option.
Speed KILLS, That is a Proven FACT So travelling a bit slower is NOT dangerous even though it May annoy you[bigwhistle]

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I think boredom kills more, IMHO.

What I don't get is why you "slow going" van haulers accelerate when there is finally a passing lane for everyone that's been patiently waiting to pass?

Is it because the extra lane allows your 2 ton dual cab (insert inappropriate tow vehicle here) towing 3 ton to lane swerve with more confidence? [emoji12][emoji2960]

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Originally Posted by 1nando

I get the P platers being restricted, also get that trucks are speed limited to 100kmph.

No problem with both those 2 points, my problem however is that if you're doing 20kms below the posted limit because your scared that your vehcile is unstable towing 3 ton or more at 100kmph or the limit for that matter then you need to consider updating that mu-x, trition, prado, ranger, everest, dmax, etc and upgrade to a vehcile that can comfortably with no concern ie yank tank, y62, range rover, 200 series (assuming they've remapped the transmission to lock up the torque converter).

I'm of the belief that a light 2 ton dual cab or medium size SUV towing 3 ton or more is not only dangerous but stupid. To tow that sort of weight the tow vehicle should really weigh more than 2.5 ton or more. It's simple; the heavier the prime mover (tow vehicle) the safer it's going to be to pull a similar size load. E.g. a y62 will be a safer tow vehicle than a mux towing 3 ton!

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You are living in a dream world. You're not safe towing at high speeds with a standard twin axle trailer that has massive wind sail area. Speed is exponential. Something that would have been a wiggle from the caravan at 80km/h .... is 'upside down on the side of the road' at 100km/h. If you want to travel safely at higher speeds, invest in a 5th wheeler setup.

There is no vehicles on the roads with the same setup as a caravan ... that travel at high speed as its simply not a safe way to setup a large vehicle. Sure if your an F350 that weigh 3tons empty towing a 1500kg caravan ... you will get away with a lot.

When we are travelling I'd say to my wife "he comes another nomad".... I'd be travelling at what I considered a safe speed. They obvoiusly had there cruise control set to 100km/h .... Everytime without fail that would get about level with my drivers door and there caravan would take off.... I would already be on the brakes giving them as much room as possible.... they'd be all over the bloody road by the time they past me and would panic and brake back to 80km/h ............... and suddenly I'm up there bloody arse ..... fast forward 5minutes and they have forgotten how close they came to loosing everything and they would set the cruise to 100km/h and be off again.

The impatient fools that think towed vehicles should be travelling at the speed limit need to develop some common sense. 30years ago cars had 1/10th of the pulling power even pulling the equivelant sized 'vans. Pretty much everyone travelled lazily along at around 80km/h ( MUCH slower up and down the hills.... just like the trucks did).

seeya,
Shane L.

seeya,
Shane L.

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Originally Posted by Tombie

My odd standards? I’ve been charged for impeding the flow of traffic - I was doing 125km/h at the time.

You’re missing the point that a large number of Wobblies are doing just that - deliberately travelling below the limit for no reasons better than “saving fuel” or “it’s only stable below x km/h”. I’ve even heard the bloody dangerous and ludicrous comment “we like to look around as we drive”.

Just because Wait Awhile has a 100km/h limit doesn’t mean all states do. And running slower than the large boys increases interactions and risk.

However, the safe logic of flowing with the majority of traffic (100km/h+) is sound.

Poor combinations are dangerous - full stop. Many Aussie designed vans are vulnerable to imbalance.

In fair conditions I can happily and with stability tow my van or my boat to well in excess of the speed limit, safely switch lanes, overtake, even take mild evasion manoeuvres with no ill effects.

That’s due to well sorted combinations.

It should be mandatory that all combinations on the road be tested at time of purchase for stability at 100km/h.
And IMO no LV should be allowed to tow heavier than itself.

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In my experiance the wind sail area is a HUGE issue. Like I have already said, I've been back to 60km/h travelling in heavy winds down warnanbool way. It is nothing to do with fuel economy. It is simple, pure common sense to travel at a safe speed.

You sound just like my brother ... he always claimed his rig was always dead stable at the speed limit (boat and caravan). We met him at halls gap a few years back. The day we were heading home home was gusty heavy winds. I picked 80km/h .... any faster was absolute insanity. He has never since stated he can tow at any speed. I expect him to cruise by the entire way home. When I asked him about it later, he went reallly quiet and finally admitted he sat on 80km/h and was blown all over the road.

He has also his car *change lanes" towing a big twin hull boat up the melbourne highway... gusty winds again, they must have got under the boat between the hulls and unloaded the ball.... It instantly jumped to the other lane. fortunately a duel carriage way road ... with no-one overtaking him. He had just towed the thing all the way from northern NSW without an issue.

until they mandate 5th wheel combinations (which is a million times better.... why do you think trucking uses it). People MUST travel to the conditions.

boats and trailers I've never really had an issue with ... but bloody caravans with there big wind sail area .....

30 years ago my family and friends were towing with GTs [emoji41].

If your combo can’t do it safely that’s your issue to resolve. I will happily and confidently tow (in moderate conditions) up to the posted limit.

And yes Mr Trout - speed kills - no stationary object has every crashed into another stationary object. Congratulations you too have swallowed the Government scare campaign.

I’ll see if I can find the link to a proposal in the UK years ago, it was recognising modern vehicles as safer and able to go faster with less road incidents - a proposal to increase all speed limits was put forward, the government backed it, data supported it. Right up until the squealing minority kicked up. Then it became unpopular and was shelved.

Heck, the Hume was designed as a 130km/h corridor. To reduce travel time and fatigue. Biggest killer on that road - fatigue!

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Originally Posted by trout1105

Travelling a bit slower DOES save fuel AND puts Far less strain on the tug AND the trailer, So I personally cant see a problem.
Also IF there is a problem (roo's/livestock a blowout) travelling a bit slower is by FAR the "Safer" option.
Speed KILLS, That is a Proven FACT So travelling a bit slower is NOT dangerous even though it May annoy you[bigwhistle]

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You were quoting how great your fuel economy is, but that is at 20kmh below the speed limit, vehicle is barely working. Now this thread is about petrol v diesel, not towing vans at below average speed limits. So most are quoting l/100 at highway speeds, so IF you towed etc..at highway speeds (100kmh) I would be guessing you would be adding 5l/100 to those figures or thereabouts would it not???

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Originally Posted by DoubleChevron

In my experiance the wind sail area is a HUGE issue. Like I have already said, I've been back to 60km/h travelling in heavy winds down warnanbool way. It is nothing to do with fuel economy. It is simple, pure common sense to travel at a safe speed.

You sound just like my brother ... he always claimed his rig was always dead stable at the speed limit (boat and caravan). We met him at halls gap a few years back. The day we were heading home home was gusty heavy winds. I picked 80km/h .... any faster was absolute insanity. He has never since stated he can tow at any speed. I expect him to cruise by the entire way home. When I asked him about it later, he went reallly quiet and finally admitted he sat on 80km/h and was blown all over the road.

He has also his car *change lanes" towing a big twin hull boat up the melbourne highway... gusty winds again, they must have got under the boat between the hulls and unloaded the ball.... It instantly jumped to the other lane. fortunately a duel carriage way road ... with no-one overtaking him. He had just towed the thing all the way from northern NSW without an issue.

until they mandate 5th wheel combinations (which is a million times better.... why do you think trucking uses it). People MUST travel to the conditions.

boats and trailers I've never really had an issue with ... but bloody caravans with there big wind sail area .....

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Shane; i agree with your wind point, it's a bit like drive to the conditions when it's raining. The ability to analise and be able to adapt to the conditions needs to be learned over time and if ignored can lead to potential accidents and death.
However, wheel track, wheel base, vehicle weight, vehcile suspension and chassis dynamics, and a properly setup van are more important than wind. High or excessive wind is not always a constant, poor vehcile choice and incorrectly loaded vehciles and vans are, I see it all the time. Typical example; nomads+ mux + bullbar+ roof rack+loaded car+ enormous van = stupid combination! Regardless of wind or any other variable the environment can throw up.

Then there's long up hills; where under powered small diesels slow to a snail's pace and every bloke and his dog behind it get frustrated.... then the down hill starts and they speed up and when you finally get a chance to try and pass them they're at the speed limit only for another up hill to start and that cycle repeat. Or they drive under the limit in a single lane carriage way and as soon as there is a passing lane speed up.....People need to learn about how to tow and do it safely and with consideration for other road users cause I couldn't give a f#%k about them or their van just like they don't give a hoots about me.

Luckily for me I blast past these idiots and it's a non event in my beast.

People die towing cause they're using inappropriate underpowered vehciles to tow massive loads not because they're driving their van like there in the Sydney to Hobart yatch race.[emoji2369]