Thread: Would you Aussies put up with this?

Originally Posted by Chucaro

Perhaps is time for unions help workers to start cooperatives and give the flick to the big managers.

LOL I have had the unfortunate privilege of working in one former workers paradise and one current workers paradise. I will give you benefit of the doubt and take it that you are joking.

Originally Posted by Tombie2

If you all believe so firmly in this Buy from Australia... Jobs for Australians...


Then a large portion of you are hypocrites...



Do you insist that you / your wife buy fruit ONLY from Australian Growers?

Do you go purchase your Bread from Local Bakeries?

Your vegetables from local growers at the local markets?

When looking for a Sedan / Wagon... Do you purchase only local PRODUCED vehicles? Falcons, Commodores, Camrys..

Your LANDROVER parts from LOCAL suppliers like Rovacraft etc...
Yes, they sell imported parts, but they are a local business, they pay taxes AND they support multiple staff on their payroll...


Those of you who import, buy from UK / eBay are taking these jobs away!!!


So before you all bitch and moan... Give that a long hard thought...

Bottom line most of Australia can afford to Buy Australian day in day out

Sorry but ture and a fact of life.

Originally Posted by 303gunner

Exactly, and that is why a general "Black Ban" and refusing to buy Bonds or King Gee is the absolute LAST THING that the remaining 7000 workers need. If we are that passionate about keeping Aussie jobs, we should be out there buying every last bit of King Gee on the shelves, go buy your self the next 5 years worth of clothes and pay full retail and don't haggle over the price. Make a stand and declare yourself in favour of Aussie jobs.

Unfortunately, that's unlikely to happen. People are going to have a grudge and buy Bisley clothes (Made in China for a Chinese company) just to spite Bonds. The company will cease trading, go bankrupt and sack the remaining 7000 employees. Naturally, this will all be the boards fault.

I would be happy to go out and buy my next 5 years supply of King Gees before they went off shore if I new it would help but all it would do, in the eye's of the executives, is affirm that they have done the right thing as they would see it as an increase in sales "Oh we must be doing the right thing".

Although I said we should Black Ban all the businesses in this group to make a point it was a bit of a knee jerk reaction, and I understand that as an employee you would think if that happens you'll lose your job. My intention was that this would be done for a very specific purpose that's publicly stating that while executives are paying themselves ridiculous salaries and ongoing payrises, sometimes in the order of 150% and more. We the public will no longer support their business.

If they decide that fair's fair and take a reasonable salary that reflects the work that they do then we will go right on and purchase their product again. The intent is not to break the business, it's to remind the exec's exactly where their ridiculous salaries are actually coming from. Without the little people earning enough to spend a little they have no profits and no business.

I don't think this should be confined to just this group of companies, we, the greater population of the average people world wide should say a BIG F*** YOU to every large corporation that thinks they can just treat everyone like dirt and do as they damn well please. This includes banks, telco's and any large corporation that feels that this is appropriate behaviour which pretty much includes everyone of them.

This whole financial crisis that is gripping the world right now is due to greedy fat cats pilfering every last cent out of the people who can afford it the least. If you want to sit back and do nothing then that's your prerogative.

I own and run my own business supplying websites to small business at affordable rates so that they might be able to compete, even if only a little, with bigger businesses on the internet. I'm just trying to make a living in the Australian economy like all the others. I don't have a problem with manufacturing going OS it's all a part of business. But I do believe that all the members of my team are equally important and should share in the spoils of our success.

I am constantly offered to have my programming done in India for a mere fraction of what it costs here but I persist and keep my programmers and contractors employed as I feel we as a team can produce work at a far greater quality.

I don't even take a wage and haven't for almost three years in order to allow my business to establish itself and build a solid foundation so we all, me and my employees have a business that will not just survive but also thrive.

I could easily sack my employees get my programming done in India or China, supply a cheaper product and charge double the price and just churn out worthless ****e and pat myself on the back at the massive profits I'm now making for myself, but that wouldn't help my programmer who has put in 3 years of blood & sweat to help me build what we have today. I am sick of seeing this kind of behaviour by the large corporate executives and then see them pat themselves on the back and pay themselves another Million dollar bonus.

I own shares in various corporations and I'd be far happier to see some of the money returned to the employees rather than watching executives taking 10's of millions in bonuses.

I appreciate that these people work really hard to get where they are and therefore they deserve a large pay packet. A large pay packet is one thing but when you start talking figures of 10's of millions even hundred's of millions for a years salary, come on you can't seriously think that anyone deserves that sort of salary.

Tell me this, in all the years that manufacturers have been taking their manufacturing offshore to cut costs, have you ever seen any of those products reduced in price. I think not. It only serves to fatten their profit margins and shareholders pockets. If they were doing this and then passing on the savings to Joe Public then great but that is not the case. I guarantee that the price of King Gee's or any other product under this group will not be cheaper at the checkout after manufacturing moves offshore.

Originally Posted by XSiV

Tell me this, in all the years that manufacturers have been taking their manufacturing offshore to cut costs, have you ever seen any of those products reduced in price. I think not. It only serves to fatten their profit margins and shareholders pockets. If they were doing this and then passing on the savings to Joe Public then great but that is not the case.

I remember in the 1980's when a pair of Levi's jeans was $80-90, when an American-made Apple IIe computer was $600, a Rank Arena 63cm TV was $1499 and a Black & Decker Drill was $159. Now we find Chinese made Jeans for $19, computers that are way faster than a IIe for $699, a 63cm LCD TV for $599 and a GMC drill for $14.99. And those prices are in 2009 dollars, not 1983 dollars. I don't know where you shop, but if you have not seen reduced prices or improved quality since the change from Tariff-protected "made in Australia" days to the current global economy, free trade days, then you've been missing something.

Originally Posted by 303gunner

I remember in the 1980's when a pair of Levi's jeans was $80-90, when an American-made Apple IIe computer was $600, a Rank Arena 63cm TV was $1499 and a Black & Decker Drill was $159. Now we find Chinese made Jeans for $19, computers that are way faster than a IIe for $699, a 63cm LCD TV for $599 and a GMC drill for $14.99. And those prices are in 2009 dollars, not 1983 dollars. I don't know where you shop, but if you have not seen reduced prices or improved quality since the change from Tariff-protected "made in Australia" days to the current global economy, free trade days, then you've been missing something.

Someone was getting a you over those Levi jeans. We were paying $30-$40 and they lasted 10 years. Try that with your $17 chinese jobs. As to drills , I paid $115 in 1981 for a top line AEG 5/8" drill with electronic speed control and hammer function, Rohm keyless chuck, still use it regularly, never had a problem and it is repairable. The $15 GMC is a light infequent use domestic handyman drill and unrepairable. A similar class Black and Decker in 1980 was $23. Power tools made in the 50's and 60's were industrial tools meant for heavy use and meant to be repaired. They cost accordingly. If you ever come across one of the 1" Black and Decker jobs from that era at a reasonable price then buy it quickly.

There is a way other than tariffs, import quotas. Give a non-transferable quota to an importer and tell them that in (pick a number) years your quota will reduce 20% per annum unless you commence Australian assembly or partial manufacture. Manufacturing is necessary and provides the jobs to the semi-skilled and unskilled, the poorly educated, the non-English speakers, etc. who, year in, year out, fill up the dole queues.

I can think of at least six motor vehicle makes that sell in sufficient volume in Australia to support a CKD or partial manufacture plant. Think of the value of a car plant to a town like Dubbo, with full time employment for 500-1000 breadwinners plus the spin-offs to other businesses.

Aside from exporting our unemployment, local manufacture is necessary for national security. We need to have this capacity to be self-sufficient in case we are ever again in the position of the dark days of WWII when we were cut off from our traditional suppliers and had to start from scratch making things never before made here.

Originally Posted by clean32

LOL I have had the unfortunate privilege of working in one former workers paradise and one current workers paradise. I will give you benefit of the doubt and take it that you are joking.

With more than 45 years on the work force and living in 3 diferent countries I am very serious about it.

If you do not like the unios go back and work more than 48 hour a week for a lousy wages, do not have more than 2 weeks holidays, kiss good bye to the safety on the work place, etc, etc.

Perhaps would be better to to a crash course and wotk for a year in China in the places where the poor ex farmers work

Originally Posted by Brian Hjelm

Aside from exporting our unemployment, local manufacture is necessary for national security. We need to have this capacity to be self-sufficient in case we are ever again in the position of the dark days of WWII when we were cut off from our traditional suppliers and had to start from scratch making things never before made here.

I actually think this last paragraph probably says best what I was thought I was trying to say initially, maybe I'm being a bit alarmist, but with all thats going on in the world today, I'm wondering if the global community isn't looking a bit shakey & Brians musings even more relevant.
Steve

Originally Posted by Chucaro

With more than 45 years on the work force and living in 3 diferent countries I am very serious about it.

If you do not like the unios go back and work more than 48 hour a week for a lousy wages, do not have more than 2 weeks holidays, kiss good bye to the safety on the work place, etc, etc.

Perhaps would be better to to a crash course and wotk for a year in China in the places where the poor ex farmers work

As a union member myself, I'm very aware of the fact that unions only came into being because of greedy ruthless bosses & employers. In my opinion, that is just as relevant today, certainly where I work. Its the same kind of mentality in action that has brought the financial word to its knees. Greed , Ego & Stupidity & they want squillions in salaries for being like that. Certainly there are good bosses about but I reckon they're out numbered by idiots & mongrels. I'm not saying unions are a sort of nirvana but they're there because without them we'd all be shafted worse than we are.
Steve