Hand cranking a Holden 186

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Originally Posted by JDNSW

Pushing on a crankhandle is very dangerous, as if the engine kicks, it is almost certain to break bones. If it kicks while pulling, and with the thumb on the same side of the handle as the fingers, it will simply pull out of your hand, at the very worst losing a bit of skin. If pushing, and it kicks, with your arm braced straight and your weight behind it, you can expect that the sudden lack of resistance when your wrist or arm breaks is likely to see your face coming in unpleasantly close contact with the crank handle as you fall forward into it.

The first fifty years or so of motoring, when crank starting was commonplace saw many such incidents, and led to the rule to never push on the crankhandle.

As an aside, the owners manual for the Cadillac V16 of the early thirties allegedly read "A starting handle is not provided, as it is impractical to turn this engine by hand".

Series 3 Landrovers would seem to be among the last production cars to come with a crankhandle, which, as pointed out, are useful for other things than starting.

Having learnt to drive on a Ford T, I was taught crank starting as part of my initial driver education when I was about twelve.

John

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Memories of learning to drive on 1920's and 1930's cars. Handbrake on, gearbox in neutral, set hand throttle, pull out choke, retard ignition, check if the glass bowl under the vacuum tank shows fuel, turn engine over a couple of turns with ignition off, or give two pumps of the Kigas, ignition on and crank. The biggest engines I can remember cranking by hand regularly were Dodge and Plymouth side valve sixes. During the war and during the period of rationing and shortages after, my dad always cranked his 1938 Dodge to extend battery life. He had been a telephone technician and made a trickle charger from old radio parts. He installed a plug on the dash and would plug the charger in through the driver's window when he put the car away for the night. New batteries were both hard to get and on priority number. My family needed to keep new batteries for the mail cars and trucks.

I bet a big Cadillac V16 with four cylinders at a time coming up on their compression strokes would be a real bloody joy to crank. Interestingly, the Meadows diesel 6 in the 1947 Thornycroft had a crank handle. This would have been impossible to turn over by hand without removing injectors. I can't recall it having a decompression control.

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Originally Posted by reubsrover

Hi Mick,

Someone was telling me more about this technique just the other day. Do you know any more details? You only need one wheel off the ground? I suppose that would depend on your diff. And then it's a quick run around to the clutch before it slips off the jack...:(

What I really want to know is apart from the obvious safety concern of vehicle slipping off jack or axel stands is it realatively safe?

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I wonder if there would be a safe way to do this? I was thinking wrap a snatch strap a couple of times round the wheel so that when you pull on it it spins the wheel. Theoretically it should be ok because as it is pulled it loosens itself and comes off the wheel and if the engine does start it does the same. No hands anywhere near the wheel, have someone sitting in the car so if it comes off the jack they can stand on the brakes. If it does take off at least it would be going away from you as well. You could even have another vehicle pull the strap if you needed a good spin but that probably reduces the safety again.

Seems reasonable to me :). (that doesn't always mean it is, of course)

TimJ.

Tim

We could all get a second groove around the rim of our tyres with a knotch in it. Then we would have a length of cord with a wooden T handle so we could pull start it like a lawn mower!

All we'd need then would be a BFG to get our BFG's turning! :D

Diana

BFG1 = Big Friendly Giant
BFG2 = B F Goodrich

Now you see Diana, that also sounds reasonable, which just goes to prove I don't have a very good reasonable meter :).

TimJ.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by reubsrover

Hi Mick,

Someone was telling me more about this technique just the other day. Do you know any more details? You only need one wheel off the ground? I suppose that would depend on your diff. And then it's a quick run around to the clutch before it slips off the jack...:(

What I really want to know is apart from the obvious safety concern of vehicle slipping off jack or axel stands is it realatively safe?

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I used to frequently start my old Holden powered 6x6 Landy with this method, and if you have adequate wheel arch clearance(I always do) it is relatively easy and safe. With standad open diffs you only jack one wheel off the ground and place gear lever in top gear(2wd or centre diff unlocked). With 4.7:1 diffs, due to differential action and the series high range ratio, one turn of the wheel equals around 2.7 turns of the engine, which is quite manageable with lug tyres to grab hold of.With constant 4wd transfercase and 3.54:1 diffs, 5th gear would give about 1 turn of the engine for 1 turn of the wheel I think, dependant on t/case high range ratio the vehicle is fitted with.
Never had a wheel kick back, but if concerned, the same procedure would apply as crank handle starting,as to retarding ignition.
Wagoo.

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Originally Posted by Brian Hjelm

Memories of learning to drive on 1920's and 1930's cars. Handbrake on, gearbox in neutral, set hand throttle, pull out choke, retard ignition, check if the glass bowl under the vacuum tank shows fuel, turn engine over a couple of turns with ignition off, or give two pumps of the Kigas, ignition on and crank. The biggest engines I can remember cranking by hand regularly were Dodge and Plymouth side valve sixes. During the war and during the period of rationing and shortages after, my dad always cranked his 1938 Dodge to extend battery life. He had been a telephone technician and made a trickle charger from old radio parts. He installed a plug on the dash and would plug the charger in through the driver's window when he put the car away for the night. New batteries were both hard to get and on priority number. My family needed to keep new batteries for the mail cars and trucks.

I bet a big Cadillac V16 with four cylinders at a time coming up on their compression strokes would be a real bloody joy to crank. Interestingly, the Meadows diesel 6 in the 1947 Thornycroft had a crank handle. This would have been impossible to turn over by hand without removing injectors. I can't recall it having a decompression control.

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They used to crank start the 8.4 litre Gardner 6LWs during the war on the Scammell Pioneers.Apparently there was a large pulley fitted to the crank handle. It was a 3 man job with one on the handle and the other 2 tugging on a rope wound around the pulley.
Wagoo.

It's off the track a bit but it's a funnny story....now anyway.
Years ago my father bought a new lawn mower, a 1965 Rover 4 Stroke. We still have the body, it has the date cast into the front of it. Anyway this new fancy mower of the day had a one of those throw away American alloy four strokes (not a B&S but some other) and a flash new starting system. A spring loaded contraption that you wound up, then flicked a lever to start it after you set the throttle etc. Well one day after we had owned it for a few years dad comes home from work and mum says to him, Bob our neighbour had come over and borrowed our lawn mower as his had broken down. Dad's reaction was "Oh Christ"..."the sarter on it is crook"
Well ten minutes later Bob shows up with his hand all bandaged up, apparently the locking mechanism had failed and when you flipped the lever to start it the winder would flyinto reverse...thus Bob got a good hard belt accross the back of the hand.
Probally a lesson there...never borrow things.
Well after that it had a starting cord for the rest of its days.
Further to the story, dad was telling me what a great mower it had been and how many quid he had payed for it back in 1965, and it was coming up to it's Twenty First Birthday soon.
Well...it didn't make it, Fifteen minutes later it threw a leg out of bed mid lawn. Dad almost cried he was so dissappointed.
A Honda engine transplant was the answer after that.
I know it's not a Landy story but I smile every time I think about it.

Cheers, Mick :)

One of my mate's lawn mower pull starter broke and now he puts the right sized socket on his cordless drill, fits it to the bolt and the drill does the work.