Thread: Which is better Off Road a D3/4 or a late model Defender? ... Puma 110

"For tough touring the Defender is the better truck." Agreed.

Someone correct me if im wrong here:

The d4 rides on 29 inch tyres and the puma on 32 inch tyres, its roughly a 10% difference.

There is a weight difference of 25% between the 2 vehicles. So taking these 2 points into consideration

If this is correct then the power (kw/nm) difference is as follows:

D4= 0.06kw per kg 0.208 nm per kg
Puma= 0.05kw per kilo 0.2 nm per kg

The kw difference is roughly 16.6% and the torque difference is 3.85% when these 2 factors are considered.......unless I've worked this out incorrectly.

In my opinion sand dunes require a combonation of power/torque and tyre tread length(footprint). If the above is correct then the advantage goes to the defender due to its longer tread because of its greater tyre size....

Does this sound correct?

Torque and power certainly help. Model T Fords did very well in sand and swamp with bugger all of either but tall tyres (v narrow) and lack of weight.

Cheers

Originally Posted by MrLandy

Yes thanks Steve, really enjoyed the video. The focus was clearly the slow and steady nature of Defender torque. Defender has OS mud tyres yes (which aren't necessarily better than standard Defender tyres on sand) but there's a clear difference IMO unless you also have diff locks? The D4 required much more speed and momentum, while the Defenders did it more easily, virtually idled up most dunes. I'm sure the disco was quieter and sweet on road/track the rest of the time, but it's clear to me which is the more capable on sand dunes.

yes I have diff locks but they where only used once on big red otherwise everything else was first or second gear high range with centre diff in.

I run 34 1/2" on 16" rims so I can go lower in tyre pressure then Mark and so also have more surface area (did everything but big red on 15PSI) but I also recon with far less electronics kicking in I can keep the truck easier in the rev band I want to have it for dunes

Originally Posted by 1nando

Someone correct me if im wrong here:

The d4 rides on 29 inch tyres and the puma on 32 inch tyres, its roughly a 10% difference.

There is a weight difference of 25% between the 2 vehicles. So taking these 2 points into consideration

If this is correct then the power (kw/nm) difference is as follows:

D4= 0.06kw per kg 0.208 nm per kg
Puma= 0.05kw per kilo 0.2 nm per kg

The kw difference is roughly 16.6% and the torque difference is 3.85% when these 2 factors are considered.......unless I've worked this out incorrectly.

In my opinion sand dunes require a combonation of power/torque and tyre tread length. If the above is correct then the advantage goes to the defender due to its longer tread because of its greater tyre size....

Does this sound correct?

A D3/4 comes with 30" tyres fitted not 29"

The weight of a five seater 110 according to Redbook is 1972 kg.

KW = 90
Torque = 360 nm

A SDV6 D4 weighs roughly 2440 kg depending on model and options.

KW = 183
Torque = 600 nm

Roughly a seven seater D4 diesel is approximately 19% heavier than a 110 Defender.

A five seater D4 would be, from memory, about 35kg lighter.

According to Redbook a 110 has a Power to weight ratio of 45.6 w/kg
A SDV6 D4 is 75 w/kg

No stats on torque and I have no idea how to work it out.

in my opinion the main difference between a Defender and D3/4 in regards to a tourer is three fold:

Driving: a Defender is utilitarian, it's a truck not a refined hi tech machine. It requires far more driver input and far more choices need to be made by the driver a style of driving I prefer.

Upgradability: The Defender you can mould in to what you like it to be, you can upgrade nearly every component with off the shelf stuff and make it a tough tourer. This was not possible for the D3 (not sure whether more parts HD are available now)

Repairability: While especially D4's are very reliable cars and even my D3 never let me down except a broken link arm bolt, any elecrtical issues are difficult to fix in the bush and most outback mechanics wont touch a Land Rover. A Defender is simpler and if things go wrong you have a greater chance fixing it in the bush..

Originally Posted by Steve223

in my opinion the main difference between a Defender and D3/4 is tow fold:

Driving: a Defender is utilitarian, it's a truck not a refined hi tech machine. it requires far more driver input and far more choices need to be made by the driver a style of driving I prefer.

upgradability: The Defender you can mould in to what you like it to be, you can upgrade nearly every component with off the shelf stuff and make it a tough tourer. this was not possible for the D3 (not sure whether more parts are available now)

I was saying that for much of this whole thread and i agree 100%

Terry0:

I got those figures off the land rover site for the tdv6.......