Thread: Just quoted for $6,600 from Landrover - Brookvale NSW

Originally Posted by simonmelb

Grr.. Its threads like this that give me no incentive to upgrade from my D2 !

Surely with all the knowledge out there by now on these cars there's a proper diagnostic procedure that can be done by us home mechanics to determine whether a new HP or LP fuel pump is required??

$6.5 K buys a professionally rebuilt and fitted transmission in a D2.

I think some of you blokes are losing perspective of what are reasonable maintenance costs - either that or a D4 is really that good!!

$6.5k buys a transmission for a $5k vehicle

Think back, injector replacement on a D2 was $10k, the in tank fuel pump was hundreds of dollars, and FPRs were not cheap.

Refercomments from donh54 and afloat, I 'third' the idea of low pressureside issues first.


Don't know if you have access to this info so thought i'd post it, below are some extracts from a workshopmanual I found online for the D4. The manual doesn't have the P2290 code in it, but Ifound someone asking for details of P2290 on Rrsport website, and itturned out to be their fuel filter.




P0087-00Fuel Rail/System Pressure
TooLow - no sub type
information


POSSIBLECAUSE:
Fuelrail pressure sensor
disconnected
Fuelrail pressure sensor to
EngineControl Module
sensingcircuit short circuit
toground
Fuelrail pressure sensor
supplycircuit high
resistance
Fuelrail pressure sensor
failure
Fuelline leak
Restrictedfuel line
Fuelpump module circuit
highresistance
Fuelpump module circuit
shortcircuit to ground
Fuelpump module failure
Volumecontrol valve fault
Pressurecontrol valve fault


ACTION:
Referto the electrical guides and check the
fuelrail pressure sensor circuits. For fuel rail
pressuresensor tests, refer to the relevant
workshopmanual section. Check the low
pressurefuel lines for damage or restrictions.
Checkthe fuel pressure. Check the low
pressurefuel pump module circuits and
operation.Check for fuel rail and high pressure
fuelline leaks. Check for volume control valve
andpressure control valve DTCs and rectify as
necessary




P0087-72Fuel rail/system pressure too
low- actuator stuck open


POSSIBLECAUSE:
Fuelpressure control valve
fault

• Actuator stuck open
  

ACTION:
Referto the electrical circuit diagrams and
checkthe pressure control valve actuator
circuitsand rectify as necessary. Check the
resistanceof the fuel pressure control valve. If
theresistance is not between 0 and 5.4 ohms,
installa new high pressure fuel pump (the fuel
pressurecontrol valve cannot be serviced
separately).Refer to the relevant section of
theworkshop manual. Clear the DTCs and test
fornormal operation. Refer to the warranty
policyand procedures manual if a high pressure
fuelpump is suspect






P0191-23Fuel Rail Pressure Sensor A
CircuitRange/Performance -
signalstuck low


POSSIBLECAUSES:
FuelRail Pressure (FRP)
sensorcircuit
range/performance- signal
stucklow
Lowfuel level
Blocked/incorrectly
connectedlow-pressure fuel
lines
FRPsensor fault
Fuelpump module fault
ACTIONS:
Checkthe fuel level and the condition and
correctconnection of the low-pressure fuel
circuitlines (incorrect connection of the lines to
andfrom the fuel filter can cause serious fuel
pressurefluctuations). Check the FRP sensor
andcircuits. Check the fuel pump module and
circuits.Refer to the electrical circuit diagrams.
Repair/renewas necessary. Clear the DTCs and
testfor normal operation




P0191-24Fuel Rail Pressure Sensor A
CircuitRange/Performance -
signalstuck high


POSSIBLECAUSES:
FuelRail Pressure (FRP)
sensorcircuit
range/performance- signal
stuckhigh
FRPsensor fault


ACTIONS:
Checkthe FRP sensor and circuits. Refer to the
electricalcircuit diagrams. Start the engine and
allowto idle. Check the fuel pressure value
usinga data logger function. Stop the engine,
turnthe ignition on, and recheck the fuel
pressure.If the pressure is greater than 10
MPa(1,450 lbs/inÇ) after 0.4 seconds, install a
newsensor. Refer to the relevant section of
theworkshop manual. Clear the DTCs and test
fornormal operation
DTCDescription Possible Causes Action




P0191-65Fuel Rail Pressure Sensor A
CircuitRange/Performance -
signalhas too few transitions
/events


POSSIBLECAUSES:
FuelRail Pressure (FRP)
sensorcircuit
range/performance- signal
hastoo few
transitions/events
FRPsensor fault


ACTIONS:
Checkthe FRP sensor and circuits. Refer to the
electricalcircuit diagrams. Start the engine and
allowto idle. Check the fuel pressure value
usinga data logger function. Increase the
enginespeed to 2,000 rpm and recheck the
fuelpressure. If the value has changed by
morethan 40 MPa (5,801 lbs/inÇ) per 10 ms,
installa new sensor. Refer to the relevant
sectionof the workshop manual. Clear the
DTCsand test for normal operation

I would go to Ayr's Automotive in Brookvale who are specialists and price fair

Originally Posted by Lukeis

Hm..

a little history..

I have had an intermittent issue for the past 12 months, can does into limp mode and is resolved by pulling over, turning off and on again then away the problem goes for another month or so.

The codes I received were initially P0087 which was for the first 8 months, then that code was replaced by P2290 which appeared for the past 2 months and finally last week a new code P0191 showed up. The problem has been posted about previously but due to its highly irregular nature I dealt with it for sometime all the while knowing from everything I have read it relates to a high or low pressure fuel pump.

So today I took it to LR and asked them to fix it. An hour ago I get a call from them saying they want $6,600 to replace the low pressure and high pressure fuel pump, fuel tank O ring and for a new timing belt kit.

I was anticipating one, not both and nothing prepared me for a $7K bill or the mention of a timing belt kit (car only has 120,000km - its a 2011 2.7L).

Their rationale to bill for both pumps is that it is actually the High pressure pump which is busted but they expect the low pressure pump will go soon as it has had to compensate. The timing belt kit is 'because we are in there already'.

My questions to any mechanics amongst us:

1) Would you do both pumps or just the one which is stuffed (HP)?
2) Is the timing belt kit a worthwhile addition, ie, are they really in the vicinity and this would have significant savings on labour later in life?
3) Is this cost anywhere close to reasonable?

I asked them how much it would be to just do the High pressure pump and not the timing belt or Low pump and they quoted 5.3K (he used a basic subtraction of $880 for the low pump and $400 odd for the timing belt, using these numbers they obviously did not adjust for the reduced labor - this seems wrong.

agh, i hate cars again.

Hi, I have a 20011 Disco 4 (TDv6) 2.7l and had the same problem in Jul 16.

I also took it to Landrover Brookvale as my usual Landrover mechanic said he could not do it.

LR Brookvale originally quoted me $5200 to replace both pumps and N/S cam seal that was apparently leaking and could be changed at the same time.

After my heart palpitations had settled a bit they said they would look at an alternative. They ended up quoting for the same work using aftermarket parts for only $4K....including the car wash!!!! What a deal!!!.

My car was going into limp mode on a regular basis and I had no choice.

I don't see why they can't quote you for aftermarket parts and I am sure that the price has not gone up that much in the period since my car was repaired.
I also think that the comment about the reliability of the car and whether this is a design fault of Landrover that could be pursued through the ACCC is also worth investigating. Hope it helps.

Hi I have a 2.2 in a 2014 Defender.
I was towing my broken down 110 ( long story)and experienced the same fault as you were having.
This was when we left Glen Innes in the morning.
The low fuel rail pressure happened 6 times.
All while going up hill towing the load.
I just backed off for a little while and the fault did not reoccur.
My diagnosis was that the fuel was cold and the pump could not keep up with demand due to the load.
Or the up fuel pump needed to warm up to close the tolerances up.
Are you having these faults when cold?

I seriously doubt that both pumps have failed.
i had similar issues with L322 Rangie.
i am a mechanic by the way. I have replaced 2 low pressure pumps but never the H/P.
The low pressure pump satisfies primary fuel pressure switch and until that is satisfied the system will not operate.
you have nothing to lose by simply replacing the low pressure pump first as that is not difficult or expensive.
i even set up a pressure gauge on fuel supply from low pressure pump when I was trouble shooting the system.
Whilst I would always like to support other mechanics decisions the quote given to basically replace everything seems a bit like " if we replace everything it must be fixed"
It is your money Ralph!

Originally Posted by Lukeis

Hm..
a little history..

I have had an intermittent issue for the past 12 months, can does into limp mode and is resolved by pulling over, turning off and on again then away the problem goes for another month or so.

The codes I received were initially P0087 which was for the first 8 months, then that code was replaced by P2290 which appeared for the past 2 months and finally last week a new code P0191 showed up. The problem has been posted about previously but due to its highly irregular nature I dealt with it for sometime all the while knowing from everything I have read it relates to a high or low pressure fuel pump.

So today I took it to LR and asked them to fix it. An hour ago I get a call from them saying they want $6,600 to replace the low pressure and high pressure fuel pump, fuel tank O ring and for a new timing belt kit.

I was anticipating one, not both and nothing prepared me for a $7K bill or the mention of a timing belt kit (car only has 120,000km - its a 2011 2.7L).

Their rationale to bill for both pumps is that it is actually the High pressure pump which is busted but they expect the low pressure pump will go soon as it has had to compensate. The timing belt kit is 'because we are in there already'.

My questions to any mechanics amongst us:

1) Would you do both pumps or just the one which is stuffed (HP)?
2) Is the timing belt kit a worthwhile addition, ie, are they really in the vicinity and this would have significant savings on labour later in life?
3) Is this cost anywhere close to reasonable?

I asked them how much it would be to just do the High pressure pump and not the timing belt or Low pump and they quoted 5.3K (he used a basic subtraction of $880 for the low pump and $400 odd for the timing belt, using these numbers they obviously did not adjust for the reduced labor - this seems wrong.

agh, i hate cars again.

Originally Posted by DiscoJeffster

Surely if this were the case this information would come in the form of a TSB / formal release like all other updates and modifications/repairs. The lack of having seen any such thing on any of the forums or via topix etc has me (as usual) sceptical. I find it hard to believe this is the first we’re hearing about it? Surely we’d have heard everyone bleating about being told to do their belts early?

Originally Posted by Tombie

The shortened time is Arduous use vehicles apparently...

I finally found a copy of the service schedule that supports what Tombie has mentioned and it's not new; I think I downloaded these files from this forum a couple of years ago.

As you can see the Arduous Schedule lists timing belts for 91k/4 years for early model years and 112k/5 years for MY14 onwards.
If you ask a dealer specifically about the Arduous Schedule they will find this info in the system but in my experience they don't get much call for it, which is fair enough when the vast majority of customers don't need to follow it and they'd be accused of unnecessary gouging even more if it was suggested.

Whether an owner deems their usage to be Arduous is their choice so it's not something to be forced on you or moan about, it's up to you.

Scott

Scott and Tombie, those schedules seem to conflict with what I was told when I purchased my vehicle. Mine has a "normal" schedule of 26,000kms/12 months. The type of schedule does follow your A,B,A,B, A, C etc. However I was told that if I put the car under "Hard" use (ie towing a caravan or lots of 4WDing, then the intrernal computer will automatically adjust the time period and/or kms traveled. My car came up with the 1st message at 20,000kms, with the message that the service was needed in 2K time. (ie at 22k not 26k). The 2nd came up at 41K, and the car was serviced at 43K. I do my own oil and filter change about 12K after the dealer service.

It seems that LR extended the standard service intervals to longer kms (not time) in the later D4s.