Replace torque converter or rebuild trans?

I just wonder what woman maths looks like.

$7500? That would buy a new kitchen/bathroom.

Regards Philip A

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by PhilipA

I just wonder what woman maths looks like.

$7500? That would buy a new kitchen/bathroom.

Regards Philip A

---

Yeah something along those lines. Or a really nice holiday for the whole family. Generally woman maths is waaaaaay more practical than man maths, which is why man maths is so easily misunderstood that it needs to be kept secret... [tonguewink]

Woman maths almost never involves things with wheels or fishing rod holders attached. Man maths almost always does. There's the issue...

[bigwhistle]

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CanadianRyan

Thanks for the detailed write up. I wonder if any shops in Perth would go to this sort of effort to inspect / diagnose the issues before repairing. The two places I've spoken to over the phone both suggest rebuild - one would remove it and ship it to Sydney for rebuild by ZF, the other would swap it for a reconditioned unit on their shelf (apparently they keep 2 in stock at all times). Both options are $7500. Given the age of the car and its market value I hesitate to spend about 35-40% of the cars value on a rebuild, especially since I just paid for a new engine install a few months ago. On the other hand I don't want to do a part-fix which will have to be re-done again in a few years. Decisions decisions.
Ryan

---

It is a hard decision in deed. Had my D4 for 9 years now and to be honest couldn't buy a car with its level of performance and luxury for close to the tranny rebuild cost. Man it's hard to find a crap car these days for under $10k

The repair guys knew from my description that the TC was a definite and when he took it for a test drive, as soon as he felt the shudder in 3rd I booked it in. My cars shudder was really bad in the end, although when cold on some days it was perfect (TC doesn't try to lock until oil temp is reached). I still managed to get over 12 months more life out of the gearbox from when the problem started back in March of last year but in the end I was more worried of getting stuck on the side of the road. If it's not too bad perhaps hold off for now?

If you haven't tried instant shudder fixx yet it is certainly worth a go. Also you might have a faulty valve body. The TC piston can wear in it's sleeve due the high oscillation rate when it pulse width modulates the TC which then reduces the pressure to the TC. Sonnax makes kits with new pistons to fix this without having to ream out sleeve but a vacuum test of the valve body however would pinpoint any issues.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by brad72

Thanks Eric

Yep valve body was rebuilt as well. I think the guys were surprised it passed the vacuum test more than anything, and so was i tbh.

Fluid change and filter every 40,000 or 12 months now. He said the lower micron after market filters that come with the steel pan a make a big difference. On my valve body you could see the separator plate gasket material had started to go also, although mainly around teh perimeter.

Below is the gearbox in pieces to decide whether to do a full rebuild or not. They do this as part of the TC and Valve body service.

Attachment 150577Attachment 150578

---

When I rebuilt the vb in mine, the separator plate was replaced, there was areas on the old one where fluid had tracked between galleries and same as yours the sealant around the edges had started to go. I'm hoping I caught mine in time, since the valve body rebuild I've got no shudder, shift or hesitation issues. Fluid I'm running is penrite bmv and just done 23,000 km.

I was also impressed by how clean the internals were after ~178000km

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by brad72

It is a hard decision in deed. Had my D4 for 9 years now and to be honest couldn't buy a car with its level of performance and luxury for close to the tranny rebuild cost. Man it's hard to find a crap car these days for under $10k

The repair guys knew from my description that the TC was a definite and when he took it for a test drive, as soon as he felt the shudder in 3rd I booked it in. My cars shudder was really bad in the end, although when cold on some days it was perfect (TC doesn't try to lock until oil temp is reached). I still managed to get over 12 months more life out of the gearbox from when the problem started back in March of last year but in the end I was more worried of getting stuck on the side of the road. If it's not too bad perhaps hold off for now?

If you haven't tried instant shudder fixx yet it is certainly worth a go. Also you might have a faulty valve body. The TC piston can wear in it's sleeve due the high oscillation rate when it pulse width modulates the TC which then reduces the pressure to the TC. Sonnax makes kits with new pistons to fix this without having to ream out sleeve but a vacuum test of the valve body however would pinpoint any issues.

---

That's why I bought the Sonnax Gen2zip kit, has all the replacement cylinder and seals for the valve body. I reckon if you've done over 120,00km and have no TC shudder then the Sonnax kit makes a lot of sense.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CanadianRyan

Thanks for the detailed write up. I wonder if any shops in Perth would go to this sort of effort to inspect / diagnose the issues before repairing. The two places I've spoken to over the phone both suggest rebuild - one would remove it and ship it to Sydney for rebuild by ZF, the other would swap it for a reconditioned unit on their shelf (apparently they keep 2 in stock at all times). Both options are $7500. Given the age of the car and its market value I hesitate to spend about 35-40% of the cars value on a rebuild, especially since I just paid for a new engine install a few months ago. On the other hand I don't want to do a part-fix which will have to be re-done again in a few years. Decisions decisions.
Ryan

---

Maybe my man’s maths isn’t as it should be, but if I had just replaced the engine I would be more likely to do a rebuild. If money and woman’s maths allowed of course.You then had a D3 with the two most costly parts theoretically “problem free” for many years to come. My D3 has done 220,000kms and I haven’t reached the stage when every service requires something else replaced. I’m planning to hold onto mine and have factored a transmission rebuild and an engine replacement at sometime. A transmission oil change gave me 20,000 kms before the shudder came back. Might get another 5-10,000kms before a rebuild. Am going to do a rebuild rather than just the TC.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SeanC

Maybe my man’s maths isn’t as it should be, but if I had just replaced the engine I would be more likely to do a rebuild. If money and woman’s maths allowed of course.You then had a D3 with the two most costly parts theoretically “problem free” for many years to come. My D3 has done 220,000kms and I haven’t reached the stage when every service requires something else replaced. I’m planning to hold onto mine and have factored a transmission rebuild and an engine replacement at sometime. A transmission oil change gave me 20,000 kms before the shudder came back. Might get another 5-10,000kms before a rebuild. Am going to do a rebuild rather than just the TC.

---

Forgot to say a transmission oil change AND a tube of Dr. Tranny.

I wonder if this might be an option? "The 6R is a six-speed automatic transmission for longitudinal engine placement in rear-wheel drive vehicles. It is based on the ZF 6HP26 transmission^[1] and is built under license by the Ford Motor Company at its Livonia Transmission plant in Livonia, Michigan. The 6R debuted in 2005 in the 2006 model year Ford Explorer and Mercury Mountaineer."

It also mentions it is used in the Ford Territory. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_6R_transmission

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RANDLOVER

I wonder if this might be an option? "The 6R is a six-speed automatic transmission for longitudinal engine placement in rear-wheel drive vehicles. It is based on the ZF 6HP26 transmission^[1] and is built under license by the Ford Motor Company at its Livonia Transmission plant in Livonia, Michigan. The 6R debuted in 2005 in the 2006 model year Ford Explorer and Mercury Mountaineer."

It also mentions it is used in the Ford Territory. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_6R_transmission

---

I doubt the ecu would talk to a 6R trans, doing a google search there are a few builders beefing these up to take 400kw for Falcons for a lot less than the usual 6-7 plus k. The internals dont seem to be anything special and Exedy do a HD clutch pack for them, only real difference is the casing for each application.
I will probably find a used one to rebuild.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SeanC

Forgot to say a transmission oil change AND a tube of Dr. Tranny.

---

Ive had the tranny shudder for a while. I started with a good flush and oil change, and since put 2 tube os Dr Tranny through it. Unfortunately im at the same point as Ryan. I have to bite the bullet and swap out the convertor. Question is wether or not to do a rebuild or not. Ill opt for the steel sump as it holds more oil too. (Previous experience with a Territory, is the extra oil, keeps down trans oil temps, therefore aids in lifespan when frequently towing.)

But one point, that seems to be overlooked here is this, has anyone added a 2nd Transcooler, or a larger aftermarket one, as keeping the oil cooler even by uptown 10deg cel, can increase lifespan. As its quite common for some to fit a watchdog, or similar to monitor the oil temps.. Just curious..

As, im at the point where the convertor is getting replaced, and on the fence about a rebuild trans, so whilst im there it makes smart sense to help the oil stay cooler, or at least fit a gauge..

Any suggestions?