D4 head gasket - what now ?

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Originally Posted by PerthDisco

Yes I totally sympathise and agree with the principle but I bet the dealer will say - we’ve never heard that ever happening before - as they are never, in my experience, ‘enthusiasts’ at the dealer only a money making machine for the dealership being faceless behind the glitzy service reception. Until something breaks they will do A and B services forever.

The difference with an Indy or DIY is the interaction and getting choices on what ‘should’ be done.

At 7 years you’re due a timing belts change but I bet the dealer would not mandate changing that part. It is a concern though that it’s gone so severely at 7 years and didn’t give you a slow leak for a long time, or did it?

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Absolutely correct.
"Interaction" being the key word here.

As well, the Service Receptionists (the people who greet you and take your "order") have little or no positive discussions as such with the service crew (mechanics), thus in the case of the water manifold which we all know is a common problem and should be replaced at around 120,000 klms, the receptionists have no idea it is a potential problem therefore they are not in a position to make an advice to the customer that it should be changed prior failure. There is also the problem that they are always on their guard so to speak, and possibly reluctant to advise of such preventative m/ance being required, in the event it looks like an admission of a design problem and the customer might scream "warranty".....
A few years ago I've been a party to this exact problem at the local LR dealer and that is why I will no longer patronise them.

Yes, the dealers dilemma is to find a team of young oil changers at the lowest possible price to maximise profits with one or two capable mechanics for any real spanner work. These may often be a 457 Visa in what I have seen.

These guys you will rarely ever see or speak to and they will definitely never share a personal opinion. They are fitted with a suicide jacket activated by the service manager or dealership owner.

The good ones leave ASAP to an Indy or become an Indy.

The trade off is you ‘hope’ they will be kind to you for your loyalty if the brown stuff ever hits the fan.

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Originally Posted by Discodicky

Absolutely correct.
"Interaction" being the key word here.

As well, the Service Receptionists (the people who greet you and take your "order") have little or no positive discussions as such with the service crew (mechanics), thus in the case of the water manifold which we all know is a common problem and should be replaced at around 120,000 klms, the receptionists have no idea it is a potential problem therefore they are not in a position to make an advice to the customer that it should be changed prior failure. There is also the problem that they are always on their guard so to speak, and possibly reluctant to advise of such preventative m/ance being required, in the event it looks like an admission of a design problem and the customer might scream "warranty".....
A few years ago I've been a party to this exact problem at the local LR dealer and that is why I will no longer patronise them.

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Ditto with broken early tdv6 oil pump casings destroying engines after a timing belt change.

Got to feel for the OP.... I picked up my 2011 D4, 3.0L diesel from my last service about a month ago, and I arranged for the timing belts to be done in September, as it's getting on for 175,000kms. My (indy) mechanic told me I should replace the (plastic!!) water inlet that lives under the covers at the same time, and showed me a failed part that had sheared off at the hose clamp junction (I think the thermostat lives there too?).

He said these should be replaced when the timing belts are done at around 150,000, as they can fail, and quoted about $250 for parts and labour..... I said I'll think about it and let him know when I bring the car in next month. I thought at the time "he's trying to sell me some extra work", I mean.... surely the manufacturer would have done their research and wouldn't have designed a part, in plastic, that's installed in the bowels of the engine, that's prone to failure... right?????

Having read this post, I'll be getting the part replaced, and see if I can get an alloy part fitted for peace of mind.... and I'll never try and second-guess my mechanic's advice or intentions!

I also agree with the other comments re going hard on the dealer for a warranty claim...

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Originally Posted by wildcard808

Got to feel for the OP.... I picked up my 2011 D4, 3.0L diesel from my last service about a month ago, and I arranged for the timing belts to be done in September, as it's getting on for 175,000kms. My (indy) mechanic told me I should replace the (plastic!!) water inlet that lives under the covers at the same time, and showed me a failed part that had sheared off at the hose clamp junction (I think the thermostat lives there too?).

He said these should be replaced when the timing belts are done at around 150,000, as they can fail, and quoted about $250 for parts and labour..... I said I'll think about it and let him know when I bring the car in next month. I thought at the time "he's trying to sell me some extra work", I mean.... surely the manufacturer would have done their research and wouldn't have designed a part, in plastic, that's installed in the bowels of the engine, that's prone to failure... right?????

Having read this post, I'll be getting the part replaced, and see if I can get an alloy part fitted for peace of mind.... and I'll never try and second-guess my mechanic's advice or intentions!

I also agree with the other comments re going hard on the dealer for a warranty claim...

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Wise man

Do the water pump also as you are already in there and enjoy eliminating that risk also for leaks down the track.

(You’ll be up for a new alternator soon also)

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Originally Posted by williamr

quote by MR to replace engine (will not do head gaskets) = $27000!

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Why is this?

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Originally Posted by wildcard808

...and said it would cost about $250 for an alloy version, fitted. At the time, I thought he was just trying to sell additional work I didn't need (and let me tell you, the timing belts are NOT cheap, close to $3k), so I told him I'll think about it and tell him when I bring the car in.

Having read your post, I now reckon $250 is a whole lot of peace of mind, especially having seen the part and knowing it's a plastic fitting that's sitting in the bowels of the engine!!!

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100% you want to change out that part - it could cost you big if you don't. If your getting an alloy one for $250.00 then that is either awesome or cause for concern - they're usually closer to $600.00 for the part alone (plus installation costs) so perhaps it's a sign of the quality of the unit being installed? Or perhaps he meant $250.00 supplied and installed for a genuine plastic unit and more for an alloy - either way I'd check it out further...

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Originally Posted by PerthDisco

At 7 years you’re due a timing belts change but I bet the dealer would not mandate changing that part.

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Speaking to a bloke at work the other day with a 2010 or 2011 D4 TDV6. He has had it serviced at the local dealer and they've not mentioned the timing belt to him. It's only done 92,000km but I pointed out that it's over in years. He wasn't concerned as he's sure the dealer would let him know...

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Originally Posted by twr7cx

Speaking to a bloke at work the other day with a 2010 or 2011 D4 TDV6. He has had it serviced at the local dealer and they've not mentioned the timing belt to him. It's only done 92,000km but I pointed out that it's over in years. He wasn't concerned as he's sure the dealer would let him know...

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It is a worry when you hear stories like this - especially given most timing belt failures will be due to age not mileage.

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Originally Posted by DiscoDB

It is a worry when you hear stories like this - especially given most timing belt failures will be due to age not mileage.

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My dealer had given me a quote to do the belts as the age is up, although the mileage was under. I will do it at the next service.

I’m a sucker for preventative maintenance if it keeps the dealers happy. Just that one day you might need them to play the goodwill cards.

Sundry and washer fluids, you name it.

Played a trick once, I refused the cabin filter change and was charged for it - it was a different car back then so I was able to lock the glove compartment. So I asked the question how they could access it...

D4 timing belts mandatory at 7years regardless of kms. Cheap insurance imho. Failure of this belt will cost you a new engine. Get high pressure fuel pump drive belt changed at the same time. Both should cost about 2k all up including new idler and tensioner pulleys. They should also replace the front crank seal whilst there, if not, tell them to do it. Its a $ 30 part that needs $1000 labour to get to. New genuine plastic coolant outlet is about $60 delivered ex UK, and should also be replaced at that time. Easy enough to do after though. I can do 10 of those for 1 alloy unit (yes it looks trick) but genuine is just as good.

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Originally Posted by Eric SDV6SE

D4 timing belts mandatory at 7years regardless of kms. Cheap insurance imho. Failure of this belt will cost you a new engine. Get high pressure fuel pump drive belt changed at the same time. Both should cost about 2k all up including new idler and tensioner pulleys. They should also replace the front crank seal whilst there, if not, tell them to do it. Its a $ 30 part that needs $1000 labour to get to. New genuine plastic coolant outlet is about $60 delivered ex UK, and should also be replaced at that time. Easy enough to do after though. I can do 10 of those for 1 alloy unit (yes it looks trick) but genuine is just as good.

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I was quoted $1400 from southern land rovers 2 months ago for both front and rear timing belts.

Thanks for the tip.