Disco 4 vs new Defender comparison

Hi all

I'm very keen on the new Defender as a replacement for my D4 in some years time. There are a few things I don't like about it though.

It hasn't got a tailgate. Just a week ago I used my D4's tailgate as my workbench whilst doing some fencing repairs. My wife and I sit on it to have a morning or afternoon coffee on a long trip or we use it as a table top for making lunch.

Also with the spare tire on the back you have to lower the spare by hand to ground level, and the flat tire has to be lifted up. With the D4 you lower by winch all the way to ground then drag it out and roll it to where you want it. The old wheel is just winched up. At my age now I can lift the tyre but older people will have to call the NRMA just to get the spare off or the flat tire back on.

Attachment 162485

Mike

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by scarry

They used to,actually, the market they more or less pioneered,they don't have a vehicle in any more,its been handed to others.

---

Really? what were they called? I only know of the Defender 90/110/130's, the old Series Landies and what not...
The Range Rover & Discovery's have their own names, models etc..

When did LR do what Toyota does in regards to their Landcruiser models?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AlexRS4

I think they'll sell a lot of them. Plenty of people cashed up enough and want a good wagon that can do everything. Plenty more who will lease expensive cars to keep up with the Jones's and portray an image.

LC200 is a rort for the price and interior equipment level and doesn't look great. They still sell heaps of them.

The new Defender is a great all round car. There's no new cars that tick as many boxes overall. It's like a D4 but looks tons better and with the Defender brand strength it also gives off a more 'outdoorsy tough' image than the Disco brand ever could.

---

The 110 looked tough. This new one doesnt to my eye. It looks...OK...not tough. Just my view of It.

Cheers

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by scarry

They used to,actually, the market they more or less pioneered,they don't have a vehicle in any more,its been handed to others.

If you have a good look at the quality control of the last run of Defenders(backed up by many including Dazza and JC on here,and the one in my driveway),its pretty obvious it was in a market they had no interest in.



Anther new Defender vid.

YouTube

---

Not just LR that have focussed on mum's taxis..Nissan..Suzuki..Subaru and many other have vacated the utilitarian space. You could also argue that Aus is a bit of Yota loving paradise..not really reflective of the Global mkt. And there's the Taliban ...how do Toyota get away with supplying vehicles used as gun mounts to them and not incur UN sanctions😞??

Also many farmers now use eg side by sides rather than cruisers..a trend together with cheaper Asian variants or better value US imports must cut into cruiser sales. But I do hope Toyota keeps making them orherwise the aftermarket industry will collapse here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by INter674

Not just LR that have focussed on mum's taxis..Nissan..Suzuki..Subaru and many other have vacated the utilitarian space. You could also argue that Aus is a bit of Yota loving paradise..not really reflective of the Global mkt. And there's the Taliban ...how do Toyota get away with supplying vehicles used as gun mounts to them and not incur UN sanctions😞??

Also many farmers now use eg side by sides rather than cruisers..a trend together with cheaper Asian variants or better value US imports must cut into cruiser sales. But I do hope Toyota keeps making them orherwise the aftermarket industry will collapse here.

---

Really? how can u blame a car manufacturer for how their product is used by the end user?


I agree though... I hope Toyota don't stop making the solid front end cruisers either... along with Jeep, I think they are the only remaining 2 that make a solid front end 4wds...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Robmacca

Really? how can u blame a car manufacturer for how their product is used by the end user?


I agree though... I hope Toyota don't stop making the solid front end cruisers either... along with Jeep, I think they are the only remaining 2 that make a solid front end 4wds...

---

It's called international law...eg. s UK business supplying CAD machines to Iraq was stopped from exporting them because they were being used to make munitions. There are countless examples of such interventions and clearly Toyotas are being used as gun platforms.

USA makers of similar vehicles are not allowed to sell them into war zones inc Humvees etc. There's a clear lack of consistency when it's obvious that they are being used for terrorist mobility as well as gun platforms..dozens of them at a time and many shiny and new.

It's just not right😞

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Robmacca

Really? how can u blame a car manufacturer for how their product is used by the end user?


I agree though... I hope Toyota don't stop making the solid front end cruisers either... along with Jeep, I think they are the only remaining 2 that make a solid front end 4wds...

---

And the G-Wagen professional, ie the commercials.
Actually, are MB even still importing them?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Robmacca

Really!!! How does anyone know this?? Only time will tell if that statement will become true... I wouldn't be game to touch it, little alone use it for remote travel... sure, if u are not the type of person that goes to really remote offroad places but keeps to the more populated (civilised) areas (ie beaches, local areas, etc), u might well then take the risk and buy one of the first ones off the ship.... but not for me...

If LR really want to change their public perception around the world, then they will have to start offering better warranties with a minimum of 7yr/unlimited warranty to help change people's opinions of LR... After watching a few videos on the new Defender, they have missed a golden opportunity in catering for a wide range of people.... it's solely aimed at the higher end market where people are generally not likely to stray too far off the bitumen or away from civilisation...

Look at the Toyota Landcruiser model for example. U have a vehicle model that caters for the more basic use like farmers, miners, etc (70's Cruisers), through to a model that caters for those that want more comfort; gadgets,(ie: 200's Cruisers) etc. The 70's and 200's still carry the same "Landcruiser" badge, but are built totally different (ie: RFS vs IFS). Why couldn't LR do something similar with the Defender?? Cater for ALL areas of the 4WD/AWD market. This would give them more sales overall too...

---

As many boxes isn't all boxes. Remote area travel is a niche market, the number of customers who actually buy new cars AND do that kind of travel are very few.

A car costs $1-2B to develop. You need hundreds of thousands of sales to make that up. Many regulations like crash worthiness, economy and emissions prevent

All that said - the new defender has the best capability outside a 70 series in a new car, at least on paper. Better approach angles, wading height, true tow capacity and payload (including roof payload) than a 200 series. And frankly Toyota have been taking the **** with the 200 series for a long time, the car is appalling in the quality of the interior, driving dynamics and design for what they charge for it. A LC200 Sahara is worse inside than a corolla is and miles worse to drive and live with - this is why we all drive Land Rovers right?

The biggest issue with using a new defender for remote area travel is nothing to do with the design, it's 2 things: ease of fixing on the fly which is very difficult with all modern vehicles, and parts availability.

Your concern about buying first off the line can be said of any vehicle and is a perceived quality concern (which may or may not be accurate - only time will tell).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AlexRS4

As many boxes isn't all boxes. Remote area travel is a niche market, the number of customers who actually buy new cars AND do that kind of travel are very few.

A car costs $1-2B to develop. You need hundreds of thousands of sales to make that up. Many regulations like crash worthiness, economy and emissions prevent

All that said - the new defender has the best capability outside a 70 series in a new car, at least on paper. Better approach angles, wading height, true tow capacity and payload (including roof payload) than a 200 series. And frankly Toyota have been taking the **** with the 200 series for a long time, the car is appalling in the quality of the interior, driving dynamics and design for what they charge for it. A LC200 Sahara is worse inside than a corolla is and miles worse to drive and live with - this is why we all drive Land Rovers right?

The biggest issue with using a new defender for remote area travel is nothing to do with the design, it's 2 things: ease of fixing on the fly which is very difficult with all modern vehicles, and parts availability.

Your concern about buying first off the line can be said of any vehicle and is a perceived quality concern (which may or may not be accurate - only time will tell).

---

The problem with all modern cars as time goes on is that they are basically dumbing down people's driving skills...

I think I'll wait for this instead - ALL-NEW INEOS GRENADIER 4×4 WAGON AND UTE HERE SOON FROM AROUND $80K! and see how it performs

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by speleomike

Hi all

I'm very keen on the new Defender as a replacement for my D4 in some years time. There are a few things I don't like about it though.

It hasn't got a tailgate. Just a week ago I used my D4's tailgate as my workbench whilst doing some fencing repairs. My wife and I sit on it to have a morning or afternoon coffee on a long trip or we use it as a table top for making lunch.

Also with the spare tire on the back you have to lower the spare by hand to ground level, and the flat tire has to be lifted up. With the D4 you lower by winch all the way to ground then drag it out and roll it to where you want it. The old wheel is just winched up. At my age now I can lift the tyre but older people will have to call the NRMA just to get the spare off or the flat tire back on.

Attachment 162485

Mike

---

Absolutely why you would change this loved feature it only cheapens the car beyond the complexity cost saving of this beautiful and well sorted design not then reflected in the new car price! Lose lose