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Thread: P38 Hesitation/Stopping Issues

  1. 15th August 2012, 06:19 PM #1
    BusinessConnected
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    P38 Hesitation/Stopping Issues

    Hello Everyone,
    Since last week I've had a bit of a weird issue where the Rangie has been suffering from Hesistation at various points in the Rev Range.

    Initially started when I was crusing along at 100kmh, where the Engine would basically stop, Revs would completely die and then come straight back and continue along without much issue.

    I managed to get home, and subsequently was left stranded somewhere lese a couple of days later where the Car would REV at all past about 1100-1200rpm. All that would happen was sort of Popping/Spluttering at the Exhaust.

    I thought I may have had a Dead Fuel Pump, so I whacked the bottom of the Tank for a while, and then also removed the Intake and disconnected the Throttle Position Sensor and Reconnected. Also removed and reset the Fuel Pump Fuse and Relay. This again managed to get me home (just). It was starting to splutter and die again when I got home that time.

    Because I had them, I changed over my Iridium Spark Plugs for New Ones (they were due... around 95,000km old).. and check all the Spark Plug leads etc... I also removed the Fuel Filter and Replaced it with a New One.

    I also checked the Valve on the Fuel Rail (bit of a tight squeeze with LPG Injection gear) and got a solid squirt of petrol as far as the Brake Accumulator when Pressing on the Valve (This was just after allowing the Pump to Prime with the Car Ready to start).

    I thought I had the problem licked as I've been driving for 3-4 days without an issue but this morning the hesistation returned, and although it hasn't completely stopped it certainly hasn't been pleasant.

    In terms of what the Nanocom gives me... it doesn't seem to generate any Engine Codes, just a Gearbox Code saying "Throttle Position Angle Error & Engine RPM Error"...

    I know It might simply be the Fuel Pump being intermittent... however today when the Spluttering started at around 100kmh/2200rpm I geared down to 3rd to increase the Revs and it happily surged forward at 3500-4000rpm. Surely that would require more Fuel/Pump Capacity?

    Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

    Fuel Pump/TPS/Idle Position Sensor and a whole heap of goodies are currently coming via DHL from LRDirect.com...

    (We're getting a 2nd P38 GEMS in the Family soon... so thought it best to have a collection of spares).

    Regards
    Heath
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  2. 16th August 2012, 05:10 AM #2
    Fitzy2011
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    This is very similar to what I had a couple of weeks ago. I was on Fraser Isl and it just started misfiring badly. I changed fuel, plugs, coils, put in additives, checked as many connectors as I could find, fuel filter and no error codes.

    I was told to go to a heavier oil 20w50 as maybe the newer synthetics were releasing gunk and causing problems with the litters.

    I did and 2 days later it fixed itself, but I,m not sure why, but it definitely purrs now.

    Good luck as it is very frustrating.
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  3. 16th August 2012, 08:02 AM #3
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    Scouse
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    My money's on dying fuel pump, especially after reading this part:
    Quote Originally Posted by BusinessConnected View Post
    I managed to get home, and subsequently was left stranded somewhere lese a couple of days later where the Car wouldn't REV at all past about 1100-1200rpm. All that would happen was sort of Popping/Spluttering at the Exhaust.
    Classic low fuel pressure symptoms.

    (I assume you mean 'wouldn't')
    Scott
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  4. 17th August 2012, 06:26 AM #4
    BusinessConnected
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    Drove approximately 250km yesterday... Only Issues was a slight hesitation/drop to No Revs once during the trip.

    Finally on the way home I stopped off at Service Station, Filled up the Tank (Was 50% Full to begin with) and drove from Whittlesea towards Kinglake.

    About 500m up the Hill, it started to shudder badly again... no Rev's past 1200rpm... Exhaust "Popping" etc etc... Got towed home after not being able to start it again for 30 minutes. As soon as I got home it was fine again.

    Hopefully Fuel Pump etc arrives today before the weekend.
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  5. 17th August 2012, 06:52 AM #5
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    Scouse
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    Have you done a basic fuel pressure check? On the GEMS cars you can carefully push in the valve on the fuel rail. If it just dribbles out, then the pressure is low.
    Scott
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  6. 17th August 2012, 06:57 AM #6
    BusinessConnected
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    Scouse:
    As I said in the initial post I have used the Valve and it squirts a solid stream as far as the Brake Accumulator when pressed....

    I have only done this with the Car off and the Fuel Pump Primed by turning the Key to the ignition position...

    Is it ok to try this when the Car is On?
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  7. 18th August 2012, 07:04 AM #7
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    glenhendry
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    I didnt see you mention your mileage. Is it original fuel pump?

    If it is, I would be betting on it. Mine lasted till 240kkm and I saw other instances of similar duty cycles. Either way, a new fuel pump cannot be a bad thing.

    However, dropping that tank will be a mission if you just filled it. I did the same thing and cut an access hole.
    Now: 2005 L322 Vogue 4.4 M62TU (Black)
    Before: 2000 P38A HSE 4.6 - stately capability | 2008 Kluger KX-S | 2004 Forester | 2000 Yamaha XJR1300 | 1993 VR Calais | 1974 HQ Statesman - 308 V8 | HT | HK
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  8. 18th August 2012, 07:10 AM #8
    BusinessConnected
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    Glenhendry:
    I'm at almost 300,000km now... I haven't changed the pump in my nearly 100,000km of ownership so I doubt it's been changed.

    I think I'll just sacrifice the Fuel... or let a professional do it on the hoist themselves

    All the bits have arrived from the UK into the Country... should be here Monday.
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  9. 19th August 2012, 06:28 AM #9
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    Mate, long time.
    Sounds like your fuel pump to me - remember when mine was doing the same? I'd replaced my pump before it started misbehaving and thought there was no way it could be the pump - and it was, it had crapped out.
    I had other issues on the car that all happened at once, but start at the pump.
    Jonathan
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  10. 25th August 2012, 10:24 PM #10
    BusinessConnected
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    Bit of an update:
    Haven't driven the Rangie for a week or so, started driving it again on Thursday as the Spare Car (Lexus LS400) has done some Rear Hub Bearings and sounded horrible. Did 250-300km and only ran into some hesistation issues when I was almost home. Engine stopped in the middle of the road, Gearbox Fault came up (I assume because of 0 RPM when moving in gear). Pulled over... let it sit for 20 seconds and restarted the car and went on my way again.

    Nanocom didn't log any Engine Codes, Gearbox Codes were ok as well.
    Only parts replaced before this Trip were the Air Flow Meter & Throttle Position Sensor (because they were quick and easy).

    I managed to get a Fuel Pressure Tester today and have had that running off the Shrader Valvle all day today in my field of vision. I can see "off throttle" pressure is around 30PSI, Full Throttle around 40PSI and General Crusing around 35PSI which all seems "in spec" for a GEMS P38.

    I'm hoping for this issue to occur again whilst I have the Tester fitted so I can confirm once and for all whether there is a "drop" in the Rail Pressure.

    Regards
    Heath
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