winches - plasma rope or wire cable?

i run a steel rope on my pto winch, why? its cheap and i rarely use it i.e. once in 4 years, if the steel rope ever needs replacing i will consider buying plasma............i thinking the wire rope will still be around when i move on

as i could not find an off the shelf fairlead wide enough for the PTO i installed a cast iron hawse fairlead (too narrow as well) but liked the fact that it doesn't protrude to the fron as much as rollers, seems to work but is a pain getting the rope to lay nicely across the drum

What about length. Can you fit the same length of plasma on a winch drum as cable?

Probably a bit more as it lays flat but then you can't spool it neatly onto the drum so you loose a bit there.

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Originally Posted by land864

What about length. Can you fit the same length of plasma on a winch drum as cable?

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i would reckon more.........

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Originally Posted by Hymie

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When I explain to then that SWR should only go from left to right, or right to left depending on the rope Lay I usually get told to go away, sometimes Politely, more often, not.

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Can you explain a bit more? Do you mean the direction the turns of rope go across the drum. Surely the direction reverses with each layer. Perhaps I have completely misunderstood what you meant.

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Originally Posted by clubagreenie

The primary consideration here is that the cheaper winches have the brake inside the drum and so overheat the rope. . ... .. ... ...
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How hot do the brakes get? Why do they get hot? Is the drum really revolving with the brakes applied?

Just curious. I don't even own a winch, but some day I might find myself working with someone who is using one.

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Originally Posted by vnx205

Can you explain a bit more? Do you mean the direction the turns of rope go across the drum. Surely the direction reverses with each layer. Perhaps I have completely misunderstood what you meant.


How hot do the brakes get? Why do they get hot? Is the drum really revolving with the brakes applied?

Just curious. I don't even own a winch, but some day I might find myself working with someone who is using one.

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On low mount winches the brake is housed inside the drum but only works in reverse, eg. if you are letting a vehicle down a ledge or something like that so with careful use a synthetic rope shouldn't be an issue, and most syn ropes are sold with an overwrap (kevlar or nomex ?) for the first few metres of rope so that the first layer on the drum is protected from any potential heat anyway.

I'll leave the wire stuff up to Frank and Hymie as I know about enough to be dangerous :angel:

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Originally Posted by vnx205

Can you explain a bit more? Do you mean the direction the turns of rope go across the drum. Surely the direction reverses with each layer. Perhaps I have completely misunderstood what you meant.

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Not at all mate, here is a bit of advanced Winching theory.


What I am talking about is the lay of the rope and the way ir runs around Snatch Blocks.
For clarity, I use the term Rope to mean Steel Wire Rope.
If you look at a Steel Wire Rope such as these,
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/im...12/02/1554.jpg
You will see that ropes are broken down into Left and Right Hand Lay and Ordinary and Lang Lay.

Ordinary Lay Ropes are used in applications where they are expected to bend, ie around snatch blocks or used as Slings

Lang Lay Ropes are used in Applications such as Bridge Stays where their load is transmitted Longitudinally along the rope length.

The ropes on Recovery winches are mostly Right Hand Ordinary Lay ropes.
What this means is that when setting up recovery tackle, ie Snatch Blocks, the idea is to reeve the rope from left to right through the block, this way, under load the lay of the rope will enable the rope to compress a smidgin and run freely around the Block.
If the rope is "Reverse Reeved" that is run from right to left through the block, under pressure the lay of the rope is forced to twist open and flatten the rope out which, if there is enough tension (Load) on the Rope it may fail catastrophically through the loss of its structural integrity.
If multiple snatch blocks are used it can lead to a bloody great big tangle as everything fights its way to where it wants to be.

Sorry if it's a bit long winded, but if you have any more questions please ask.

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Originally Posted by rick130

On low mount winches the brake is housed inside the drum but only works in reverse, eg. if you are letting a vehicle down a ledge or something like that so with careful use a synthetic rope shouldn't be an issue, and most syn ropes are sold with an overwrap (kevlar or nomex ?) for the first few metres of rope so that the first layer on the drum is protected from any potential heat anyway.

I'll leave the wire stuff up to Frank and Hymie as I know about enough to be dangerous :angel:

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Thus is correct but I'm yet to see a synthetic rope with a overlay that's long enough to cover the entire first wrap anbd is something that is heat insulative.

The cover on most is only there as an indication as to how much should be left on the drum, this "min spooled length" is longer than on a steel rope and is another consideration.

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Originally Posted by weeds

i would reckon more.........

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From memory my Warn 9.5XP came with 98 feet of 8mm wire.

It now accommodates 111 feet of 11mm Dyneema (no winch mods necessary).

Sent using Forum Runner

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Originally Posted by clubagreenie

Thus is correct but I'm yet to see a synthetic rope with a overlay that's long enough to cover the entire first wrap anbd is something that is heat insulative.

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Agreed. And no-one's mentioned overheating a low mount with internal brakes. Wire rope acts as a heat sink, plasma as an insulator.

Contrary to some posts above, I've rarely seen any damage to plasma in self recovery. You don't drag it over rocks, the cable is stationary. It follows though that care is needed when recovering others - you're stationary & the cable is moving.

Plasma is just easier to use, and lasts longer compared to the kinks in wire rope I used to get.

If your plasma does get a bath in mud, it's pretty easy to get all the abrasives out - take it off & chuck it in the washing machine periodically. Getting it on & off is dead easy compared to wire.

Plenty of us convert to plasma and never look back. I have yet to meet anyone who has felt the need to go back to wire.

Regards
Max P