86" Engine options - thoughts/advice?

On first inspection it looked like the original radiator support was still intact, but has been bent to allow the radiator to be repositioned. However I didn't look too carefully so I could be wrong and it's too cold+dark to check now! The original fan shroud also came with the vehicle, though obviously not attached to it.

Lifting the engine would presumably also require lifting or altering the angle of the gearbox to some extent. I recall thinking that the top of the bellhousing was quite close to the transmission tunnel (firewall) so the gearbox might have already been lifted to fit the Holden engine?

Looks like tomorrow morning will be spent measuring and comparing the clearances with an 86" that still has the original engine. Then will come the decision on whether it's easier to swap the engine, or fit (better) brakes from a later model and pay for the certification! Hmmm.

One factor worth thinking about and taking into consideration, is that fitted with the original engine it will certainly be worth more in the future, and the further you look into the future the bigger the difference will get. Most Series 1s are probably already owned by collectors, and collectors prefer originality; and the older the object, the bigger the difference will get.

I don't think this applies yet to Series 2/3, but it is definitely moving in that direction.

John

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Originally Posted by JDNSW

Most Series 1s are probably already owned by collectors, and collectors prefer originality; and the older the object, the bigger the difference will get.

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True, but that suggests the best option is the original 2L engine rather than a 2.25L, which in turn involves the expense, time and effort to rebuild the original engine and further reduces the usability of the vehicle on modern roads. I'm not sure whether a 2.25L is materially more "original" than a Holden, as neither are correct from a rivet-counting viewpoint. In any case I will retain the old 2L motor so it can be refitted in the future if the need arises!

My wife tells me that none of my "toys" are worth anything simply because I won't sell them....... But I do agree that if I was trying to flip this vehicle for the most money then I'd certainly be looking to keep it original.

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Originally Posted by Warb

On first inspection it looked like the original radiator support was still intact, <snip> The original fan shroud also came with the vehicle, though obviously not attached to it. <the usual practice was to cut about 2"from the back of the support and bolt the radiator onto new holes>

Lifting the engine would presumably also require lifting or altering the angle of the gearbox to some extent. I recall thinking that the top of the bellhousing was quite close to the transmission tunnel (firewall) so the gearbox might have already been lifted to fit the Holden engine? <yes Holden engines have an elevated angle on the crankshaft. I'm only suggesting using spacers of ~4-5 mm on either side of the rubber engine mount so you'll probably only get about 10mm but even a little is better than none. So the gearbox will probably be about the same or less than the Holden.>

Looks like tomorrow morning will be spent measuring and comparing the clearances with an 86" that still has the original engine. Then will come the decision on whether it's easier to swap the engine, or fit (better) brakes from a later model and pay for the certification! Hmmm.

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see comments in red.

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Originally Posted by Warb

True, but that suggests the best option is the original 2L engine rather than a 2.25L, which in turn involves the expense, time and effort to rebuild the original engine and further reduces the usability of the vehicle on modern roads......

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I'm not saying this is what you should do, just that you should think of it.

John

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Originally Posted by Lotz-A-Landies

the usual practice was to cut about 2"from the back of the support and bolt the radiator onto new holes

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On this one it looks like the mounting flanges have been bent outwards rather than cut off. New holes have been drilled, but it looks like the excess material is still there and could be panel beaten back to its original position.

I don't know how many original Series I vehicles there are around now. But it seems to me a great pity not to put in the original engine, replace the cross-member and otherwise bring it back to original state. This is a classic car. Whether or not you ever sell it, won't it give you great satisfaction to have it back in original condition?

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Originally Posted by JDNSW

I'm not saying this is what you should do, just that you should think of it.

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I agree, and it's a valid point. My approach in the past has been to avoid making modifications that cannot be undone. That way the vehicle can be improved to make it more usable, whilst being preserved and allowing a return to factory specification should the need arise. To that end, whatever engine ends up in the vehicle the original will still be retained.

I must also say that I have never actually driven a 2L LR on the road. If, with overdrive, it is capable of keeping up with modern traffic at least well enough to avoid having a queue of vehicles jammed up behind it, then I'd be happy to refit it! My suspicion is that it's probably not, though I also own an 86" with a Toro overdrive and the original engine that (when it was younger) was apparently used as a daily driver to commute from Mudgee to Bathurst. So maybe I'm wrong?

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Originally Posted by tonyf

I don't know how many original Series I vehicles there are around now. But it seems to me a great pity not to put in the original engine, replace the cross-member and otherwise bring it back to original state. This is a classic car. Whether or not you ever sell it, won't it give you great satisfaction to have it back in original condition?

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I know what you mean.

My ex-RACQ 1951 80" had a 2 1/4 litre when I bought it, I was obsessive attempting to find a correct period engine (correct number range) for overhaul but even after finding what I thought was an ideal engine, the number matched to the rear axle assembly number rather than the front, so it was out by about 4,000 engines. That was 10 years ago.

Today I'm more pragmatic and I'd probably leave the 2 1/4L. :(

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Originally Posted by tonyf

I don't know how many original Series I vehicles there are around now. But it seems to me a great pity not to put in the original engine, replace the cross-member and otherwise bring it back to original state. This is a classic car. Whether or not you ever sell it, won't it give you great satisfaction to have it back in original condition?

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Another viewpoint is "would you prefer to own a car that takes up space in the shed but can never be enjoyed other than as a piece of history to look at, or a car that can be taken out and used?"

S1's aren't really that rare, there are usually a couple or more on eBay/Gumtree etc., and I know of several within 20km of my farm.

My view is that if the car is kept alive, that's better than it being crushed for scrap. For me, to keep it alive means I want to be able to use it and using it means driving on the road. To drive on the road with good conscience and some degree of safety means it needs to accelerate to 90kph+, not slow down too much on hills, and stop safely. It also needs seatbelts, indicators and other such niceties which were not originally fitted. As I said, I don't know how good or bad the 2L engine really is, but obviously a previous owner of this vehicle didn't think it was good enough!

On the other hand, I still haven't completely decided which way to go.....