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Thread: Lucas M418G Starter Motor - Are these interchangeable

  1. #1
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    Lucas M418G Starter Motor - Are these interchangeable

    Gentlemen,
    I am restoring my 1953 Series 1 80", that is fitted with a 2 litre spreadbore petrol engine.
    The armature on my Lucas M418G Starter Motor is badly worn, and due to poor brush contact, I get very weak cranking. So I am looking into replacing the armature or the entire Starter before it fails completely.

    I've attached an image of my starter, which is very clear marked as Lucas M418G Starter as is fitted with significant casting that supports the front of the drive shaft.

    However, when I search for that model online, I get starters without the integrated drive shaft support.

    Are these toe types of M418G starters interchangeable in a Series 1?

    Also a number of UK sites offer a high torque gear reduction Starter that they claim is a direct replacement for this second types starter.
    Has anyone installed one of these high torque starters in a Series one and found them good?

    Thanks in advance

    regards
    Jeff in Perth
    Attached Images Attached Images

  2. #2
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    Grey Fergy ones are the same.
    Just have to match the Toothed Sprocket.

    whitehillbilly.

  3. #3
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    Hi WhiteHillBilly,
    Yes I believe that a lot of UK vehicles used this same basic Lucas M418G Starter, including Land Rover, Rovers, Jaguars, Humbers, Triumphs and a lot more, but there were differences in the number of teeth and Bendix Diameter, Distance between ring gear and mounting face, number and off set of mounting holes, and turn direction and voltage. The problem is that all of these are called M418G Starters, but they can be very different.

    Series 2, 2A and 3 use the Lucas M418G starter but I don't know if they are interchangeable with my Series 1 M418G. Can anyone jump in with some first hand knowledge?

    best wishes
    Jeff in Perth

  4. #4
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    No they are not interchangeable . What is the problem with yours ? I may know some one in Melbourne that can help you with repairs. He has been dealing with Rover & LR Lucas parts for over 50 years. I can PM his contact details if you want . I know some of the parts are getting hard to get for the early S1 starter motors but I think he has a way around the problem. Some of the early Rover cars P3 & P4 Cyclops used the same starter as the early S1
    I have sent you a PM with Kev's phone number .

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by jedwards View Post
    Gentlemen,
    I am restoring my 1953 Series 1 80", that is fitted with a 2 litre spreadbore petrol engine.
    The armature on my Lucas M418G Starter Motor is badly worn, and due to poor brush contact, I get very weak cranking. So I am looking into replacing the armature or the entire Starter before it fails completely.

    I've attached an image of my starter, which is very clear marked as Lucas M418G Starter as is fitted with significant casting that supports the front of the drive shaft.

    However, when I search for that model online, I get starters without the integrated drive shaft support.

    Are these toe types of M418G starters interchangeable in a Series 1?

    Also a number of UK sites offer a high torque gear reduction Starter that they claim is a direct replacement for this second types starter.
    Has anyone installed one of these high torque starters in a Series one and found them good?

    Thanks in advance

    regards
    Jeff in Perth
    Jeff,

    You might have a spreadbore engine, but you have a siamese flywheel housing and starter. Siamse engines have a starter that pushes into a circular hole in an aluminium casting that is fixed to the flywheel housing with three studs and is located by a large grub screw (bolt) with a lock nut. Spreadbore starters have a two bolt flange that bolts directly to the flywheel housing. You will have to fit the later flywheel, ring gear plus flywheel and bell housings to enable fitting of the later starter.What date is on stamped on the steel housing? It will be in the form of 3 or 4 numbers such as 253 or 1250 depending on the month and year made. Someone has fitted a later motor to an earlier model.
    Good luck! Mike 5380.

  6. #6
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    Thanks Mike,
    You are correct in your description. My Starter is stamped 1153, which means it was the original starter that came with the car when new.
    The engine block was changed by Land Rover in around 1957- 1958 to a 2 litre spread bore.

    I stripped down the starter and found that the commutator was not as bad as I had first thought, and there was plenty of meat left to allow it to be machined flat again with new bushes. Starter Stamped .jpgM418G Starter.jpg
    I don't know what the other numbers mean, but Lucas M418G is clear.
    regards
    Jeff

  7. #7
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    25514 is the correct number for a Siamese 2L 80" and 54 86/107. Engages from front to rear
    25533 Spread bore. Engages rear to front
    As said before it depends on the flywheel and flywheel housing which starter motor to use.
    .W.

  8. #8
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    It just gets too hard and too risky in the end, so have decide to have mine reconditioned by Brian Green in Tambellup. He is old school and really well respected in WA vintage Land Rover Circles. I also wanted to keep the date start on the casing which is 11 53.
    regards
    Jeff

  9. #9
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    Are the teeth of your ring gear bevelled on the gearbox, or the engine side?
    .W.

  10. #10
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    Starter.

    Quote Originally Posted by jedwards View Post
    Thanks Mike,
    You are correct in your description. My Starter is stamped 1153, which means it was the original starter that came with the car when new.
    The engine block was changed by Land Rover in around 1957- 1958 to a 2 litre spread bore.

    I stripped down the starter and found that the commutator was not as bad as I had first thought, and there was plenty of meat left to allow it to be machined flat again with new bushes. Starter Stamped .jpgM418G Starter.jpg
    I don't know what the other numbers mean, but Lucas M418G is clear.
    regards
    Jeff
    Jeff, sorry to burst your bubble, but your 11/53 starter was most likley fitted to a 1954 model 86" or possibly a 107 with an engine nubber starting with 471.
    The 1954 models carried on with the same engine as a 1953 model. Your 1953 model was built between August '52 and around July '53. My RHD CKD '53 chassis number is 1765 and i was built around April May '53 as far as I can tell, so if your chassis is higher or lower , take a guess.The 1954 model year started around August 1953. The long Lucas part number will be for a particular model range. As stated earlier, the M418G series starters were made in a multitude of variations to suit a lot of different makes and models and the part number determines the actual variant for a particular model. Don't worry, the date won't matter. You may have to replace the bendix drive shock absorber sleeve if the rubber is starting to tear.
    Keep at it, you are nearly there! Mike 5380

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