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Thread: HELP NEEDED - TDI and 5 Speed into Series

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Mornington Peninsula
    Posts
    10

    HELP NEEDED - TDI and 5 Speed into Series

    Hi,

    HELP - I am new to working on Landys and new to the word of Forums - I have also posted this in the Series 2/2A section as well.

    I am hoping for some much needed clear information from those who have undertaken the modifications listed below.

    I am seeking clarity around certain components for the build that I am undertaking at present, before I make a purchase (probably with Ashcroft for potentially a gearbox and fit kit).

    I have a 1968 Series 2A Body and Chassis (headlights in rad support panel). The vehicle was originally a 4 cylinder 2.25.
    I have a 300tdi from a manual Discovery (1995) complete with engine mounts.

    I want to mount the 300tdi engine to a modern gearbox - preferably an R380 with a Stumpy Bell Housing (or possibly a LT77s) and use the original Series Transfer Case.

    Is it possible and have the gear shift lever be retained in its factory position and without having to move the front radiator panel forward?

    I understand I have to move the engine forward 102mm however when I look at the engine mounts on the 300tdi engine I have here, it would place the front of the engine too far forward (in front of the standard rad support factory placement.)

    I have seen numerous images of this having been undertaken, but I can't find a decisive chronological description anywhere of what has been done.
    A chap from the UK on the 'Series Land Rover Facebook Page' posted a lovely little red Series vehicle for sale about 5 months ago that was advertised with exactly what I describe - I wished I had quizzed him at the time. Does anyone know the vehicle or the previous owner through the inter web and social media?

    I am aware that there are many other considerations in mounting these units together and the subsequent fitment to the vehicle, however as I understand it - if my scenario is indeed possible, I am confused with regards to the mounting of the engine mounts.

    I would love to see a converted Series vehicle with a 300tdi and 5 speed box, or at least speak with someone who has experience in doing this.

    I look forward to hearing from you.
    Thanks in advance.

    Kindest regards,

    Darren

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Mackay
    Posts
    2,770
    I've done an 88" with 200tdi /R380/LT230 (with part time 4x4 kit) Ashcroft stumpy bell housing, blah blah blah blah. I didn't try to retain the series bonnet and just put a defender bonnet on.

    200tdi mounts are a bit different to the 300tdi I think. Not only did I drag the engine forward but I also lifted it 60mm ish i think, that was to try to keep the R380 from hanging too low.
    You will need custom props too - I've also tinkered with the rear axle position (shhhh) in an attempt to retain a rear prop.
    The disco gear selector is different to a defender so I'd be chasing a defender one.
    Gear selector is in the original position (or near enough) but be ready to ahve to cut and shut the firewall and trans tunnel/seatbox to fit all that extra gearbox in.
    I think the LT230 is a good choice although I would retain constant 4x4 if doing it again.

    IF you have a 109 then you have heaps more room.


    Mine is on the market place atm. there is also a build thread somewhere - search something like "Nick's 1975 88" or maybe "debruiser's 1975 88"" I'm not sure what it was called anymore.

    if you have questions feel free to PM me.



    Edit: Also - if you have a disco engine (and I'm not sure about the 300tdi) at least on a 200tdi depending on wheelbase the chassis rail is a different height and disco turbos foul on it. I used a disco engine with defender manifolds - bolts right up and works fine, also eliminates space issues.

    '13 D90-TF A bar, APT steering guard/drag link/track rod, snorkel, Rijidij dual bar, cruise cntl,150hp Basremap.
    '75 S3 88-200tdi, R380/LT230, 33s, Paras, disco axles, 4.75HD R&P - Parting, PM me
    '89 FFR - ARN49-047 33's, P/S, leaky canvas, snorkel

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Mackay
    Posts
    2,770
    Just a couple pics for fun.
    Attached Images Attached Images

    '13 D90-TF A bar, APT steering guard/drag link/track rod, snorkel, Rijidij dual bar, cruise cntl,150hp Basremap.
    '75 S3 88-200tdi, R380/LT230, 33s, Paras, disco axles, 4.75HD R&P - Parting, PM me
    '89 FFR - ARN49-047 33's, P/S, leaky canvas, snorkel

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Mackay
    Posts
    2,770
    On 2nd thoughts....

    If I were to do this again. I'd:

    - take the disco and remove the body
    - remove the body from the series
    - cut body outriggers and mounts from the series chassis
    - weld those to the disco chassis
    - bolt series body to disco chassis.
    DONE

    and easier. plus you get coils

    Alternately - buy a defender sorry.... just had to through it out there

    '13 D90-TF A bar, APT steering guard/drag link/track rod, snorkel, Rijidij dual bar, cruise cntl,150hp Basremap.
    '75 S3 88-200tdi, R380/LT230, 33s, Paras, disco axles, 4.75HD R&P - Parting, PM me
    '89 FFR - ARN49-047 33's, P/S, leaky canvas, snorkel

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Mornington Peninsula
    Posts
    10

    TDI and 5 speed into series

    Hi Nick,

    Thanks for your replies.
    Nice looking truck.

    Looking at the pics it looks like the rad support panel could have stayed in the factory position - or was this not possible?

    How come you needed new custom prop shafts?

    Thanks for the heads up on the Disco vs Deefer shifter.

    I didn't think I would have to cut the Firewall and seat box etc.... If I had to do this I would abort the idea and stay closer to stock.

    I am wanting the vehicle to look original on the outside and be a little better for performance on the inside.

    I'm off to sleep. speak tomorrow.

    Cheers again

    Darren

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Narre Warren South
    Posts
    4,231
    Have a look in the 'Other Powered Series Land Rover' section, a lot on the 200Tdi conversion.
    Here is a thread on the 300Tdi conversion 300tdi into a Series 3............

    There was a UK based guy that has done a few who was posting, his name is NiteMare.

    Colin
    '56 Series 1 with homemade welder
    '65 Series IIa Dormobile
    '70 SIIa GS
    '76 SIII 88" (Isuzu C240)
    '81 SIII FFR
    '95 Defender Tanami
    '60 SII 109 ute (gone)
    Motorcycles :-
    Vincent Rapide, Panther M100, Norton BIG4, Electra & Navigator, Matchless G80C

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Mackay
    Posts
    2,770
    wait a minute... silly me! That pic of the engine bay is when the engine was on the stock gearbox/trans! IF that was your plan you can keep the firewall intact, bonnet and grill in stock locations.

    OK so
    R380/LT230 sitting in place. Maybe if you were happy to have your gearbox hanging down more you could get away with not cutting the firewall? I dont know. I'm just showing you what I did.

    DSC_0008 (1).jpg

    So you can see here that the engine has come a LONG way forward.

    DSC_0012 (1).jpg

    DSC_0014 (1).jpg


    I've used a 300tdi radiator - I dont remember why I did that.... 200tdi has .... NO! wait! I remember. Because of where I have it the inlet was occupying the same place as the steering relay. If you were to use the stock intercooler and radiator arrangement maybe you could squeeze it all under the bonnet. I never bothered, I wanted to keep it serviceable.

    20160106_132238.jpg

    I needed custom props Because the LT230 is a different length between outputs. ALthouhg I'm pretty sure by the time you got your 300/R380/adapter/trans together I think you'd find your trans wouldn't be sitting in the same spot anymore - depending on how you locate it I guess. What are you going to use for your datum line; gear lever? rear output? front engine pulley fitting behind radiator?


    Another couple of things to contemplate:
    - Battery location: some ppl seem to put them above the injector pump, I put mine under the passenger seat. I'm glad I did - with parabolics the front was getting heavy and moving some weight back I think kept it happier.
    - Air box: what airbox will you use? and where will you stash it? I always hated my arrangement, and wanted to move it.

    '13 D90-TF A bar, APT steering guard/drag link/track rod, snorkel, Rijidij dual bar, cruise cntl,150hp Basremap.
    '75 S3 88-200tdi, R380/LT230, 33s, Paras, disco axles, 4.75HD R&P - Parting, PM me
    '89 FFR - ARN49-047 33's, P/S, leaky canvas, snorkel

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Mornington Peninsula
    Posts
    10
    Hi Nick and Colin,

    Thanks for your replies... much appreciated. I will check out the link and the alternate forum section.

    Thanks fr the pics Nick.
    I was planning on placing the battery in a storage box behind the passenger seat secured through the floor and run a dual batt system.
    Not sure what air box yet but I have the original Disco unit and was going to try that as per the Steve Parker website.

    I made some measurements today (close approximate measures) on my chassis worked out where the Series Bell housing would normally mate to the rear of the Series motor and added 102mm for the longer r380 stumpy and then measured the 300tdi without the clutch fan and worked out that I have very little space remaining for the radiator and intercooler.
    If the vehicle had the lights in the guards instead of the rad support I think it could be made to work but I lose approximately 90mm in the depth of the headlights protruding backward meaning the radiator is pushed backward toward the front of the engine.

    Cheers,

    Darren

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Narre Warren South
    Posts
    4,231
    Also have a look here 300 TDI ENGINE CONVERSION INTO SERIES LAND ROVERS

    This company (in the UK) make a lot of parts needed for the conversion.
    Common in the UK to use the 200Tdi or 300Tdi engine from a rusted out Disco. Annual MOT test (roadworthy) there so many vehicles get scrapped because it's too expensive to weld up the rust damage caused by the use of rocksalt on the roads in winter.

    A quick Google throws up lots of info, YouTube videos etc.



    Colin
    '56 Series 1 with homemade welder
    '65 Series IIa Dormobile
    '70 SIIa GS
    '76 SIII 88" (Isuzu C240)
    '81 SIII FFR
    '95 Defender Tanami
    '60 SII 109 ute (gone)
    Motorcycles :-
    Vincent Rapide, Panther M100, Norton BIG4, Electra & Navigator, Matchless G80C

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Mackay
    Posts
    2,770
    Quote Originally Posted by gromit View Post
    Also have a look here 300 TDI ENGINE CONVERSION INTO SERIES LAND ROVERS

    This company (in the UK) make a lot of parts needed for the conversion.
    Common in the UK to use the 200Tdi or 300Tdi engine from a rusted out Disco. Annual MOT test (roadworthy) there so many vehicles get scrapped because it's too expensive to weld up the rust damage caused by the use of rocksalt on the roads in winter.

    A quick Google throws up lots of info, YouTube videos etc.



    Colin

    Google is a wealth of knowledge! Thats how I found most of my info, although I used the suck-it-and-see approach too.

    '13 D90-TF A bar, APT steering guard/drag link/track rod, snorkel, Rijidij dual bar, cruise cntl,150hp Basremap.
    '75 S3 88-200tdi, R380/LT230, 33s, Paras, disco axles, 4.75HD R&P - Parting, PM me
    '89 FFR - ARN49-047 33's, P/S, leaky canvas, snorkel

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