Results 1 to 6 of 6

Thread: Diagnosing that clunk

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2020
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    8
    Total Downloaded
    0

    Diagnosing that clunk

    Hi guys,

    So far the overhaul/inspection is going well but there are still a few niggles I am trying to work out.

    The main thing is the clunk when I change gears. I don't think it's the clutch or selector, and it seems to be reproducible when I suddenly take my foot off the accelerator/when changing gear. It's a higher pitched clunk than the rear diff. It was suggested in the introduction thread that it might be drive washers. I was also wondering about the main shaft in the gearbox. Just wondering if there were any suggestions as to how to go about diagnosing the issue?

    I am also having trouble with second gear, occasionally it is like there is no synchro ring and it just grinds when I try and go from third to second. Maybe 1 shift in 20? The gearbox was meant to have been recond about 40-50k ago (with short shift and higher speed gears) so a little surprised to be having these issues. Wondering if the dragging handbrake has caused premature wear?

    With the clunk in the rear diff, can the backlash be adjusted without taking the diff out? I know not ideal, but if I can get it close and it will give me more life before doing a proper recon it might be worth it.

    I am also wondering about the front spring bushings. They look pretty hard and worn, what kind of symptoms appear with the worn bushings? clunking going over bumps and a bit of steering wander?

    Last thing, after setting the preload I have noticed a bit of oil weeping from each of the ball joints on inspection this evening. I will clean it off and recheck in a day or two but wondering if it is common for this to happen and is it a sign of buggered seals? there isn't any pitting etc

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    50
    Total Downloaded
    0

    Steering queries,

    Hello, I can tell you of my slowly increasing concerns about my steering. It was very heavy, and it would occasionally get that vile resonant steering wobble after a bump.I thought I'd checked all the obvious things including lubrication in the steering box near the master brake cylinder (not enough), end float in the meshing gars in that box (ok), tie rod ends, all okay, and the long vertical steering thingy on the right of the radiator grille: lubricated and bolted in very tight, okay.
    I was later really surprised when I had jacked up the front axle for some reason, and found a lot of free play in both front wheels' steering bearings, when I pushed the top of the rim and pulled at the bottom. It was far too much. I got overhaul kits, it took about a day per side, and the wear was pretty well all in the bits that stick into the railko bearing at the top of the housing. They were both very corroded and reduced in diameter by corrosion; not by wear. it took about a day per side to overhaul, and i didn't refill the ball joint with oil, instead I used one-shot grease. Despite minor ball pitting on one side only, there has been no leakage through the seals, the rattles have gone, and the vile steering wobble is a thing of the past.

    I wonder if some time a long time ago, the front axle went into deep water, and the corroded part remained wet because it couldn't dry, or be washed with oil because it is at the top of the steering housing. I've found no other evidence anywhere else of deep water corrosion. I guess I'll never know, but the service kits and grease were reasonably priced and fixed all these woes... for the moment!

    Anyway, food for thought,
    Cheers, Mike.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Black Rock
    Posts
    997
    Total Downloaded
    0
    The main thing is the clunk when I change gears. I don't think it's the clutch or selector, and it seems to be reproducible when I suddenly take my foot off the accelerator/when changing gear.

    Most likely a combination of wear. First check would be propeller shafts and universal joints, then work your way along the drivetrain. Leaving the handbrake off and gearbox and transfer case in neutral (umm, chock the wheels!) simply look for play in the prop shafts and uni joints by holding either side and twisting. The prop shaft splines should have no lateral movement and ideally no play in the splines. The uni joints should have no play whatsoever and clean grease should be pushed out of each seal when greasing. Look for water and dirt coming out. Any movement in the prop shafts will travel through the gearbox and transfer case making further diagnosis difficult, so sort that out first. If in doubt drop the prop shafts at the gearbox, then use the output flanges to feel for clunks through the various gears and hi/low range settings.

    I am also having trouble with second gear, occasionally it is like there is no synchro ring and it just grinds when I try and go from third to second. Maybe 1 shift in 20? The gearbox was meant to have been recond about 40-50k ago (with short shift and higher speed gears) so a little surprised to be having these issues. Wondering if the dragging handbrake has caused premature wear?

    Could be syncro or perhaps the clutch not disengaging fully. Can't see a dragging handbrake affecting the syncro, but it will cause lots of clunking. Handbrake is quite easy to overhaul.

    With the clunk in the rear diff, can the backlash be adjusted without taking the diff out? I know not ideal, but if I can get it close and it will give me more life before doing a proper recon it might be worth it.

    The preload can be adjusted without removing the diff. The Salisbury has a collapsible spacer, so be careful not to overtighten it. The Rover diff has shims. Both should be adjusted without the new pinion seal fitted, then you undo it, fit the seal and tighten up the flange to where it was set. You'll get a better feel for the state of the diffs with the prop shafts removed.

    I am also wondering about the front spring bushings. They look pretty hard and worn, what kind of symptoms appear with the worn bushings? clunking going over bumps and a bit of steering wander?

    If you hear a clunking seeming to come from under your feet, then it's probably the springs sliding on the bushes and/or the chassis bush moving or broken. A number of things may need to be fixed. Wandering can be caused by improperly set springs, loose U bolts and worn steering components. Get someone to sit in the car and turn the wheel while you lie underneath and feel for movement. You'll soon find where the play is coming from. Also check for play in the swivel pin housings.

    Last thing, after setting the preload I have noticed a bit of oil weeping from each of the ball joints on inspection this evening. I will clean it off and recheck in a day or two but wondering if it is common for this to happen and is it a sign of buggered seals? there isn't any pitting etc

    Aaah! To properly set the preload you need to remove the seal. Clean it properly and pack it with grease before refitting onto a clean ball joint. You have to remove the ball joint to actually replace the seal, although there are two piece seals available but I've never used them so can't comment.
    2013 D4 expedition equipped
    1966 Army workshop trailer
    (previously SII 2.25 swb, SIII 2.25 swb & lwb, P38 Vogue, 1993 LSE 3.9V8 then HS2.8)

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Black Rock
    Posts
    997
    Total Downloaded
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Cerise View Post
    Hello, I can tell you of my slowly increasing concerns about my steering. It was very heavy, and it would occasionally get that vile resonant steering wobble after a bump.I thought I'd checked all the obvious things including lubrication in the steering box near the master brake cylinder (not enough), end float in the meshing gars in that box (ok), tie rod ends, all okay, and the long vertical steering thingy on the right of the radiator grille: lubricated and bolted in very tight, okay.
    I was later really surprised when I had jacked up the front axle for some reason, and found a lot of free play in both front wheels' steering bearings, when I pushed the top of the rim and pulled at the bottom. It was far too much. I got overhaul kits, it took about a day per side, and the wear was pretty well all in the bits that stick into the railko bearing at the top of the housing. They were both very corroded and reduced in diameter by corrosion; not by wear. it took about a day per side to overhaul, and i didn't refill the ball joint with oil, instead I used one-shot grease. Despite minor ball pitting on one side only, there has been no leakage through the seals, the rattles have gone, and the vile steering wobble is a thing of the past.

    I wonder if some time a long time ago, the front axle went into deep water, and the corroded part remained wet because it couldn't dry, or be washed with oil because it is at the top of the steering housing. I've found no other evidence anywhere else of deep water corrosion. I guess I'll never know, but the service kits and grease were reasonably priced and fixed all these woes... for the moment!

    Anyway, food for thought,
    Cheers, Mike.
    You'll probably find that you're the first person to ever overhaul the swivel pin housings, so the symptoms you had and the remedy you found sound right to me. I'm not a fan of the one-shot grease, but you can worry about that in twenty years time when you do the job again!
    In what condition were the uni joints in the axles? If they weren't rusted then I doubt your water theory. Rust and corrosion in the Railko bushes is usual, particularly where free wheeling hubs have been fitted. The little spacer things get crushed over time and block any oil getting in, so perhaps condensation causes the corrosion.
    2013 D4 expedition equipped
    1966 Army workshop trailer
    (previously SII 2.25 swb, SIII 2.25 swb & lwb, P38 Vogue, 1993 LSE 3.9V8 then HS2.8)

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    50
    Total Downloaded
    0
    Hi, thanks for the feedback. The universal joints had no detectable signs of wear at all, much to my relief. They were still in a slurry of one-shot grease and gear oil, and seemed to be very happy in there.
    The landy is regulrly used on a step hill that cannot be climbed in 2WD, so the front drive is regularly used in anger and it has never given me any grief.
    Now, that was a brave statement...

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Irymple, Victoria, Australia
    Posts
    2,900
    Total Downloaded
    0
    Incorrectly adjusted or dragging handbrake can result in a clunking noise.

    Cheers, Mick.
    1974 S3 88 Holden 186.
    1971 S2A 88
    1971 S2A 109 6 cyl. tray back.
    1964 S2A 88 "Starfire Four" engine!
    1972 S3 88 x 2
    1959 S2 88 ARN 111-014
    1959 S2 88 ARN 111-556
    1988 Perentie 110 FFR ARN 48-728 steering now KLR PAS!
    REMLR 88
    1969 BSA Bantam B175

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Search AULRO.com ONLY!
Search All the Web!