Synthetic Fuels

[gromit]

Not sure if this really counts as an alternate energy....

Talking with a mate in the UK and he mentioned that Germany were pursuing the production of synthetic fuels.
They did this during the war as they had no access to oil.

The UK was against synthetic fuels but as Germany continue with development they may accept it as a viable alternative as long as 'green energy' is used to produce it.

Synthetic fuels | Bosch Global



Colin

[JDNSW]

German synthetic fuel in WW2 was largely made from brown coal. Very inefficiently. Not exactly green.

[PerthDisco]

A large part of the success in winning WW2 was high octane fuel from the USA that allowed the Spitfire’s Merlin engine to get more and more powerful and totally dominate the German’s fighters.

[NavyDiver]

Read an amazing book about the Haber Bosch process and histroy. "The Alchemy Of Air: A Jewish Genius, a Doomed Tycoon, and the Scientific Discovery That Fed the World but Fueled the Rise of Hitler

"

A scientist from Perth suggested I read in in relation to SCALE.
"Haber-Bosch process for creating synthetic ammonia, which is crucial for producing the fertilizer needed to feed the seven billion or so people on Earth today. In Hager’s phrase, it turns air into bread."

The fuel was just a part of the amazing yarn. Gold from Seawater to pay for WW1 war reparations and a lot more

On Synthetic fuel "ethylene jet fuel" made from plastic or C02 is a real maybe could be NOT INVESTMENT ADVISE

"LanzaTech has chosen TechnipFMC’s Hummingbird ethanol-to-ethylene technology to combine with its own Alcohol-to-Jet (ATJ) technology for the manufacturing of sustainable aviation fuel (SAF) with ethanol serving as raw material.


LanzaJet, which is a spin-off sustainable aviation fuel company of LanzaTech, is the sole licensor of the ATJ technology."

It was from "Canada’s leading integrated energy company, Suncor Energy Inc., and leading Japanese trading and investment company, Mitsui & Co., Ltd. (Mitsui), are investing $15 million and $10 million, respectively, to establish LanzaJet. The funding will be used to build a demonstration plant that will produce 10 million gallons per year of SAF and renewable diesel starting from sustainable ethanol sources."


Not sure if ethanol will work in Landrovers with outs some modifications. e10 would I assume in petrol ones.

[JDNSW]

A large part of the success in winning WW2 was high octane fuel from the USA that allowed the Spitfire’s Merlin engine to get more and more powerful and totally dominate the German’s fighters.

Yes, although arguably it was research mainly by Harry Ricardo and advances in oil refining technology that directed what was needed and how to get there. Fuel for the allied operations in Europe mainly came from US fields, fuel for the Pacific operations came to a small extent from the US, but mostly from Middle East fields. (Simply a matter of distance - remember that most US oil production at the time was in the Gulf coast and Pennsylvania, and there were no pipelines to the West Coast.)

And there lies another interesting tale of fuels. In 1917, British and French aircraft used straight run petrol from Middle East crudes. This was relatively high octane (although the concept of octane was not understood at the time) due to its high aromatic content. When the USA entered the war in that year, one of their first acts to help was to supply large quantities of petrol which was straight run refined from West Texas crude, which, containing mainly unbranched hydrocarbons, yielded low octane petrol. This led to many engine failures in British and French aircraft and ultimately to the discovery of the causes of this, mainly by Ricardo. (And interestingly, due to the increasing domination of US domestic supplies by the same low octane fuel, to Ford dropping the compression ratio of the Model T from 5.5 to 4.5) The issue was largely removed by the discovery by Midge of the effects of adding tetraethyl lead to petrol in the late 1920s. This was used to raise the octane rating of the fuel as requested by Rolls Royce as they improved the superchargers on the Merlin, alytthough it was also supplemented by water injection nitrous oxide injection (both also from Ricardo).

In WW2, the British got their own back, sort of. When the US entered the war, Britain supplied aviation fuel from the Middle East to the Pacific war effort. The Americans soon found that the high aromatic content of this fuel dissolved the synthetic rubber self sealing liners in their fuel tanks (the British of course, used liners that were resistant to this).

[gromit]

German synthetic fuel in WW2 was largely made from brown coal. Very inefficiently. Not exactly green.

That was back then, things have moved on.....

The big issue will be cost until production ramps up. You can use the current distribution system (tankers, servos etc) no need to replace your IC powered vehicle.

What are synthetic fuels and how are they made? | Repsol

Synthetic fuel is just another potential option but if you're creating hydrogen to produce it why not run IC engines on hydrogen or use a fuel cell, well apart from setting up a distribution network.
Cummins have fuel cells to power trucks Just a moment...
Just the distribution to sort out.


Colin

[Tins]

There are a number of hydrogen stations in operation, construction or late planning already. It’s hard to see it being a whole lot more difficult than LPG distribution, and we managed that 50 years ago.

[BradC]

if you're creating hydrogen to produce it why not run IC engines on hydrogen

Because it has such a low octane that it tends to detonate most internal combustion engines to bits. The Wankel being a prominent exception. They're just not feasible for other reasons. I believe there are now some diesels that can use ~95% Hydrogen where available, but plenty have been working on the technology for years and not making huge progress.

It's also a ****load (metric not imperial) easier to transport a couple of thousand litres of liquid than compressed hydrogen.

[Tins]

Toyota seem to think it’s feasible: Hydrogen Refuelling Stations | Mirai | Toyota AU

[101RRS]

So does Hyundai. In the ACT there is one hydrogen refilling station and the hydrogen is generated on site.