Thread: Blown spicer yokes S2B front swivels.

Originally Posted by JDNSW

It is quite possible that the changeover was simply because ENV no longer was prepared to make them in small numbers for a single user. Or in fact, the supplier may have gone bust - a popular exercise in the UK motor industry round that time.

John

John

I rather think it would be mostly the former - the E in E.N.V. refers to Eaton the same people who still make truck diffs and gearboxes however the N may relate to Nuffield - the Morris manufacturer and the nationalising of the British motor industry at the time may have resulted in abandoning the joint venture.

I would love to know.

Diana

Just a few points
My 101 is legal and stamped by Landrover to have a payload of 1.5 tonne giving a gross vehicle mass from memory 3.7 tonne.
The rated landrover maximum towed load is two tonnes as marked on the vehicle by Landrover.
Legal on Aussie roads as used by the Aussie army.
The ambulance version is about one tonne heavier than standard and is fairly top heavy in which the standard parabolics handle the load well.
One must remember the designed use of the 101 which is a GUN TRACTOR.
In the early 1970s army convoys didnt need to go any faster than 40 mph when towing a gun and troops and ammo in the back.
The gearing on the 101 reflects this cruising speed and the pulling power required.
The Aust Army mark 3,4 and 5 of the time does its thing at 40 mph doing a similar job.( gun tractor )
The 101 is designed to be air transportable inside air aircraft and out side.
one of the design requirements is to be dropped by aircraft.......a good reason to have stiff spring rates.
A great factor in using the Salisbury diff on the 101 was light weight so the vehicle could meet the Two tonne weight specs and this could only be used with constant 4WD system to spread the torque.
ENV diffs are too heavy.
Note the use of large throttle settings in 1st and 2nd gear low range on a 101 is not recommended by Landrover.
Garry you will find when you have done a few miles behind the wheel of a 101 the parabolics shine on a corragated road if the shocks are OK.
Yes the 101 would have been better with coils like a Unimog.
Many years a go the Aussie Army had a test track with a one foot square by one foot deep standard pot hole.
When vehicles like the Pinzquazer was tried over it , they rode fantistic and the suspension fell out of them after 20000 miles.
Landrover learnt many years ago at that time if the the driver could feel the bumps , the driver would slow down to a reasonable level.
Right or wrong the 101 has a stiff suspension.
I have a series Three front drive axle at home just like the above photos and it is interesting to compare the 101 drive axles with a standard Landrover one early or late model and for diameter/ size the 101 drive axle is in a completely larger size class and are not the weakest link in a 101 drive train.
I have done much checking of this lately for the proposed fitting of a front locker to my 101.
The Salisbury was on the 101 was done to save weight.
One must remember the designed roll of a vehicle.
The 101 was never for a civie market and was designed for and by the miltary from the ground up and thats why it was so different to any other Landrover
Ron

I must go an see the build of the Land Rover Llama at the Dunsfold collection one day. It should answer some of these questions.


(Image courtesy Series 2 Club UK)

After all it was the planned replacement for the S2B and may well have used some of the 101" bits making both vehicles no longer orphans. The artists impressions I have show the Llama in olive drab being used as a gun tractor. In the photos of the last of the prototypes, it is using 5 stud wheels but with what resemble early Maxidrive drive flanges.

Out of Interest the S2B is not labeled with any weights, however from the 1967 110 Brochure the specs are:

Payloads:
Roadwork 2 persons + 1525Kg
Cross-country 2 persons + 1270 Kg

Weights:
Unladen + 5 Gal. fuel 1970,8 Kg

Maximum allowable gross weight
Roadwork 3742 Kg
Cross-country 3488 Kg

Maximum drawbar pull: 1975 Kg

Hi Ron - Correct as always - I got my load numbers from a document I was reading - in view of your post I went and checked my ID plate - yep towing is 2 Tonne, max Gross wt is 3652kg, front axle 1848kg, rear 1910kg. With an unloaded weight this does make the 101 a 1.5 tonner.

Interestingly the 101 handbook does list the 101 as a 1 tonner with a gross rate of 3143kg and lower front and rear load limits. I cannot find the tow limit but I do recall it somewhere being listed as 1.5tonne.

So it would seem the Australian 101s GS models have a larger capacity than the Brit equivalents.

As far as the suspension goes - we tend to drive our 101s unloaded at at times forget they are a truck - so the suspension probably works best with about a tonne of gear inside.

Dianna - the Llama was a not a replacement for the series 2B FC as it was designed much later - but a vehicle to be use as a replacement for the 101 but was designed around the chassis, suspension etc of a 110 landie.

There are a number of sources of information on the Llama but this is as good as any Land Rover Llama - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Cheers

Garry

Originally Posted by garrycol

....

As far as the suspension goes - we tend to drive our 101s unloaded at at times forget they are a truck - so the suspension probably works best with about a tonne of gear inside.
........

Garry

Not just the 101 - this morning I cut a load of wood, and was reminded again how much better the ride of the 2a is with a tonne of firewood in the back! Most Landrovers, certainly the Series and 90/110/Defender are designed as utility vehicles with good load carrying capability, and except for a few cases such as the County with load leveller, this means that they will have a harsh ride when unloaded.

John

Originally Posted by garrycol

... Diana - the Llama was a not a replacement for the series 2B FC as it was designed much later - but a vehicle to be use as a replacement for the 101 but was designed around the chassis, suspension etc of a 110 landie.

There are a number of sources of information on the Llama but this is as good as any Land Rover Llama - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Cheers

Garry

I think we are being a bit pedantic here (wot me) if you read your own quoted source it makes the statement "the Llama was intended to be sold on both the military and civilian markets."

I don't know where the "much later" comes from, the 101 was only produced between 1975 and 1978 Land Rover 101 Forward Control - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia which in fact means that 101 and S2B production were in parallel production for all but 2 years. "In South Africa, SIIBs were made until 1976" Wouter's page : Series II Forward Control FAQ and it is likely that the SA military were in need or replacement of their S2B at the same time as the MoD were replacing the 101".

The 101 was never produced as a civilian vehicle and hence the Llama with plans for dual military and civilian production and that it was heavily based on the Land Rover 110, just like the S2B 110 was heavily based on the Land Rover 109, makes the Llama a replacement for both 101 and S2B.

Cheers
Diana

Diana,

There is nothing wrong with a bit of pedanticism amongst formites. It is not as if it is rare on AULRO.

Garry

True

Too True!