Ford may have put the last nail in the coffin for the defender.

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Originally Posted by Lotz-A-Landies

Dougal

Boost has it's place and allowed diesel engines to meet some of the higher emission controls in Europe and North America, although in doing so it puts a little more stress on the engine, however when is 2.4 litres of boosted capacity the equal of the Nissan 4.2 litres of boosted capacity for example.

What I don't really understand is why didn't they standardise the TDV6 across the whole range of LR products or at least offer it as a third option? :(

Diana

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Of course more boost stresses an engine more. But if the engine is built to take that stress, it's a moot point.

A 2.4 turbo running 15psi boost is capable of more power and torque than a 4.2L NA. When you factor in the extra internal friction (which reduces fuel economy), weight and space that a 4.2L takes up it's an easy choice to make.
Some modern diesels run up to 45psi boost and last quite well. Sure there are others that don't last, but that's always been the case. Just now the failures are a bit more spectacular and the internet spreads word faster.

When you also consider tax brackets based on engine size that many countries have, smaller and higher boosted engines make a lot more sense.

TDV6 would need a whole new drivetrain wouldn't it?

If the capacity was biggger, it wouldnt need as much boost, nor would it need all the complicated bits............

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Originally Posted by Dougal

When you also consider tax brackets based on engine size that many countries have, smaller and higher boosted engines make a lot more sense.

TDV6 would need a whole new drivetrain wouldn't it?

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The UK is the main culprit for engine size tax brackets.

The principle markets where Land Rover is in it's element, they have long distances and probably weight based tax schemes, if any scheme at all.

The TDV6 already has the majority of a drivetrain out of the Disco 3. Just re-tool for live beam axles (and please leave a nice little Salisbury in the rear.)

Diana

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Originally Posted by mark2

If the capacity was biggger, it wouldnt need as much boost, nor would it need all the complicated bits............

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Bigger capacity means more weight, more space needed and higher fuel consumption. Not to mention noise and vibration concerns.
What are these complicated bits you're talking about? If you're referring to commonrail injection and variable vane turbos then you'll find they're necessary to meet emissions controls.

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Originally Posted by Dougal

Bigger capacity means more weight

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But Dougal - bigger capacity means there are bigger holes inside the engine and they are filled with air! :D:D:D:D

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Originally Posted by Dougal

... more space needed...

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We are talking about an engine bay that already takes a V8

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Originally Posted by Dougal

... higher fuel consumption. ...

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Won't argue with that one

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Originally Posted by Dougal

....Not to mention noise and vibration concerns. ...
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Actually the more cylinders, particularly pairs on a four stroke engine, means less vibration. In a 4 cylinder there is one power stroke every half revolution, this is a major vibrating force. In a 6 cylinder it is one power stroke every third of a revolution and an eight cylinder one in every quarter revolution.

The more frequently there is a power stroke the more constant the power and the less vibration. The worst engine for vibration is a single cylinder. The same goes for noise suppression.

This is also true of gearboxes, in comparing engines of similar capacity and developed horsepower. The same gearbox will withstand an eight cylinder engine better than a four cylinder. Just look at the LT95 and the V8 3.9 Rover and the same gearbox in the 4BD1 3.9 Isuzu. The gearboxes last much longer behind the V8.

Just my opinion. (But I do have a lead foot - so give me cubes always :D:D:D:D)
Diana

Easy solution, forget 4 and 5 cyl, forget N/A Diesels and just go drop in a V8 Turbo Diesel, nice and smoothe, can destroy a gearbox in seconds but it would be a few fun seconds.

Thats what I call the best of both worlds, the compromise is how much it would cost to fit on the line and what engine to use.

They could use the TDV6 but a V8 TD would be sooooooo much better lol :D

I'll shut up now and get back in my 300TDI and wish.:(

The transit and engine are good trucks and are the back bone of the uk. They say in the Uk, everyone by the age of 16 has been in one, and that is fact .
There are millions of them over there. Every trade use them. None of this ute with open back in the uk, people would nick your stuff if you did that in the uk, plus the rain. :)
They are the truck that the competion wants to beat. Putting the engien from a transit in a land rover would do land rover very good as everyone (in the UK) knows and already trust the engine

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Originally Posted by Reads90

The transit and engine are good trucks and are the back bone of the uk. They say in the Uk, everyone by the age of 16 has been in one, and that is fact .
There are millions of them over there. Every trade use them. None of this ute with open back in the uk, people would nick your stuff if you did that in the uk, plus the rain. :)
They are the truck that the competion wants to beat. Putting the engien from a transit in a land rover would do land rover very good as everyone (in the UK) knows and already trust the engine

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Well Mate!!, since putting up this post i thought i'll hang back with the replys and see what the overall opinion is in time. I think you have summed it up very well, i hope for landrovers sake you have, the future for the defender depends on sales, reliability is one of the key issues in regard to this!

Cheers Sumo:D

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Originally Posted by Lotz-A-Landies

But Dougal - bigger capacity means there are bigger holes inside the engine and they are filled with air! :D:D:D:D

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Nice one.:D

Sure a small V8 coiuld fit, but a 6 is out of the question unless you're talking tiny cylinders.
I've got the 4BD1T in my truck, I can assure you that bigger cylinders do shake more than little ones. 8 4BD1T cylinders would rip apart anything fitted to less than an 8 ton truck.

The TDV8 and suitable drivetrain would probably double the cost of a defender. Might double the sales in some markets too.