For those with "breathy" diesels and oily intercoolers

So how does the filter media shed the oil?
Do the small droplets build up to saturation, then it runs back down the surface?

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Originally Posted by isuzurover

The provent housing has a valve in the cap which pops open and vents to atmosphere if the pressure on the crankcase/provent inlet gets too high.

So in your example, if the engine blows a ring, the flow rate of gas into the crankcase increases, as does the pressure in the crankcase and the pressure drop across the filter. The valve then opens, and the result is you have an oily engine bay, but the motor is fine as none of the oil gets into the intake.

(as someone else mentioned, there is a one-way valve for the drain, or you can run it into a catch can and manually return it if worried).

It really is a pretty well designed bit of kit.

If you need further convincing I can take a pic of the valve ;) :D




The filter media in the provents would be more efficient than a K**&**N if you used it as an air filter...

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Not having seen one installed or disected That'd be tops Im only going off what was in the PDF file at first glance Ive not had major problems with oil getting out of big reds donk but then Im pretty finniky with maintenance.

If they are as good as advertised Id be interested in getting my hands on one for kermit. (may his axles turn under his own power again)

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Originally Posted by Dougal

So how does the filter media shed the oil?
Do the small droplets build up to saturation, then it runs back down the surface?

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Funny you should ask that, been doing R&D in this area for the last 8 years or so. The oil mist is initially captured just like dust is in an air filter. Only difference is the oil mist is liquid, so can coalesce on the filter fibres. When the droplets are large enough, they are drained from the fibre/filter by a combination of drag and gravity. The pics should help - note this is an idealised/model filter - used for microscale lab experiments only.

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p...ibre_angle.jpg

OK guys, great news.

I contacted MANN+HUMMEL for some prices, and we have agreed that it would be useful data for us to do a field test among landie owners.

So there will be 20 elements available for litte to no cost (i.e. <$30 for the housing and filter element, and possibly FREE).

There are however a few conditions (aren't there always ;) ).
(1) You will need to fit the system yourself at own cost ASAP after delivery.
(2) After a certain number of KM that WE specify, you will need to remove the filter element, and send it to me (in a sealed plastic bag so oil doesn't get everywhere).
(3) Will need to give us info on what oil you run, how often you change oil and filters, hom many KM on engine, etc. If you do oil analysis, all the better.

WE would prefer people who do high annual km (e.g. 20k km +) , so we have the results faster.

So IF you are interested, please PM me with contact details, engine details AND how many KM per year on average.

I will try and do this on a first come first served basis, but we may end up going with 20x the same engine (but maybe not).

Ben, I wouldn't mind fitting one to my 4BD1-T, when it goes into the rangie soon.

The 4BD1-T has a catch can and vents to atmosphere. I think I will have to connect it to the turbo inlet this time, so a provent would be on my list.

What I would like to know is how critical is the configuration as indicated by page 8 in the document at the link given above?

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Originally Posted by Bush65

Ben, I wouldn't mind fitting one to my 4BD1-T, when it goes into the rangie soon.

The 4BD1-T has a catch can and vents to atmosphere. I think I will have to connect it to the turbo inlet this time, so a provent would be on my list.

What I would like to know is how critical is the configuration as indicated by page 8 in the document at the link given above?

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Hi John - page 8 is an order/data form for me??? Do you mean figure 2?

The configuration isn't very critical. You need to connect the breather to the inlet, the drain to either the sump or attach a catch can below (can be sealed), and the outlet to either the air inlet (pre turbo) or to atmosphere. There is a (momentary) valve on the outlet which will restrict or shut down flow if the pressure drops to low (if the vacuum in the intake is too high).

Hope that answers your question?

It should be mounted as close to vertical as possible for optimal performance.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by isuzurover

Hi John - page 8 is an order/data form for me??? Do you mean figure 2?

The configuration isn't very critical. You need to connect the breather to the inlet, the drain to either the sump or attach a catch can below (can be sealed), and the outlet to either the air inlet (pre turbo) or to atmosphere. There is a (momentary) valve on the outlet which will restrict or shut down flow if the pressure drops to low (if the vacuum in the intake is too high).

Hope that answers your question?

It should be mounted as close to vertical as possible for optimal performance.

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Thanks, I didn't think it would be critical, but was curious after reading page 8 - a form for data that MANN+HUMMEL want to configure the ProVent.

I would need a laboratory to be able to provide some of the data:
Blow-by gas flow rate
Blow-by oil content upstream from the ProVent

Only the engine manufacturer could provide the "Permissible crankcase pressure min./max."

And maybe EPA or other legislation for "Permissible oil content downstream from ProVent".

This may apply to an engine manufacturer who orders a large number of units for new vehicles.

It would be cost prohibitive if MANN+H had to configure individual units to suit each engine - some of the data is going to be different among the same basic engine.

The TD5 has some provision to limit oil mist. I wonder how effective it is.

Crankcase ventilation
The Td5 engine features an innovative solution in the control of crankcase emissions. The new system ensure that very low levels of oil mist enters the combustion process or escapes to the atmosphere. The new rocker cover has cast into it five circular, sequentially positioned chambers (see figure below). These chambers force the oil mist into a cyclononic movement from one chamber to the next. As the mist races around each chamber, any oil particles are flung to the chamber walls where it then collects and falls back into the cylinder head via the two air inlet holes located at each end of the rocker cover.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bush65

Thanks, I didn't think it would be critical, but was curious after reading page 8 - a form for data that MANN+HUMMEL want to configure the ProVent.

I would need a laboratory to be able to provide some of the data:
Blow-by gas flow rate
Blow-by oil content upstream from the ProVent

Only the engine manufacturer could provide the "Permissible crankcase pressure min./max."

And maybe EPA or other legislation for "Permissible oil content downstream from ProVent".

This may apply to an engine manufacturer who orders a large number of units for new vehicles.

It would be cost prohibitive if MANN+H had to configure individual units to suit each engine - some of the data is going to be different among the same basic engine.

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MANN+HUMMEL mainly make OE filters and housings for manufacturers, and I suspect the datasheet was designed for that purpose. There are a few different configurations, however if you give your engine specs (make/ model / HP) that would be enough for them to select the best option.

Hartley - I think the TD5 mist cyclone was designed by M+H also. B ut the Provent is better.

John - forgot to add, if you will be getting the engine in within a reasonable time frame (or are willing to fit one to your Tdi) - don't forget to PM.

Same goes for anyone else.