Winch trouble

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Originally Posted by TonyC

Have you tried going straight to the terminals on the winch with jumper leads or the like.
This should tell you if the problem is in the winch or the control box.
I assume there is one for in and one for out and it earths through the winch, but I don't have a lecy winch so know for sure.

Tony

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So the direction of rotation can be be reversed, the motor has 3 terminals plus earth.

From memory, current goes to one (depending on required direction of rotation) field terminals, then through the field windings to the other field terminal, then from that terminal to the armature terminal, through the armature windings to earth.

To run in the other direction, swap the order of field terminals.

Then to use jumper leads for testing, connect 12V +ve on battery to one field terminal, another jumper between the other field terminal and the armature terminal, then a 3rd jumper from earth terminal to battery -ve.

not sure if any of those suggestions will help johannes,
especially getting parts from a supplier in aus'!!!!
so, from what you say, the winch will only travel one way, the reason for spooling the cable back in the wrong way.
ok, not that i know much about your warn winch,
first i would try the solenoids [relays, contactors or what ever you call the big jiggers over there]
but i suspect as you are there, you probably have the solid state jobbie from england.
i'm thinking that the solenoid or the switching system, is not working.
you can try wiring to the winch to see if it reverses by putting jumper leads direct to the winch terminals, [you will have to disconnect those terminals first]
blacknight suggested stuck brushes, this is a real possibility if you have been trying to pull a big load and your battery is low on volts -like nearly flat, but i suspect if you can run the motor one way, it may not be the problem.
and merry new year,
pm me if any of this doesn't make sense.
happy doctoring!

Thanks for all your replies, mates!
Highly appreciated! To give you an update, it seems that at least one solenoid has given up the ghost. Shortwiring the motor as recommended and explained by you revealed it is turning perfectly in any direction. The remote control is working alright as tested on the other winch. Connecting the wiring the usual way makes the motor only go in one direction (spool out), but when trying to spool in only the solenoid clicks. Tapping gently on the other solenoids doesn't make a difference.
Any idea how to find the faulty one?
I have sent a mail to Warn as well, who were very responsive and helpful. They have sent me a manual (which I will post somewhere here on this site), but basically said the same as you.
Well, looks I am into a new solenoid. Maybe time to do a big service on the winch while it's on the workbench anyway.

Ta!!!

probably time to rock off and buy one of those solid state pommy relays, not sure who makes them, but any magazine should advertise them.
meanwhile you can play in the snow and swap relays.
thanks for the pm, and keep those fingers warm.

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Originally Posted by Bush65

I helped a woman in a commodore that had overheated in a remote location once.
She never once was grateful or said thanks.

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Off the main topic, but I've found those that actually ask you to help them and smile while they're doing it are the ones you actually want to help.
The ones that you offer to help don't give a toss about you and seem to act as if you're their bitch. So when I pull up to a broken down, or stuck, car if I'm the one who has to ask what's wrong then I make an excuse and leave.
After all, someone whith half a brain will realise they're in the poo and not be stupid about asking for assistance. There may be exceptions to this, but not in my experience, sadly.

Back to topic:
You need these at the worst times, so you do need to be sure it's going to work. While it's off the car, I'd pull it down and replace the bearings and make sure the brushes are free from binding and your motor isn't full of rust. Also regrease the gears with CV joint grease, although I also use the Nulon gooey teflon impregnated stuff as well, as it sticks like poo on a blanket. If you don't know how, I think it's only about $300-$400 for a winch place to do it.
Also contact Paul at Tigerz11 if you want to get a remote control and 500A Titan solenoid.

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Originally Posted by harry

probably time to rock off and buy one of those solid state pommy relays, not sure who makes them,

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Albright are the ones you will be looking for.

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Originally Posted by Jojo

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Any idea how to find the faulty one?
...

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The solenoids are effectively switches. The small diameter, low current (control circuits) terminals are for opening/closing (switching off/on) the contacts for the high current (power circuits) to power the motor.

When control power is applied to the solenoid, a coil pulls the high current contacts closed. You can check each solenoid in turn to see if they are working when the solenoid is energised (power applied to the low current terminals).

The circuits are somewhat complicated because of the requirement to be able to run the motor in both directions.

The attachments (from P38, Ron on this forum) help to understand the circuits.

The 1st attachment shows the arrangement of the solenoids and wiring.

The 2nd shows the control circuits on the left and power circuits on right side.

Look at the control circuits diagram (on left side of 2nd attachment) and refer to the control wiring of the solenoids in the 1st attachment.

When the switch (left side of control circuit) of the remote control is set to spool in current from the battery flows through the black wire to solenoids 3 and 2 (lower circuit).

This energises those solenoids to close their power contacts.

Now look at the power circuits diagram (on the right of the 2nd attachment). When the contact of solenoids 3 and 2 closed (1 & 4 are open), battery power flows from the +ve 12V terminal through solenoid 3 to the F2 terminal on the motor, through the field windings to the F1 terminal, through solenoid 2 to the A terminal on the motor, through the armature windings to ground (-ve terminal on battery.

When the switch of the remote control is set to spool out current from the battery flows through the green wire to solenoids 4 and 1 (upper circuit).

This energises those solenoids to close their power contacts.

Looking at the power circuits diagram. When the contact of solenoids 4 and 1 closed (3 & 2 are open), battery power flows from the +ve 12V terminal through solenoid 4 to the F1 terminal on the motor, through the field windings to the F2 terminal, through solenoid 1 to the A terminal on the motor, through the armature windings to ground (-ve terminal on battery.

Note: these diagrams are for the earlier 3 wire remote. Later remotes have 5 wires, which gives improved safety in case of some possible malfunctions, but essentially the solenoids and motor work the same way.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by harry

probably time to rock off and buy one of those solid state pommy relays, not sure who makes them, but any magazine should advertise them.
meanwhile you can play in the snow and swap relays.
thanks for the pm, and keep those fingers warm.

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Originally Posted by Psimpson7

Albright are the ones you will be looking for.

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I think Harry may have been thinking of the Albright solenoids, they are from the UK, but are not solid state (they may look like a solid state to a casual observer).

Warn do make a solid state unit for controlling the winches, but I have never seen them - they are not what is normally supplied with their winches.

I switched to Albright solenoids for my electric winches some years back.

The 1st pic shows the Albright terminals (this small unit replaces the Warn control unit with the 4 solenoids). The 2nd pic shows inside an Albright that had corroded because the case was cracked (dropped) and allowed moisture inside (yes the case does open).

The TigerzII solenoids work in Warn Winches. Available on ebay for about $130. A neighbour was telling me how he replaced the 4 Pack of solenoids on his with the solid state relay. Wiring diagrams for the Warn were on the Tigerz web site from memory.

Thanks again for all input!!! It helps me heaps as I wouldn't have come across the Albright or Tigerz solenoids at all! The fact that one of these little relays will replace the whole array of solenoids is truly tempting. Albrights will be easy enough to source over here, not so sure about the Tigerz, I'll check.
With respect to the Albright contactors (as they are known), they are talking about intermittently and continuously rated contactors. Which are the ones to get???
John, thanks a lot for the detailed info, including the diagrams! very helpful! I'm going to find the fauly solenoid now. But if I am understanding correctly you are telling me not to bother replacing the malfunctioning solenoid only but the whole set, right?

Thanks again all!