Thread: BROCK OR WHINCUP?

Originally Posted by Tank

Well see you've got it totally wrong again, watch that Doco and you will see that the holden was designed wholly by americans, and the biggest boo-boo, holden didn't have a chassis, they were a Uni-Body construction, as far as XA's on it is Fine with the Australian designers as well, I will get their names for you and you can tell them they didn't design these cars.
You really seem to have a problem with absorbing facts that don't tally with your ideas/fantasies, I have proved Ford has been copied by Chev, engines and even body styling, compare a 54 Customline with the archaic 54 Chev, and in 1956, supposedly Chevs best ever car was outsold by Ford, so why don't you quit while you're behind, LOL, Regards Frank.

Mate you are getting so far off topic. I have no argument the FX FJ was designed by Americans, but was mostly designed here in Australia with survey and research being done here and a lot of input from the Holden Coach builders (have just finished reading an article), Same as the Falcons, most of the Ford designers were American. We are now talking Semantics. Ford, Holden and Chrysler all had American designers and work done in the US.
If the FX FJ did not have a chassis why do they have chassis tags. Yes it was a monocoque design and you may consider it to be a subframe rather than a chassis, I have no issue with that. You can actually buy replacement chassis kits for them, and I will certainly agree they are not much of a chassis but there still none the less.
It is well know they took their ideas from the Torino and Mustang for the Falcon Coupe and well documented, not the other way round as you assert. Did they design it, of course they did as the designers, does not mean it was original and did not borrow from the family. All manufacturers do.
Its a bit like the Commodore, yes it was an Opel, but was completely redesigned for Australia. These guys still designed it but it was hardly original.
We were talking Holden vs Ford in Australia and Holden have far outsold Ford and that is indisputable. If the 50s Chev was also such a bad car, why do they command such a high price now compared toe the equivalent Ford.
Keep on smiling, as I am certainly not taking any offence to your posts, more just a bit of banter.

Originally Posted by disco man

Another wicked looking car was the 1984 VK day-glo marlboro commodore as far as i know one of them ended up in a collection in the UK no idea what happened to the other one. any one know where these cars ended up?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0Qf3yuofVE
some great cars here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAAGSQHLMgU

Originally Posted by boa

Peter was a natural driver he could drive anything. But he had no input skills. Give him a car and he could drive it. Moffat was not a natural driver. For him it was hard work. But he could set up a car like no one else. He could tell the difference of 1 psi in tyre pressure. Moffat was faster than Brock. In the car they ran in Europe. I worked as a mechanic for Moffat in 1977 and 1978.

I agree with most of your post, but I do NOT agree that Allan was faster than Peter, because he wasn't (And I'm not saying Brock was faster either,..they were BOTH brilliant).....and although I knew Brock personally, there is no greater Allan Moffat admirer than me...He is still the best Ford driver this Country has ever seen, or is likely to.
What I will say about Moff, & if you worked for him you would be aware of this, it appears that he was generally under-funded as compared to Brock's HDT.
Allan also thought that Brock got a better go from Cams than He did. I remember once he made the comment to Brock when they were doing a joint interview,.."We couldn't even get in the front door of Cams if we had an issue, but they would invite you (Brock/HDT) in for a cup ot tea"!!
I've been following Sedan car racing in Aus for over 50yrs, & believe me, it will never get any better than the Brock/Moffat "duels", no matter who won.
Pickles.

Getting away from the Brock/Moffat stuff,have a look at this.
Shame the pic is not better


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nflj21etu5E

Just good clean racing.

Not only could Perkins drive,but he could also engineer and build a good race car,there are not many that could do that



Those You Tube clips of Brock in the wet '87 Bathurst are fantastic as well.

Originally Posted by Pickles2

I agree with most of your post, but I do NOT agree that Allan was faster than Peter, because he wasn't (And I'm not saying Brock was faster either,..they were BOTH brilliant).....and although I knew Brock personally, there is no greater Allan Moffat admirer than me...He is still the best Ford driver this Country has ever seen, or is likely to.
What I will say about Moff, & if you worked for him you would be aware of this, it appears that he was generally under-funded as compared to Brock's HDT.
Allan also thought that Brock got a better go from Cams than He did. I remember once he made the comment to Brock when they were doing a joint interview,.."We couldn't even get in the front door of Cams if we had an issue, but they would invite you (Brock/HDT) in for a cup ot tea"!!
I've been following Sedan car racing in Aus for over 50yrs, & believe me, it will never get any better than the Brock/Moffat "duels", no matter who won.
Pickles.

Yes very underfunded in 1977 there were 3 mechanics full time. We worked 12 or more hours a day. There was an interesting interview on TV today on the launch of Peter Brocks wife a book about his life. Agree both were fast. Maybe we need to meet as possibly what we need to say is not for a public forum.

Originally Posted by scarry

Getting away from the Brock/Moffat stuff,have a look at this.
Shame the pic is not better


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nflj21etu5E

Just good clean racing.

Not only could Perkins drive,but he could also engineer and build a good race car,there are not many that could do that



Those You Tube clips of Brock in the wet '87 Bathurst are fantastic as well.

I remember seeing that live and watching it several times since on You Tube, an epic drive by both Laaary and JB.... I remember an interview once I think it was with Alan Grice but may be wrong, however the comment was made that "John Bowe was/is the most liked racer to go door to door with as he gives room when required, the only problem is he always seems to make his car 3 feet wider than everyone elses car", still as a non GMH fan, Larry Perkins is a legend

Originally Posted by Kev the Fridgy

I remember seeing that live and watching it several times since on You Tube, an epic drive by both Laaary and JB.... I remember an interview once I think it was with Alan Grice but may be wrong, however the comment was made that "John Bowe was/is the most liked racer to go door to door with as he gives room when required, the only problem is he always seems to make his car 3 feet wider than everyone elses car", still as a non GMH fan, Larry Perkins is a legend

And i remember Dick Johnson saying "JB is harder to pass than a gall stone".

Those were the days

Originally Posted by boa

Yes very underfunded in 1977 there were 3 mechanics full time. We worked 12 or more hours a day. There was an interesting interview on TV today on the launch of Peter Brocks wife a book about his life. Agree both were fast. Maybe we need to meet as possibly what we need to say is not for a public forum.

Yeah, I saw Bevo on TV today, talking about her new book. She is looking SUPER GOOD. She is one very strong lady, & was in no small way responsible for Peter's success, & keeping him in line, well as much as was possible anyway......but she partied with the best of 'em when she felt the time was right. Like you say, there's stuff that can't be said, but Brock certainly led the "good life"!!
Regards, Pickles.