Thread: towing economy td5 - ideas needed

Originally Posted by Benny_IIA

What fuel map are you running pete?

I remember reading some where you were running a map from td5 inside?

My last defender got around 11ish with the vnt and lots of other goodies.

Yep I am running the stage 2 map from TD5inside. I also have a stage 2b off road only map. I dont have any intercooler upgrades etc however as I have no room. It goes pretty well now. noticeably quicker than our v8 d2a

The economy has been the same since I bought the car - it has never really got any better than 11.5l/100 since I bought it with 11k miles on the clock.

Sorry Steve. I thought the 14l/100 was with the trailer. 17/100 isn't very good.

Does it perform as it should or has there been any noticeable drop off?

Thinking back when I used to tow my cars about with mine I got about 17/18 mpg which is around the 16l/100km. They were a fair bit heavier that the load you are towing though. Probably 3000kg with the trailer and all the spares/slicks/fuel etc

Steve,
There has been a bit of this sort of thing with TD5 defenders tossed around the last couple of years.
There seems to be variance in mileage.
A lot of people are quoting 11-12 lp100kms some even 10 lp100kms in TD5 defenders.
The best I have ever had is around 13 lp 100kms and that is without towing and a standard TD5, sometimes up to 15. I replaced the MAF and it did bring it back down to 13s again but that is it.
Towing the van it is around your figures of 16 - 17 l p 100kms and the van is around 1400kgs total loaded, Defender 2 adults, 2 kids, dog, roller drawers with tools, 60 litre engel loaded and normal clothing etc.
I also have a set of rhino aero roof bars with two tubes (water pipe pvc) attached.
My gut feeling is there is something amiss in certain engines, dont know the answer yet.
I do miss my tdi Disvo that used to do 9s not towing and 10s towing a fully loaded camper trailer and load inside.
Even the RRC V8 would match the Defender at present and why I am considering a RR V8 as my next car. Even a F250 returns 17s loaded and towing.
Still not as bad as a lot of cruisers up around 21 loaded and towing.

Originally Posted by Psimpson7

Yep I am running the stage 2 map from TD5inside. I also have a stage 2b off road only map. I dont have any intercooler upgrades etc however as I have no room. It goes pretty well now. noticeably quicker than our v8 d2a

The economy has been the same since I bought the car - it has never really got any better than 11.5l/100 since I bought it with 11k miles on the clock.

Sorry Steve. I thought the 14l/100 was with the trailer. 17/100 isn't very good.

Does it perform as it should or has there been any noticeable drop off?

Thinking back when I used to tow my cars about with mine I got about 17/18 mpg which is around the 16l/100km. They were a fair bit heavier that the load you are towing though. Probably 3000kg with the trailer and all the spares/slicks/fuel etc

Cant say there has been a noticable drop off... but its not blisteringly quick.. plenty of pull tho.. its a deefer after all... i think the drag factor doesnt help... the issue is it has done the 14 before...

It was getting about 1000k's to around 105l previously but that has gone also now down to around 800... i assumed stuck egr rough cooling system and intercooler clogged wasnt helping...

I was thinking of contacting tombie and seeing if i could go next map up with a bit of tweaking to suit the engine... i may also check the injector codes etc as i made a note of them when i changed the harness.

I'm also pretty set on the MAF as the disco needs one too...

Originally Posted by CraigE

Steve,
There has been a bit of this sort of thing with TD5 defenders tossed around the last couple of years.
There seems to be variance in mileage.
A lot of people are quoting 11-12 lp100kms some even 10 lp100kms in TD5 defenders.
The best I have ever had is around 13 lp 100kms and that is without towing and a standard TD5, sometimes up to 15. I replaced the MAF and it did bring it back down to 13s again but that is it.
Towing the van it is around your figures of 16 - 17 l p 100kms and the van is around 1400kgs total loaded, Defender 2 adults, 2 kids, dog, roller drawers with tools, 60 litre engel loaded and normal clothing etc.
I also have a set of rhino aero roof bars with two tubes (water pipe pvc) attached.
My gut feeling is there is something amiss in certain engines, dont know the answer yet.
I do miss my tdi Disvo that used to do 9s not towing and 10s towing a fully loaded camper trailer and load inside.
Even the RRC V8 would match the Defender at present and why I am considering a RR V8 as my next car. Even a F250 returns 17s loaded and towing.
Still not as bad as a lot of cruisers up around 21 loaded and towing.

Hi Craig... yeah i know they vary quite wildly... i know chipping can make them more economical but never used to struggle getting in the 10's

i am considering reloading the old map and running for a bit with that then changing back to tombies map.. or a stronger one IF i can get hold of him

be good if we can get a definitive as to what causes it tho... i know Andy suffered and i think it was his MAF... now its just his foot

Steve

Originally Posted by 5teve

I beleive it still has the cat yes... however it always has done... so i know i can get the economy... its a late 2002 with internal body mounts and the rover diff

Steve

Loss the cat,

either get a dump pipe from an early td5 or if your exhuast shop will cut it out go that way.

Land Rover put the cat to far away from the turbo for it to work properly anyway as the gases are not hot enough by the time they reach the cat.

They get clogged up and cause loss of power and ecc

clean up your exhaust and up it to 3 inch that will help but depending on your drag factor with the boat 14/100 is about normal with some serious pedantism and taking it a bit easier you could get it down to 11-12/100 but youve then got to weigh up the cost of the fuel VS the cost of the extra time it takes you to get there.

you dont want to push the EGT past 750.

wow 13/100,, id cry if mine was doing that, even when i had the 33s on all the time i could still easy get 10/100,

now im back to roadys il easy get into the 9s,

last fraser trip used 120L of fuel and did just over 850kms, so about 14.5/100

i drive buy my boost,,, if im just driving around i never go over 15psi,,, and normaly chang gears at 10,, on the hgihway its pulling about 9-12psi,, depends how the rd is and thats at 100kph,, use about 14psi at 110,

my boost is set at 21.5 psi,, borderline over boost limmit

Originally Posted by Benny_IIA

Loss the cat,

either get a dump pipe from an early td5 or if your exhuast shop will cut it out go that way.

Land Rover put the cat to far away from the turbo for it to work properly anyway as the gases are not hot enough by the time they reach the cat.

They get clogged up and cause loss of power and ecc

Would if i could but i'm not gonna be allowed to spend it at the mo... will get pricing tho!

Originally Posted by Blknight.aus

clean up your exhaust and up it to 3 inch that will help but depending on your drag factor with the boat 14/100 is about normal with some serious pedantism and taking it a bit easier you could get it down to 11-12/100 but youve then got to weigh up the cost of the fuel VS the cost of the extra time it takes you to get there.

you dont want to push the EGT past 750.

As i said... i used to get 14.. this was 17 with much engine improvements over when i got the 14... something has gone wrong over the last 6 months.. and i havent replaced whatever it was...

EGT's are too high then? that at least points to some overfuelling do you think? as i said.. it was up a steep long hill and i could control them to around the 750... but maintaining speed (around 80-85) it would hit the 792.. my foot wasnt flat either...

EGT probe is where the small casting riser flat is on the top of the manifold where each branch comes in. I drilled the centre of it and flattened it of, used copper washers etc to seal.

Originally Posted by stig0000

wow 13/100,, id cry if mine was doing that, even when i had the 33s on all the time i could still easy get 10/100,

now im back to roadys il easy get into the 9s,

last fraser trip used 120L of fuel and did just over 850kms, so about 14.5/100

i drive buy my boost,,, if im just driving around i never go over 15psi,,, and normaly chang gears at 10,, on the hgihway its pulling about 9-12psi,, depends how the rd is and thats at 100kph,, use about 14psi at 110,

my boost is set at 21.5 psi,, borderline over boost limmit

Mine used to be about 10.5 driving 'steadily' I wouldnt be able to drive by my boost if i used your figures... it wouldnt go anywhere! its now around 12.5l/100ks unloaded...

freeway it sits around 12-15 when not towing at 100k's

Boost cuts out around the 19.2-19.5 mark.. or thats the max i see on the nanocom and auberins gauge. anything over 20 will see an error logged.

Thanks for all the replies so far guys..

Steve

I suspect there may be some driver error involved here....

pushing your egt constantly past 650 is not good, its not fatal but youre basically blowing energy out the exhaust.

use your lower gears and let the engine spin a bit. see how that goes for you.

I used to be able to keep big red under 10's unloaded about 12-14 with up to 2t in a tandem trailer on the back and that was with a full blown tombie insanity chipset and no other mods...

search the proton energy pill thread.