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Thread: Airbag suspension and off-road driving

  1. #11
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    I had a chat to Airbag Man at Cooma. We decided that he did not really have a suitable product to replace my Superior Suspension rear arms and XEng inner springs, with Long travel shocks. If I was just running bit longer travel than standard, matching shocks/bump stops and airbags was possible, but not the extreme travel possible with the XEng Springs.
    Michael T
    2011 L322 Range Rover 4.4 TDV8 Vogue
    Aussie '88 RR Tdi300 (+lpg), Auto (RIP ... now body removed after A pillar, chassis extension to 130 & fire tender tray.)

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by MLD View Post
    I run 4 corner Air bag man air suspension. Fitted the kit in early 2021 and since then done several VHC trips and a Simpson crossing with a stint in the Flinders Rangers driving the tracks to watering holes etc. My kit is not off the shelf. I run extended shocks and have modified the front turret height to suit the longer shock and in the rear i have a hybrid bellow with 20" extension and run 12" shocks.

    As for VHC type touring or driving that type of track in the GrizzlynBear video, provided the set up is all balanced you should not have a problem. By balanced i mean, shock lengths are ideal to bellow travel and the bump stops are your limiting factor on compression.

    Issues that i've encountered since fitting the kit:

    1) broke the piston on the front. From the short section of video in the GrizzlynBear failure, mine was the same. I did mine **** around at home. i aired up the rear to full extension but that put the weight on the front and it broke the plastic bit that holds it to the axle mount. I see how the GrizzlynBear failure could happen in the bush and i'm conscious of it. Having sufficient height in the front when in cross axle terrain will help. It gives the bellow a fighting chance for the PSI to exponentially increase to increase the rate before the bellow bottoms out. See pics

    2) i cracked the rear diff coil mount. The bellow has a larger diam base compared to the coil and with the diff roll from the pinion angle, there is alot more leverage on the diff mount. I found the crack on a rest day before the Simpson crossing. only found it because i was dedicated enough to put a torch on every nut, bolt and suspension part as a precaution. Welded it in Birdsville as a temp fix. i replaced the cracked mounts with thicker and larger mounts that i had welded on.

    3) i broke both front shock mounts at the bottom. One went on Davies plain over Xmas. That was a palaver to limp back to Omeo to weld a fix job to get me home. the other in Bunnings car park. Air bag man revised the bracket design from the first set with extra bracing. On my set up the shock bottoms out before the extended bump stops have enough resistance to be the primary limiting factor. I run GL + 1" bump stops + the spacer that Air Bag man offer in the kit. I'm +2" extended. I run 3 way adjustable shocks so there is about 1" at the base of the shock for the rebound adjustment mechanism. That reduced the closed length by that amount. Short of designing (which i will do) a shock mount that is set lower at the bottom to account for the shorter closed length, it will be an ongoing problem. FWIW the 130 handles no different without shocks on the front with air bellows. not sure if that is good or bad. The Bunnings breakage was 2 hrs Hwy drive from home where i had a spare.

    The rear has been trouble free save for the mount crack. if you are just interested in load carrying and flexibility of height adjustability between loaded and empty, fit rear bellows and run coil fronts. A rear sway bar will be beneficial. On balance, air suspension is not worth the money, hassle and stress. I never had a problem with coils and never gave thought to failures of coils in the bush. With air, i'm very conscious of it and it occupies much of my mental load when in remote areas.

    Attachment 185046Attachment 185047Attachment 185048Attachment 185049

    Thanks for taking the time to post that very informative and balanced summary.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by POD View Post
    Thanks for taking the time to post that very informative and balanced summary.
    I second that!

  4. #14
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    Speaking first hand from my experiences.

    I have had air suspension in my P38 RR and 2 x disco 4's and off road (difficult) had no issues.
    I had a leak in a hose with my P38, and patched it with an air line joiner, very easy fix.
    The P38 also had compressor issues, so I recon it with new seals. No issue since.
    With extreme articulation (i.e. when changing a wheel on a hoist) the airbag popped off.

    When travelling thru the Congo many years ago, my friend who I travelled with snapped 2 coils in his 110.
    He carried 2 spares so we were able to continue.

    Personally, I think the benefits or air outweigh coils.
    2015 Defender 110

  5. #15
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    "The rear has been trouble free save for the mount crack. if you are just interested in load carrying and flexibility of height adjustability between loaded and empty, fit rear bellows and run coil fronts. A rear sway bar will be beneficial. On balance, air suspension is not worth the money, hassle and stress. I never had a problem with coils and never gave thought to failures of coils in the bush. With air, i'm very conscious of it and it occupies much of my mental load when in remote areas."

    Exactly.

    After 10yrs with the D4,we had more EAS issues than anything else.Maybe we were unlucky,there are probably many around that are 10yrs old and had no issues.

    Sure it works brilliantly when it is working.

    Quite happy we now have a vehicle with no EAS,and i don't miss it.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by scarry View Post
    "The rear has been trouble free save for the mount crack. if you are just interested in load carrying and flexibility of height adjustability between loaded and empty, fit rear bellows and run coil fronts. A rear sway bar will be beneficial. On balance, air suspension is not worth the money, hassle and stress. I never had a problem with coils and never gave thought to failures of coils in the bush. With air, i'm very conscious of it and it occupies much of my mental load when in remote areas."

    Exactly.

    After 10yrs with the D4,we had more EAS issues than anything else.Maybe we were unlucky,there are probably many around that are 10yrs old and had no issues.

    Sure it works brilliantly when it is working.

    Quite happy we now have a vehicle with no EAS,and i don't miss it.
    Don't say that Paul, I'm seriously looking at converting the rear of the Disco to air bags, especially as I can turn it all back on in the BCU!

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by rick130 View Post
    Don't say that Paul, I'm seriously looking at converting the rear of the Disco to air bags, especially as I can turn it all back on in the BCU!
    If you maintain them, they really aren't a Problem.

    I've never had issues anyway.

    Even the D3 has been good, it's only done 520 000km though, whether it will play up when it gets a few km on it... Guess I'll have to wait and see..

  8. #18
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    For those that are commenting on factory air set up, that's not a fair comparison to POD buying and fitting an aftermarket kit to his defender. LR spends alot of money dialling in the EAS that the likes of Air Bag Man cannot. The aftermarket kits are a compromise and little things like my shock choice doesn't neatly work with the ABM kit. If i ran non adjustable shocks, it wouldn't be an issue. LR sends the car to market with that sort of stuff dialled in.
    MLD

    Current: (Diggy) MY10 D130 ute, locked F&R, air suspension and rolling on 35's.
    Current: (but in need of TLC) 200tdi 110 ute & a 300tdi 110 ute.
    Current: (Steed) MY11 Audi RS5 phantom black (the daily driver)
    Gone: (Dorothy) MY99 TD5 D110

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by MLD View Post
    For those that are commenting on factory air set up, that's not a fair comparison to POD buying and fitting an aftermarket kit to his defender. LR spends alot of money dialling in the EAS that the likes of Air Bag Man cannot. The aftermarket kits are a compromise and little things like my shock choice doesn't neatly work with the ABM kit. If i ran non adjustable shocks, it wouldn't be an issue. LR sends the car to market with that sort of stuff dialled in.
    Fair call... We wandered off a bit.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by rick130 View Post
    Don't say that Paul, I'm seriously looking at converting the rear of the Disco to air bags, especially as I can turn it all back on in the BCU!
    Simpler system than on the D4,less to go wrong,so you will be fine
    Never had a problem with the rear air suspension in any of the 7 seater D2's we owned.

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