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Looked a bit deeper at the cyanide/hydrogen plasma tech and can find little on it in actual use.
Great idea by UQ and Synergen Met Pty. Henty Gold in the video was owned by a very very big gold miner. Zip on the technology located making me wonder if it is just "a very good idea"?
I did laugh when it mentioned it vents the nitrogen and hydrogen to the atmosphere. Clearly things change between 2014 and 2022[biggrin]
Have a great day
Cut and past of a investment review I did this morning over a coffee. a bit of a ramble[biggrin]
Columbia added a hydrogen plan in this media
The oil business of course as everywhere is trying to stay in the game "State-controlled Ecopetrol is evaluating 18 possible hydrogen projects, including pilot projects for its Cartagena and Barrancabermeja refineries, that would require about $200mn-$300mn in investment, as part of Colombia's goal of developing hydrogen energy options"
Colombia's Ecopetrol eyes 18 hydrogen projects | Argus Media
The ""Green hydrogen will complement Colombia's Energy Transition.. ... Similarly, green hydrogen, with a potential of more than 3 gigawatts in Guajira alone, represents great economic and development opportunities for Colombia in applications ranging from the use of this energy vector in refining processes, gas transportation , sustainable mobility and production of agricultural inputs. Additionally, there is great export potential in the medium and long term that would allow Colombia to position itself in the Asian, European and North American markets, taking advantage of its privileged location of access to the Pacific and Atlantic oceans, and its proximity to the Panama Canal. " in this media suggest they have more than the Carbon Capture and storage dreams/challenges in mind.
It does have a "commitment to reduce CO2 emissions by 51% by 2030" I think that is interesting on several fronts for Hydrogen.
Who else is trying to cut by 50% by 2030?
UN Climate Change News, 15 June 2021 –Over 4,500 non-state actors from across the global economy have committed to halving emissions by 2030, joining the UN-backed Race to Zero campaign. These actors from over 92 countries recognise the value and the imperative of racing to a zero-carbon economy to build a healthier, safer, cleaner, more resilient world for generations to come. Link
The race to zero https://unfccc.int/climate-action/ra...-campaign#eq-3 has " Google and Microsoft (through Exponential Roadmap Initiative), Apple, Pfizer and ENGIE (through Business Ambition for 1.5C); JLL and Visa (through The Climate Pledge), Minas Gerais through Under2; Nashik through Cities Race to Zero, and many more. See here for a full list of Partners and their members."
How to remove C02 when also accounting to the embedded C02 when they have a "Expert Peer Review Group (EPRG) tasked with reviewing Race to Zero partner applications and providing independent recommendations to the Champions on whether the initiatives meet the Minimum Criteria for participation"?
Melbourne for example is about to get 32 electric buses - I like the plan yet note some of the power for them is still from coal especially as I assume they will charge over night and 32 barely scratches the Melbourne bus fleet which is well over 550 buses. Stating the blindingly obvious- we haven't even started yet!
A Carbon Negative Process would clearly make that goal a lot easier now matter who is counting! Happily we know who can do that and is proving that now at a commercial scale.
On a local side BHP is a interesting one to watch. https://www.aemc.gov.au/sites/defaul...lia%202019.pdf
The map of Austrlain Power Generation has a BHP site- Olympic Dam in South Australia. Most of us know of that gold, Copper, Uranuim ....
They have three stated C02 goals
1 By 2022 Our target is to continue to grow our business while maintaining our operational emissions at or below the level they were in 2017**.
2 By 2030 Our target is to reduce our operational emissions by at least 30 per cent from the level they were in 2020**.
3 By 2050 Our goal is to achieve net zero operational emissions.
Cannot find BHP specific data on how much fuel it burns, It is part of over a Billion liters in this report they contributed to https://www.nedapidentification.com/...tralian-mines/
I know via some investments I have or had in Gold, the fuel cost at mine sites is one of the most significant.
Who does the mining is not always the mine owner. Downer EDI Mining Pty Ltd for example is huge and operates 40 odd mines here. The AFR "Downer EDI chief executive Grant Fenn" "Mr Fenn said governments would stop buying diesel buses as they shifted to electric buses and Downer planned to switch its vehicle fleet to electric power." and on Hydrogen "The company is designing and installing more renewable power facilities as customers come under pressure to decarbonise, and hopes to participate in hydrogen projects through its existing alliance with Mitsubishi Power, which has been investing in hydrogen technology."
Downer EDI sees the wind is blowing strongly with escape a plan?? "Downer has been selling off its mining operations"
Paywalled link
We need mining. We need energy. We all need clean energy. It can and will be carbon negative and clean which is my little point :)
Cheeky Mr Forrest- takes 30million grant for a gas fired power station at Port Kembla them makes it Hydrogen. It is a gas of course[biggrin]
"The Morrison government will provide a $30 million grant to a proposed gas power station backed by resources billionaire Andrew Forrest, but it turns out that the project will aim to rapidly avoid the use of fossil gas.Federal energy minister Angus Taylor announced on Tuesday that the federal government will be providing a $30 million grant to Australian Industrial Power, a subsidiary of the Andrew Forrest backed Squadron Energy, to progress the development of a 660MW gas-fired power station at Port Kembla.Taylor released a statement to multiple media outlets on Monday (RenewEconomy was excluded as usual) and pitched the grant as part of the Morrison government’s “gas led recovery”, saying it was essential for the economy to bounce back from the Covid recession, and for grid reliability in the face of rising renewables.“New gas supply and generation will help re-establish a strong economy and make energy more affordable for families and businesses, while complementing the world-leading levels of renewables in Australia,” Taylor said.But Squadron Energy was quick to point out on Tuesday that the new generator will limit the amount of fossil gas ever used at the plant, and it will run entirely on green hydrogen by the end of the decade.Squadron had originally flagged around one third of the fuel supply would come from green hydrogen from the first commissioning, but Forrest now says it will use 50 per cent green hydrogen from day one, and will transition to operating entirely on green hydrogen by 2030."
Squadron aims to have the power station up and running by the 2024/25 summer, it means the plant may only ever partially run on fossil gas for a few years – effectively eliminating any prospect that such a power station could be a boon for Australian gas producers.Forrest said that the Port Kembla project would become Australia’s “most significant and largest green hydrogen power station”.“As soon as that green hydrogen is available, which we are on schedule to achieve by 2024-2025, the power station, currently licensed for dual fuel, will commence use of green hydrogen,” Forrest said."
Link to the story
Honestly the real yarn today is from Forest via Forsescue Metals Groups huge hydrogen plan.Australian miner Fortescue Metals Group has vowed to eradicate emissions by customers using its iron ore to make products including steel....The company, which is chaired by Australia's richest man, Andrew Forrest, said green hydrogen was key to making emissions-free steel while providing a renewable fuel for its fleet of eight iron ore carriers.
Before the dust settled on both of those POSCO (Korean Steel Giant) jumped in to the Australian hydrogen/Green steel. Some days things just go BOOM.
What is most interesting is Squadron Energy is the GAS player in the area. The $1.3 billion project is being developed by Australian Industrial Power (AIP), a part of Tattarang’s energy division, Squadron Energy, and will become Australia’s largest dual-fuel (gas and green hydrogen) power station, utilising 21st century technology to produce safe, reliable and lower emission electricity to support the rapidly growing energy needs of NSW.
The power station will have an anticipated capacity of 635 megawatts (MW) and will be capable of operating on up to 50 per cent hydrogen by volume from day one and is projected to operate on 100 per cent renewable energy by 2030.
Port Kembla Power Station Awarded Critical State Significant Infrastructure Status | Squadron Energy
"Hatch, Anglo American, BHP, and Fortescue have formed a Green Hydrogen Consortium to look at ways of using green hydrogen to accelerate decarbonisation within their operations globally. Primarily, the Consortium aims to collectively help to eliminate the obstacles to the adoption of green hydrogen technologies and encourage innovative application."
Never heard of Hatch before? Neither had I. "About Hatch"
"Anglo American says fuel cell-battery hybrid mining truck project at Mogalakewna entering final phase with testing start Q4 2021
"
The Aussie FCEV ute "H2X Warrego hydrogen fuel cell ute" at almost $200,000 might be a fizzer? Price multiple for a ford ranger conversion seems a bit much plus sadly.
Oddly Japan restarting 15 Nuclear plants seem to including hydrogen generation from the spare capacity they will have. This is old news "Commercialization of this reaction, called the IS (iodine-sulfur) process, was considered problematic, but the HTTR research team achieved 150 hours of continuous hydrogen production — the standard for long-time operation — two years ago." Link to full story
This was interesting and a Big Missed opportunity for our Pollies I thought
Overnight, the US and the European Union announced more than 100 countries have joined their bid to cut methane emissions by 30 per cent by 2030.
"I think we could probably go beyond that," Mr Biden said during his address at the UN conference in Glasgow.
"We just announced this package at the [UN] General Assembly back in September, at the time [it] was mentioned just nine countries had signed on."
I know the cool WA woodmans point plant is not turned on for several weeks yet but it is on track to make the worlds first carbon negative Hydrogen from Methane captured which is major benefit for everyone
NOT INVESTMENT ADVICE!! DO NOT TAKE INVESTMENT ADVICE FROM IDIOTS LIKE ME EVER!
Australia has a clear lead in using captured methane. 100 of millions spent by Linde, Bosch, BOC, Yarra haven't got close to where this WA company has. Patented and proven just the proof at scale to go.
At COP26 the star I felt was David Attenborough's cop26 speech. He said "he had witnessed "a terrible decline" during his 95 years of life, but was confident that the next generation could and should see "a wonderful recovery".
Fully agree that technology is needed to help contain climate change and I fully agree we can all benefit if we open our eyes a little bit to the long term science in this area.
Alas my Hydrogen Disco Conversion is not yet here- More than sure it will be in the next few years making a 30% reduction in methane profitable for those who can use the captured methane.
This was If true a real game changer
HydroStar
Electrolyte B9
Advanced Technology Electrolyte – the electrolyte has been indevelopment and research for the last 10 years and has numerous patents pending. This technology is at a substantial cost difference to the dangerous KOH that is used in some other types of hydrogen manufacturing. Early results have shown that this electrolyte can be used as a straight replacement for KOH. This would reduce their OPEX and increase the benefits to the environment simultaneously.
Benign and FDA approved – not only does this product have advanced ways to split H2O it is perfectly safe to touch and food grade product, also is Benign hence the naming of the liquid. This will ensure that the safety of workers, installers and the end users are kept in mind during the whole process. Also will ensure road / sea transport will not become a business liability in the future as product is non-flammable.
Recyclable and Reusable – as with any conduit products do have a life cycle, B9 has been specifically manufactured to enable retrieval of the liquid and we have a process for recycling the B9 into brand new effective electrolyte. For optimal efficiencies it is desired that this liquid be cycled on a 12-24 month period to maintain the same H2 production. We are also researching the third generation of the B9 liquid to increase the efficiency of separation and the duty cycle before degradation occurs
Replacement KOH Substitute – KOH / potassium Hydroxide or Caustic Potash is used in a wide range of leading edge hydrogen production facilities, not only does it have environmental effects it can also be quite costly as it will also need pure de-ionized water.
Real World Success – not only has this product received third party testing from two international universities it is also undergoing second phase testing with the Department of Energy in USA for Hydrogen generation in Portland, Oregon undertaken by HydroStar, which has been producing green H2 onsite
https://hydrostarusa.com/wp-content/...1.20.22-AM.png
HydroStar Electrolyzers - HydrogenNowCast | Podcast on Spotify
Have to warn you the music at the start is WTF. Skip the first minute!
Stainless steel and the non toxic catalyst is claimed to be almost as efficient as other fuel cells. If so I am in![biggrin]
Bosch and another Canadian company I have a few shares in might be worried? A post in general chat on EVs by Spudfan is correct in the materials in current batteries and fuel cells have some items worth noting
Bosch information shows the current way which has some issues
The 2022-4 ish date is so long to wait[bawl]
My cut and paste from a note I put on an investment spriuking site. Not Financial advice !!!
'Our largest energy source': South Korea plans 40 foreign hydrogen bases to meet vast future demandNation says investment and technology clout will secure supplies of 28 million tonnes a year by 2050Any where any place and any time Bonus for GEV and Hazer I assume. We can see via Germany and Japan, Korea is not alone in looking how to and also where to.
Australian bonus plus
GEV is trying to build Hyrdgen ships and Hazer is a WA gem I love
Might need to ring Mario ASAP. A Japanese ship should be about I want to see. It left japan 24 Dec and took a slowish scheduled two weeks so may be here still?
Warning investing waffle link[biggrin] Never buy shares on other idiots advice! Except CSL perhaps? [bigwhistle]
Article in The Australian today.
It's a long article but relevant to the topic.Quote:
When will Fortescue match its green hype with hard numbers?
[/QUOTE]Quote:
It is high time the ASX applied the same standards to Fortescue *Metals as it does across the rest of the market.
Fortescue’s disclosure habits around its green energy arm, Fortescue Future Industries, have gone past the point of being a bad joke.
I have no doubt that every *single announcement made by FFI is on the right side of the ASX disclosure laws, however close to the line I may think they run.
But their cumulative effect has distorted the market for For*tescue shares and regulators should subject the company to far greater scrutiny.
Early on Monday morning, FFI sent around a release about yet another early-stage deal struck by the company, this time to sell up to “100,000 tonnes of green hydrogen equivalent per year, starting as early as 2024” to German plastics major Covestro.
Like most FFI releases, the *announcement is long on the benefits of green hydrogen and desperately short on details of the commercial arrangements included in the memorandum of understanding.
READ MORE:Fortescue quizzed on green energy push|Forrest’s green vows hit $200bn
There is no mention of pricing, of where the hydrogen will come from, or how much it will cost to produce.
Viewed cynically, the agreement could be interpreted as little more than a nod in the direction of market sceptics who have criticised Fortescue’s spending on FFI, and have been asking when the grand idea will begin to deliver returns to shareholders.
Even the tentative delivery of the hydrogen in 2024 raises more questions than it answers.
Fortescue has not yet announced any investment decision on a hydrogen project that could deliver commercial-scale volumes by 2024. Nor has it given any indication of how much a plant could cost, how long it would take to build, or how cheaply hydrogen could be produced.
Last year The Australian calculated the capital spending needed to make good on even a small portion of the green hydrogen projects Fortescue was studying. The figure was a hair-raising $US145.5bn.
Fortescue has disclosed none of it to the market.
Outgoing Fortescue chief executive Elizabeth Gaines has repeatedly been challenged on FFI’s business model by analysts, journalists and fund managers.
https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/...b8e5?width=320Fortescue CEO Elizabeth Gaines. Picture: NCA NewsWire/David Swift
Her response in an October analyst call was that Fortescue had not yet made any final investment decisions in hydrogen, but would inform the market when it did.
“We haven’t actually announced or approved any projects yet. We’re talking about the *opportunity of this industry which we think will be significant,” she said.
There’s also an argument around what is “material” for Fortescue, worth $66bn on the market. Even committing to a $1bn project is arguably not *“material” under the current rules.
But FFI’s PR blitz has been worth about $15.6bn to Fortescue’s market valuation, according to Citi analysts.
Regulators need to work out a way to deal with that cumulative effect.
Citi analysts noted last week that Fortescue’s share value had broken its long-term association with the iron ore price.
“In the last three months Fortescue shares are up 46 per cent, with benchmark iron ore up 8 per cent and iron ore peers up about 6 per cent on average. Iron ore prices alone can’t explain the outperformance,” Citi said.
“To bridge the valuation gap to peers, we need to assume an FFI valuation of about $US11.3bn ($15.6bn) … At this early stage and with no visibility, this seems a bridge too far.”
Both Gaines and chairman Andrew Forrest have been open about the role FFI has played in Fortescue’s share surge.
“We’re actually getting a recognition of both the excellent *operational performance and the breadth of opportunities that we have in front of us with the success of Fortescue Future Industries,” Gaines said last month, when announcing her resignation as CEO.
Gaines and Forrest also pointed to a doubling of the number of Fortescue shareholders over the past year, to about 70,000, as a sign of market support for FFI.
In reality, that suggests that large institutional shareholders have been selling stock to smaller shareholders, who may lack the resources to assess the risks posed by Fortescue’s green transformation. They certainly won’t find any discussion of those risks in For*tescue disclosures or FFI *announcements.
The situation has infuriated institutional investors in Fortescue, who have demanded the company outline its business case for hydrogen, disclose the commercial terms for deals and rough costings for early-stage projects.
Fortescue is yet to do so.
https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/...76b9?width=650Andrew Forrest at COP26 in Glasgow last year. Picture: Annabel Moeller
The ASX itself has almost certainly helped create this situation. For the past year the market operator has cracked down on so-called “marketing announce*ments” by fintechs, biotechs, explorers and other spiv-laden sectors of the market.
The ASX has blocked the release of many announcements, directing speculative plays to instead put details on their websites or in quarterly progress reports rather than in discrete market *announcements – which must *include concrete terms of any deals if they are to be approved for release.
That may well have helped calm the volume of garbage spewing from blue-sky spruikers, and has probably helped improve the quality of disclosure in announcements that make it through.
But it does not account for high-profile entrepreneurs such as Forrest – and Elon Musk, in the US – who know that their every word will be picked up and published to a vast audience, generally without much scrutiny along the way.
The doubters could be wrong, and FFI could make Forrest Australia’s first trillionaire. Or FFI could just fall over one afternoon in a puff of logic, when the engineers finish their sums.
If Forrest wants to get back to his glory days of selling blue sky to speculators with an appetite for risk, good on him. But if so, he should either take Fortescue private or spin FFI out and get on with it.
As it stands, FFI has added more than $15bn to Fortescue’s market valuation without disclosing a single hard number about how it expects to make money from hydrogen.
That is not how an orderly market should work.
If Fortescue won’t make the appropriate disclosures of its own accord, then the regulators should take action to ensure it does.
Timely. I was hypothetically talking to someone on the weekend with a "mate" (we've all got one) inside FFI who allegedly said "2024? We'll be lucky to get anything green working by 2027".Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilipA