Thread: EV general discussion

Originally Posted by JDNSW

I would very much like to have an EV (or preferably two, to replace my two landrovers). There are a few problems.

1. No mains power here. That means I would need to upgrade my power system to charge the cars. Maybe not more batteries if I only charge in the daytime, but it is an extra cost.

2. To reliably reach the house you need four wheel drive and high ground clearance and reasonably good approach and departure angles.

3. mainly because nobody will deliver here because of the road, need to be able to tow a two tonne trailer round trip to town, 120km plus driving round town.

4. Need at least five seats to carry grandchildren.

5. As far as i am aware,there is nothing on the market in EVs that meet these needs. There are prospects of some, but it is likely that these will be in the realm of $100,000. Bit out of reach on an old age pension. If anyone was prepared to lend the money to me, interest alone could amount to as much as $1,000 a month (as interest rates rise), to which needs to be added a similar amount for depreciation. Added is the cost of upgrading my power.

This compares to my existing vehicles, which were paid for in full over thirty years ago, and are appreciating rather than depreciating (one is probably worth about what i paid for it, the other about twice what i paid for it). While there is a certain amount of maintenance on them, I do it all myself, so it only amounts to filters and oil etc, plus a few other parts from time to time. OK, they use fuel, but i spend on average about $150 - 200 a month for fuel. These days I don't do a lot of driving - mostly a weekly trip to town, driving round the property or to the village once or twice a week, further afield once or twice a year.

If this link is Kosher you will have a lot more to worry about.

Electric car Australia: EV replacement batteries costing up large sums: Tesla, Nissan, Lexus | Daily Mail Online

Originally Posted by scarry

This is interesting,if its true.

China is building more than half of the world's new coal power plants | New Scientist

Apparently, only partly true - the nub of it is that a lot of the planned coal plants in China will either never actually be built or never actually operate.

This issue brief covers three things American observers need to understand about coal in China:

1. China’s new coal-fired power plants are cleaner than anything operating in the United States.
2. China’s emissions standards for conventional air pollutants from coal-fired power plants are stricter than the comparable U.S. standards.
3. Demand for coal-fired power is falling so quickly in China that the nation cannot support its existing fleet. Many of the coal-fired power plants that skeptics point to as evidence against a Chinese energy transformation are actually white elephants that Chinese leaders are already targeting in a wave of forced plant closures.

Everything You Think You Know About Coal in China Is Wrong - Center for American Progress

Originally Posted by JDNSW

I would very much like to have an EV (or preferably two, to replace my two landrovers). There are a few problems.

1. No mains power here. That means I would need to upgrade my power system to charge the cars. Maybe not more batteries if I only charge in the daytime, but it is an extra cost.

2. To reliably reach the house you need four wheel drive and high ground clearance and reasonably good approach and departure angles.

3. mainly because nobody will deliver here because of the road, need to be able to tow a two tonne trailer round trip to town, 120km plus driving round town.

4. Need at least five seats to carry grandchildren.

5. As far as i am aware,there is nothing on the market in EVs that meet these needs. There are prospects of some, but it is likely that these will be in the realm of $100,000. Bit out of reach on an old age pension. If anyone was prepared to lend the money to me, interest alone could amount to as much as $1,000 a month (as interest rates rise), to which needs to be added a similar amount for depreciation. Added is the cost of upgrading my power.

This compares to my existing vehicles, which were paid for in full over thirty years ago, and are appreciating rather than depreciating (one is probably worth about what i paid for it, the other about twice what i paid for it). While there is a certain amount of maintenance on them, I do it all myself, so it only amounts to filters and oil etc, plus a few other parts from time to time. OK, they use fuel, but i spend on average about $150 - 200 a month for fuel. These days I don't do a lot of driving - mostly a weekly trip to town, driving round the property or to the village once or twice a week, further afield once or twice a year.

John

My first question would be, and it’s one I find myself asking, WHY?

Why would you like an EV?

its ok to try and justify an 80% recharge capacity in one hour as ok.....but what do you do during that hour? to even try to compare it to refuelling an ice vehicle is crazy....I mean would you stand there for an hour with a fuel nozzle in your hand?

Gav's question is valid, why do you really want an ev?

I just thought I'd put another angle in here...

My bro-in-law is a manager for Real Auto in the Carribean , based on St Marrtens (you know the place where you see people hanging on the fence in the jet blast of big aeroplanes)and his boss who owns dealerships throughout the islands has no intention of introducing EVs to his multiple ICE vehicle franchises even though in total the vehicle sales are probably higher than in Australia.(not fact checked)

He understands the logistics and just isn't interested in dealing with it , even though most vehicles sold through his dealerships are way up spec and well down priced compared to Australia , eg...top spec L300 is $US97k and my bil just got given a bells and whistles Fortuna cost in $us40's in a spec that wont ever be available in Australia.

We know the Nassifs personally and they run businesses all over the Carribean but aren't touching EV's until they have no choice but to. Places like St Bartz will be first simply because of the wealth that partys on that island.

So Australia dives headfirst into a huge logistical nightmare because a few thousand people want to drive EV's and believe it will save the planet........energy is neither created nor destroyed but just moves from one form to another......the "pollution footprint" remains basically the same for as long as you use energy in production.

wear condoms if you want to reduce the problem.

Originally Posted by 4bee

If this link is Kosher you will have a lot more to worry about.

Electric car Australia: EV replacement batteries costing up large sums: Tesla, Nissan, Lexus | Daily Mail Online

Suspect its a bit out of date recycled information Des

Adding batteries are mostly made with replaceable/recyclable cells

How much does it cost to replace the batteries in electric vehicles?

"as failed battery packs were returned to the factory, it was found many of these packs had only a couple of faulty cells with the remainder being fine. As a result, in countries with higher numbers of early Leaf sales (i.e. not here in Australia) – battery recycle schemes have begun with the disassembly and repackaging of cells into guaranteed remanufactured battery packs. In Japan, rebuilt packs for a ZE0 or AZEO Leaf sell for around US$2900 (around Au$4000).
In addition, as these cars fall off the road due to accidents – a ready supply of second-hand batteries are becoming available to private businesses to experiment on. As a result, some have started offering aftermarket replacement (in some cases upgraded) battery packs*.

"

Interestingly charged DC yesterday and then tossed it on at home with all the sunshine. 251 volts at the ends was just what I got when it was new! over 26000km now. It is still ****e for long range high speed unless I have access to a fast charger and 40 minutes to charge it on my usual run return from Melbourne to Port Fairy. I do have access now and more are being added quickly. Not suggesting its perfect by a long shot- Mine is cheap and quirky

Adding batteries are mostly made with replaceable/recyclable cells

I have a real problem reconciling this quote with what I have experienced with Lithium batteries.After all these batteries are the same as in your phone or laptop. The batteries lose capacity over usage. Even Tesla only guarantees 80% over 8 years. In many cases the life of the batteries is much worse eg Nissan Leaf. The key seems to be the theramal management. So any recovered battery pack which is made of recycled batteries will have at least some degradation and maybe a lot of degradation. In addition if one cell goes out then the lot go out and once again the battery has to be repaired or replaced. It is a pretty blythe statement that replacement of batteries is cheaper than a new set as it is a "pig in a Poke" type problem. Regards PhilipA

But have you saved $30,000 in fuel yet?
So far your emissions on the quirky car exceed your savings.

How long do you predict the thing is going to last?

Just speaking with a friend in the UK yesterday. His monthly power bill is now £498 - yes month, yes Pounds!
Driven by lack of power generation.

We’re in big trouble soon!