Thread: EV general discussion

Originally Posted by DiscoDB

I think it will be under 1T payload - up to 950kg in some trims.

With a bit of tweaking and engineering you would think they would offer a variant with over 1T payload and say 3.5T towing capacity to target the Dual Cab tradies.

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What a joke. That ridiculous thing is literally twice the cost of a proper car. Gee's, I bet they are just rushing out the door ........

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Originally Posted by Captain_Rightfoot

Like congratulations.. you've worked out that towing isn't an EV strong point.

1: Hence the on going need for 'Proper' 4bees, dual cabs included.

They can tow (mine has a 1600kg tow rating) but it does knock the range significantly. With EV's everything is about efficiency and giant boats are not efficient.

2: ....nor is a caravan, or a 7x5 trailer or anything that requires towing by an EV, apparently.

The question is - how often do you need to do a job like this.

3: Regularly, for me and for a lot of people. Our neighbours have two dual cabs. I'll grant you that I find the wife's need for one, somewhat dubious, but the hubby is a chippy and tows a large, dual axle, work trailer, all over S-E Qld. As do many other tradies. So, if he's working on a non-powered site i.e. new housing estate, how would he re-charge an EV tug. (Although, any chippy worth his salt, will have a good size genny in their kit, so perhaps it's not an issue?)

It is obvious that, at their present stage of development, EVs are near perfect for metro use, but not so flash for most other places in Oz.
So, with the government et al trying to coerce people into buying something that is, in a lot of cases, 'Not fit for purpose', is folly.

If and when, an EV is built that can do what my '93 'tilly can do, I'll give it serious consideration.

Good real world tow test of the Silverado EV vs F-150 Lariat with the 3.5L EcoBoost.

The test was done towing 3T and mostly at US interstate speeds of 65-75mph (105-120kph).

The Silverado EV achieved a range of 232 miles (370km) whilst the F-150 averaged 9.8 mpg (24 l/100km). Both good results given what they were towing and speeds they did.

Back off to Landcruiser "Slug Speed" and you could easily push the Silverado to over 400km range towing 3T. Put a small 750kg box trailer or light camper trailer behind it and you would be expecting 500-600km plus range.

https://youtu.be/iSJaNPQWBaM?si=WuvrDclBmrQchTQI

Originally Posted by Saitch

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Like congratulations.. you've worked out that towing isn't an EV strong point.

1: Hence the on going need for 'Proper' 4bees, dual cabs included.

They can tow (mine has a 1600kg tow rating) but it does knock the range significantly. With EV's everything is about efficiency and giant boats are not efficient.

2: ....nor is a caravan, or a 7x5 trailer or anything that requires towing by an EV, apparently.

The question is - how often do you need to do a job like this.

3: Regularly, for me and for a lot of people. Our neighbours have two dual cabs. I'll grant you that I find the wife's need for one, somewhat dubious, but the hubby is a chippy and tows a large, dual axle, work trailer, all over S-E Qld. As do many other tradies. So, if he's working on a non-powered site i.e. new housing estate, how would he re-charge an EV tug. (Although, any chippy worth his salt, will have a good size genny in their kit, so perhaps it's not an issue?)

It is obvious that, at their present stage of development, EVs are near perfect for metro use, but not so flash for most other places in Oz.
So, with the government et al trying to coerce people into buying something that is, in a lot of cases, 'Not fit for purpose', is folly.

If and when, an EV is built that can do what my '93 'tilly can do, I'll give it serious consideration.

Point 1. I've never said 4wd and DC's aren't usefull. In fact as recently as only a few posts ago. All I've suggested was that before these current cars we managed just fine with sedans. We towed boats, caravans etc. We had weekends. I think it's common for people to overstate their genuine need for these capabilities.

Point 2. No.. EV's are fine for a lot of towing. I could tow my camper with one. The are perfect for light towing jobs dump runs.. moving etc. which probably covers most city dwellers. You sure can do it if you want.

Family towing camper across Australia in an EV to prove ScoMo and doubters wrong | CarExpert

Point 3.. I bet the wife has it as a tax dodge... tax free FBT free car. In QLD you can tell by plugging the rego in and seeing if it's commercial.

EV's are capable of a lot of stuff. They are great highway cars. Yes there are limitations but there are also things they do really well. Here is a little map which shows fast chargers... there are a lot of places you can get to.

Originally Posted by Saitch

It is obvious that, at their present stage of development, EVs are near perfect for metro use, but not so flash for most other places in Oz.

This is correct - for most EVs are now near perfect for metro use - which probably accounts for 80% of the intended use of new cars sold in Australia. Short commuter trips where you can charge at home overnight and the maybe once or twice a year trip beyond the metro area.

Pretty much at a price parity point where it doesn't really make sense to buy a new ICE for typical urban usage unless you need the extended range, or need to tow (which most Australians don't need and don't do). Most new cars don't even have tow hitches fitted and never will.

Will be interesting to see how the shift in focus to Extended Range EVs changes the landscape again. All the benefits and efficiencies of the electric drive system but with an on-board highly efficient generator to extend the range when needed. For most cars would only need a small light weight on-board generator that could charge at 25-30kW whilst running and the range then is only limited by the fuel tank size for the generator which you could quickly refill when needed. Could even run on ethanol or natural gas or hydrogen - but this probably won't happen. For convenience regular petrol would be a suitable choice for the generator.

But nothing will replace your Tilly. Old school tech is always cool even if uncomfortable and with basic features.

Originally Posted by DiscoDB

Good real world tow test of the Silverado EV vs F-150 Lariat with the 3.5L EcoBoost.

The test was done towing 3T and mostly at US interstate speeds of 65-75mph (105-120kph).

The Silverado EV achieved a range of 232 miles (370km) whilst the F-150 averaged 9.8 mpg (24 l/100km). Both good results given what they were towing and speeds they did.

Back off to Landcruiser "Slug Speed" and you could easily push the Silverado to over 400km range towing 3T. Put a small 750kg box trailer or light camper trailer behind it and you would be expecting 500-600km plus range.

https://youtu.be/iSJaNPQWBaM?si=WuvrDclBmrQchTQI

The way I read it is if the Silverado was being charged at home the 'fuel' cost is just under a fifth of the Ford.

Would be less again in the current circumstances. Dunno what the servicing cost difference over vehicle lifetime would be.

DL

Originally Posted by DiscoDB

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Pretty much at a price parity point where it doesn't really make sense to buy a new ICE for typical urban usage unless you need the extended range, or need to tow (which most Australians don't need and don't do). Most new cars don't even have tow hitches fitted and never will.....................

The interesting thing is what is happening in China at the 'heavy' end of the vehicle market, hub to hub (500km range) prime movers where EV trucks account for 50% of all new sales and are less than 50% to the cost of diesel alternatives.

No one saw it coming.

An Oz start up:

Australia'''s heaviest trucks go electric with zero-emission freight depot - ABC News

The problem with the current US manufactured EVs is they just can't compete with the Chinese for upfront cost. All are low cost to run and maintain, but manufacturing in the US is very expensive compared to manufacturing in China so the upfront cost make the US EV's mostly unviable.

There will be a Chinese manufacturer that will end up offering the same as the Silverado EV for half the cost.

What the Silverado EV and Rivian R1T does show is you can build a Dual Cab EV with a decent range and good towing capacity and this can only improve as the technology keeps getting better.