ND Filter - What to get?

[WhiteD3]

Next purchase in the photography line will be ND filters for my Canon 18-200mm and new Sigma 10-20mm.

Having never used an ND filter (but having been caught without one more than once recently) I've no real idea re what to get so some advice would be appreciated:D.

I was thinking (for no real reason other than it is very bright on the beach here in summer) of a Hoya NDx4 (2 stops) but I see they do a x2 and x8 as well.

Also, I see on ebay some adjustable ND filters by H&Y but I couldn't find the manufacturer's site to do some research. Are these any good?

Cheers.

[dmdigital]

You are best off going for known brand ND's like B+W, Hoya, Tiffen, etc. The main reason to avoid the eBay specials is they may not be colour neutral unless you know what you are getting. That said some of the cheap ones can be OK.

The best to buy IMO are Sing-Ray and B+W. Hoya and others are good but the B+W for example are a brass ring and don't tend to bind on to the lens.

Putting any filters on an 18-200 or 10-20 is a challenge as at the wide angle you will potentially get visible interference from the filter's mounting ring. For this reason you may need to look at the low profile filters or the better option is a larger diameter filter and a step-down ring.

Either way always buy filters to fit you largest lens mount and then use step down rings for the smaller lens mounts (with in reason).

Do you have a CPL filter? If not I would recommend this first over an ND. Especially for the beach.

As for what ND to get...

Look at what you are shooting. Is it only the sky that is usually blown highlights? Then you are best looking at Graduated ND's
Is the whole scene or various parts? OK if you had metered on those areas how brighter are they - 2 stops, 4 stops, 6 stops?

Where I am 6 stop is fine and a 2 stop is almost useless. Down in Tassie a 2 stop would be much more usable.

They are also additive, so if you stack a 2 stop and a 4 stop its the same as a 6 stop.

Basically a 2 stop filter means that if you wanted to shoot an image at 1/100 f/11 then with the filter you could shoot at 1/30 f/11 or 1/100 f/5.6, as either are 2 stops lower.

ND's are also very useful for getting that nice slow effect for water. A 1/30 f/11 shot with a 6 stop ND becomes a 2" f/11 shot with a tripod and remote shutter release.

[WhiteD3]

Do you have a CPL filter? If not I would recommend this first over an ND

I do but to be honest I find it (Hoya) annoying as unless I'm looking at a bright sky I have trouble working out where max polarizing is as there's no markings on the ring. It's a practice thing that I need to get in and do!

[dmdigital]

CPL's don't have markings as it depends on where you are facing. So what's polarized in one direction isn't always going to be in the other direction. I've always had trouble telling by looking. This is how I overcome it:

Watch the light metering.

That's all! Simple... As you rotate you will see either the metering rise or fall or if in Program, Aperture or Shutter priority modes then the Shutter speed or Aperture will change. In all cases you want the one that's letting that little bit less light in.

Of course if you are looking in to water, you will see the reflections disappear to indicate when it's working.

[slug_burner]

Unless you are specifically after long shutter speeds and with specific ISO speed settings then an ND filter went out with film. Digital SLRs give you the ability to play with shutter and ISO settings that you should be able to get around the benefit of a ND filter. A graduated ND filter that is a different thing as you can stop whasing out the sky and expose for your subject below the sky.

Really wide angle lenses are difficult to fit with filters in front of the lens. However I doubt that your average lens will have a draw for the filters between the camera and lense so you are stuck with screw on lenses or slide on types in front of the lens.

Spend your money on a tripod or a good flash instead.:wasntme:

[Chucaro]

If you do not have the money to get the Sig-Ray look into the Lee and the Higtech.
Both of them do not change the colors of the images (color cast) and you can get a set of them HERE (http://www.2filter.com/)
Cheers

[C0L0N3L]

Obviously it depends what your doing, but if you going to stop down the light with filters don't get a threaded filter, go Cokin filters (you'll probably be on a tripod 90% of the time anyway, so shouldnt have to worry about damaging them)

As for what rating. Id say at least ND8, but you would be better with a ND400

ND8 = 3 stops
ND400 = 9 stops

Couple a ND400 with a ND4 grad and you've got a pretty awesome setup for sunrise/sunset stuff.

Thats what I'll be getting after I get a wide angle that doesn't rotate the front element when focusing.

[Chucaro]

The good thing with the Lee and the Higtech is that they are very big and you can hold them by hand in the position that you like.
You save money if you do not get the holders for each lens. ;)

[dmdigital]

B+W ND110 - 10 stop (in simple terms 1/30 becomes 30" exposure). Shot near enough to midday in full sun.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2010/11/172.jpg

Like looking through welding glass. You also soon learn why screw on filters can be a pain as it takes a lot longer to setup a shot. If I put the ND106 (6 stop) on as well... :eek:

[C0L0N3L]

You can position the cokins anyway you want (hold it in position, rotate it on an angle etc).. its just annoying, I have the same problem with a CPL.

You'd only have to buy a different size ring for cokin and they cost about $5

[dullbird]

The biggest problem I found with cokin was finding people that sold genuine at a reasonable cost..

I nearly bought a kit through ebay once and realised I wasn't buying genuine cokin filters but copies. needless to say I didn't buy them...

I did find them else where for about 145 I think it was for an ND kit, but then many on here said they didn't like cokin which made me think again, I still have not bought any yet so will watch this thread with interest

[WhiteD3]

Cokin would have to have the worst web site I've seen in a long time............but the brochure seems worth reading. More research for me.

[Cap]

Im still not sure why you need an ND... I think the GND is very usefull for the contarsting shots (landscapes)... but straight ND can be attained (already mentioned here) using the A/S/ISO controls.

I have been frustrated with burned sky or underexposed foreground to save the sky shot... GND is where its at.

[dmdigital]

Im still not sure why you need an ND... I think the GND is very usefull for the contarsting shots (landscapes)... but straight ND can be attained (already mentioned here) using the A/S/ISO controls.

Rubbish! Let's say I want to shoot a long exposure. To get the shot I want I need at least 1/8 second exposure. The lens I have will go to f/22 but in this case f/11 - f/16 is a better option as the image is sharper in this range for the hyperfocal distance I want. So how do I then go from 1/30 second, f/22, ISO100 to a lower speed shutter and wider aperture of 1/8, f/11, ISO100?

Answer: a 4 stop ND filter - two stops for aperture and two stops for shutter.

Now if I am shooting at ISO800 and I have 1/30, f/22 then I can step the ISO down to ISO100 gain 3 stops so now I have 1/8, f/16, ISO100. Throw on a 1 stop ND and I am again down to 1/8, f/11, ISO100 - though I'd probably be happy with f/16).

There is still a need for ND filters with the present range of camera's and lenses. After all it is all about manipulating the light entering the camera.

As for Grad ND's in reality this is in fact the one that the cameras are starting to overcome. The ability of cameras like the D3s, D300s and even down to the D3000 and some point and shoots with what Nikon calls D-lighting (Canon and others have similar processing ability) to work with high contrast areas is moving away from the need for GND's. There still is a point though that some part of the image will be too bright and a GND is the way to go. Blown highlights are still an issue with digital sensors, but they are improving.

[Cap]

Ahh yes DM, however now what you are doing is modifying the light source itself (by filtering it out with a filter)... which is fine for an affect you have in mind. If you do want to alter the metering this way then yes, I agree with you, you do need this.

Im thinking of just natural light, and only using a GND to stop over exposure to attain a 'natural' look. What your talking about it creating a fictional light to get the 'soft' look for example.

Edit: Should add that im am still learning the craft of photography so am happy to be corrected ;)

[Chucaro]

I am not planning to have a ND filter kit in my bag
Grad filers yes, in 03,06 and 09 which are very handy on landscaping captures.
The ND can be avoid by selecting the exposure even in very hard situations like the one down below.
I am not sure that my D300s can be a replacement for grad filters :)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2010/06/1888.jpg

[dmdigital]

Ahh yes DM, however now what you are doing is modifying the light source itself (by filtering it out with a filter)... which is fine for an affect you have in mind. If you do want to alter the metering this way then yes, I agree with you, you do need this.

Im thinking of just natural light, and only using a GND to stop over exposure to attain a 'natural' look. What your talking about it creating a fictional light to get the 'soft' look for example.

Edit: Should add that im am still learning the craft of photography so am happy to be corrected ;)

Taking pictures is all about modifying the light source to suit the composition. Arthurs post just above is a great example.

From memory you have a D80 which like my old D200 is pre the Active D-Lighting ability of the D90 and D300s etc. This is all about the ability of the camera to record a scene with high contrasting areas. Have a look at Nikon D Technology THE POWER TO CHANGE YOUR PHOTOGRAPHY (http://imaging.nikon.com/products/imaging/technology/d-technology/expeed/d_lighting/index.htm) it might help explain this better. But like I said "starting to overcome" I believe there is still a need for GND's too.