Raising and securing a metal lathe to slab

[roverrescue]

So a shiny new 650kg paperweight has found its way into the corner of my shed (AL-336 metal lathe)

Im chasing any info from someone who may have experience in placing heavy machinery.

The concrete slab is level but in my opinion the lathe is ~50mm short of a good working height.

The lathe comes with stand/foot brake assembly. Each 'leg' of the stand has 4 x 17mm holes punched through 6mm plate. Obviously just asking for M16anchors.

A wise old machinist as well as H&F mentioned that best practise would be to mechanical anchor the stand using jacking bolts then pour an epoxy grout into the void about the jacking bolts and stand for a solid, vibration free attachment to slab.

So if I wanted to raise the base by the above about 50mm do any learned AULROians see an issue with the following:

-Chem in the 16mm anchors with say 75mm protruding above conc.
-Making up some say 10mm thick base plates for each anchor.
-place these over jacking nuts on the M16 studs.
-place the lathe on 10mm base plates ~50mm raised above slab
-level off the ways using jacking nuts.
-remove lathe
-form up about the base plates then pour 'Sikadur-42' High strength pourable epoxy resin grout.
-let it cure and then bolt the lathe down.

From my reckoning this all fits within the product description for the Sika product (max fill of 6o mm) will give a solid connection to the slab and raise the lathe.

See attached word diagram if my explanation makes no sense. I only included one stud/base plate for clarity (there will be eight studs securing the lathe)

Any takers?

Steve

[one_iota]

That is pretty much how a structural steel portal frame would be erected.

Using a non shrinking grout is important...and the epoxy will probably fit the bill.

I assume that the 10mm plate for each "leg" would have 2 holes and you would use that as the template for drilling the holes in the slab for the chem-anchors.

So it seems sound to me.

Don't forget the photos. :)

[roverrescue]

Yeah I was thinking of putting two holes in each 10mm plate, then there would essentilly be two plates per leg, two legs for the lathe.

I guess my only real concern was the 2" lift, you know castor angles and all that ;)

In the end it will be a pretty permanent fixture - I hope I have it in the right place.

Steve

[bee utey]

Are you expecting a 650kg lathe to walk around your shed? How out-of balance are your work pieces going to be? I would suggest get some adjustable rubber feet from a machinery place, like these:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/972.jpg
Then you can shift the lathe if needed, just needs a LR nearby. Also transmits less earth vibrations to your neighbours.

[Bigbjorn]

Have you got or have access to an engineer's precision level to level the lathe bed both directions? This is essential. you dont want twist in the bed.

Any reasonable modern method for securing to concrete will do. It is only a small light lathe and won't need much securing. Bolt it to the floor through 75mm heavy wall square steel tube and use c-washers or shim of varying thicknesses to level the machine before tightening down and checking level again. Repeat if necessary.

[Hall]

Sounds good. Heavier more industrial style lathes have a large hollow jack screw. Through this jack screw is the anchor bolt. Typical of any Chinese machinery that will have some one standing to operate it. Always too low even for me and I am at the bottom end of average height. All built for a short race.
Cheers Hall

[roverrescue]

Thanks for all the input:
-yes on the access to engineers level-
-Beeutey, I also thought that gravity would be friendly enough not to need fixation but from what I have been told by those that know it is safer to have positive fixation. I think the neighbors are more likely to feel vibrations from an UnZed earthquake than anything going round and round in the shed ;)
-Brian I will ponder on the bolted through SHS option...

Thanks again.
S

[85 county]

Almost correct.

chem set into the floor 3"-4" then 50mm of air and then a good 1/2 plate. Mount it all get it in the ball park with the level. Then box and back fill under the plate

Then you have a metal plate to shim against when you do your cutting sequence/level etc

The chem sets in the tube are much better than the syringe types. Make sure you have a good 1/2 drill to mix it all up and make sure you blow out the hole of all cement dust. And grind a chisel end to your rod.

[Bigbjorn]

Thanks for all the input:
-yes on the access to engineers level-
-Beeutey, I also thought that gravity would be friendly enough not to need fixation but from what I have been told by those that know it is safer to have positive fixation. I think the neighbors are more likely to feel vibrations from an UnZed earthquake than anything going round and round in the shed ;)
-Brian I will ponder on the bolted through SHS option...

Thanks again.
S

You could, if you wish, weld crush tubes into the square tube.

[85 county]

You could, if you wish, weld crush tubes into the square tube.

even better top and bottom plate and tubes

[roverrescue]

Thanks again,
85county, I see your point the obvious extra levelling step makes sense.

Steve

[85 county]

are you sure the MC is 50mm low
with a Lathe you do work over the MC a bit rather than look at it so to speek.

[roverrescue]

Hmmm,
yeah I realise the "look over" as opposed to "look at" perspective...

But, all the controls and looking overness requires a slight stoop.
I tried to use the ~50mm as a rough height required.

At this stage Im gonna use the epoxy grout technique with jacking bolts, which means I can set it up say at +50mm on the jacking bolts and check that this is actually what I want!

Its not too difficult to lift up and down i have the block and tackle set up directly above the ways.

Steve

[wrinklearthur]

Have you got or have access to an engineer's precision level to level the lathe bed both directions? This is essential. you dont want twist in the bed.

Any reasonable modern method for securing to concrete will do. It is only a small light lathe and won't need much securing. Bolt it to the floor through 75mm heavy wall square steel tube and use c-washers or shim of varying thicknesses to level the machine before tightening down and checking level again. Repeat if necessary.

Hi All

Being a cheapskate, my approach to get the height you need, would be to make up some oregon pine blocks to suit, it also would do for the sound dampening and it would grip the floor nicely. If needed at all, a small anchor bolt then should stop any movement around the floor, from vibrations of the lathe.

Cheers Arthur

[85 county]

Hi All

Being a cheapskate, my approach to get the height you need, would be to make up some oregon pine blocks to suit, it also would do for the sound dampening and it would grip the floor nicely. If needed at all, a small anchor bolt then should stop any movement around the floor, from vibrations of the lathe.

Cheers Arthur

a lathe is long and the bed is not self supporting, they need to be locked down solid

[wrinklearthur]

a lathe is long and the bed is not self supporting, they need to be locked down solid

I would be surprised if the bed on that lathe, is that flimsy it would droop in the middle, so when correcting the bed for any torsional movement, extra care would also be needed when fastening the legs down, to counteract the drop in the centre.
The old metal screw cutting lathe that I sold some years ago, had a very heavy pedestal with a tie rod between each end, to the cross bars of the legs.
But as roverrescue's lathe is in Cooktown, maybe you should disregard my suggestion of using the Oregon pine, as the lathe may become wonky due to an attack on the blocks from white ants. :D
I was thinking back to the time when I met a very helpful chap called Allan Christy in Cooktown (1973), he had his dinning table legs sitting in tins full of sump oil to stop the white ants eating his table!
By the way, Allan showed me the biggest Cane toad I have ever seen, it was down in a well and was the size of a Jack Russell dog. :eek:

Cheers Arthur

[roverrescue]

As you note Arthur,
on our block, softwood touching anything that is vaguely connected to the ground lasts about 2 weeks before it starts to dissolves into a pile of powder. Steel and concrete are our friends!

S

[ashman]

I work at TAFE as a maintenance TA and all our lathes sat on metal foot plates steel with rubber or felt that sat on the concrete they were never bolted down, each lathe had 6 foot plates just make sure the beds are level and they should run smoothly, the only time they move is when we move them...

Ashley

[85 county]

I work at TAFE as a maintenance TA and all our lathes sat on metal foot plates steel with rubber or felt that sat on the concrete they were never bolted down, each lathe had 6 foot plates just make sure the beds are level and they should run smoothly, the only time they move is when we move them...

Ashley

that may be so, but its not correct

[Don 130]

I was a rigger in a former life and moved/ installed many machines and also tower cranes. We used the jacking bolt idea then nonshrink grout for an application like yours, but never removed or disturbed the machine once levelled to apply the grout. We always packed the stiff mixture of sanded non shrink grout in under the plates from all sides ,leaving it finished with a 45 degree batter. My two bobs worth.
Don.