Problem with Battery/Fridge/DBS

[Redback]

I am going to do my own test, I am having a few battery/fridge lasting problems at the moment, so I am going to see what is causing it, whether it's the battery or batteries, the fridge or the SC40, also the temp that I set the fridge at doesn't seem to being staying where it should, it can rise to 7c from it's setting of 2c that I've set it at, something it's never done unless the battery has been low, I am leaning towards the fridge being the colprit at the moment, but I would like to do the test to find out for sure.

Also my EMS1 is reading the voltage wrong from the batteries, according to the EMS1 when I turn the ignition on and leave it for about 1min (without starting the car) the voltage reading is 11.5/6, which sets off the low voltage alarm in the EMS, I then get my volt meter and test the voltage only to find it's actually 12.4 to 12.7 depending on how long the car has been sitting around and that's both batteries(normally the main starter is the lower of the two if sitting overnight or longer.

Any advice would be good if someone has any for this test I'm about to do.

The first part of the test will be monitoring the temp in the fridge on 240V for 24hrs starting tonight.

No arguing please:p

Baz.

[Ean Austral]

Cant help with the test side, but I had my fridge/freezer do the same, after much testing with a multimeter the culpruit was the DBS not changing the charge to the Aux battery.
My problem was it was intermittant and sometimes the battery was getting charge, in the end I found it by hooking up a can style solenoid and it started to work again.I was offroad so never had access to much testing gear other than the multimeter, but it drove me mad with the freezer sometimes being part defrosted, then would come good.

I was using 2 AGM batteries that were only a couple of months old, so was sure it wasn't them, but did originally think the Engel had lost some gas charge.

Hope this helps in some way..

Cheers Ean

[Redback]

Thanks Ean, to compinsate for this I have set my fridges battery protection setting(Waeco) to the low setting of 11.0v, I had it at 12v for about 4 to 5yrs without a problem, but since changing batteries it is now causing this issue, these are new batteries, both the same type as I had before, seeing as running the batteries below 12v is not good for them, I'm worried I'm going to kill them.

Baz.

[Basil135]

Just a thought between the differences in readings between your EMS & volt meter. Have you tried a second volt meter?

In the past, I have had 2 crazy different readings on things, but found out later, the hard way of course, that one of the meters was knackered.

Just thinking that before you totally condemn the EMS, maybe beg, borrow, or steal, ok, dont steal, another meter to confirm the readings.

[Redback]

Just a thought between the differences in readings between your EMS & volt meter. Have you tried a second volt meter?

In the past, I have had 2 crazy different readings on things, but found out later, the hard way of course, that one of the meters was knackered.

Just thinking that before you totally condemn the EMS, maybe beg, borrow, or steal, ok, dont steal, another meter to confirm the readings.

I'm not condeming any of the devices, just covering all bases to find out what the problem is, I have checked the batteries with another meter and will check it again before I start doing the 12v testing, for all I know it may only be a bad earth, or loose or bad connection somewhere, I know for certain the EMS does rely on very good earths for them to work well.

Baz.

[drivesafe]

Hi Baz, just how new is new and what type of batteries are they.

Also, unless they are dedicated cranking batteries, most batteries can be safely cycled down to 30% SoC.

[Redback]

Hi Baz, just how new is new and what type of batteries are they.

Also, unless they are dedicated cranking batteries, most batteries can be safely cycled down to 30% SoC.

Hi Tim, the main battery is less than 3mths old it's a Delkor 31-900 Cal/Cal, the auxillary is less than 12mths and it's a Fullriver DC-55 Amp Hr.

So far the fridge has been good on 240v, no up or down in temps.

I'm going to charge the second battery tonight with a 240v charger, once fully charged run the fridge on it for 24hrs disconnected from the main battery.

Once I have done this;

I will go for a long run in the car with no load on the second battery. All lights, fridge etc off. Return home, disconnect negative lead of house battery and leave for 12 hours. Voltage on battery should be around 12.7 or more if battery is fully charged, would that about be right Tim.

Then if this test is okay, I'll re-connect the negative lead and test again after 12 hours without running the car.

This should be a good test for the battery, DBS and fridge I think:confused:

What do you think Tim?

Baz.

[drivesafe]

Hi Baz, with your Disco, after the drive, the batteries will probably be up round 13-13.5v

Thats just surface charge but see how your fridge runs then.

If your cranking battery is at that voltage but your other batteries are much lower, with the motor running, check out voltage levels on the input ( RED wire ) and output ( GREY wire ) of the SC40.

[Redback]

Hi Baz, with your Disco, after the drive, the batteries will probably be up round 13-13.5v

Thats just surface charge but see how your fridge runs then.

If your cranking battery is at that voltage but your other batteries are much lower, with the motor running, check out voltage levels on the input ( RED wire ) and output ( GREY wire ) of the SC40.

I've checked the voltage of the 2 batteries and they are always around the same voltage, last time I checked them was Tuesday arvo, the car had been sitting for 2 days, the voltage of the main was 12.32v, the auxillary was 12.40v, not a great deal of difference.

Thanks Tim,

Baz.

[drivesafe]

Hi Baz, at those voltages, your batteries are not fully charged.

They are at 70% and 80% respectively. Do you have anything running off them at the time?

If not, you need to fully charge them.

Also next time you’re out and about in the disco, after driving for a while, leave the motor idling and measure the voltage at your cranking battery.

[disco 3 door]

Hi, I was running a 65 Ah aux battery which only lasted about 2 yrs. Was doing similar things. Found out needed bigger amperage. now running 97 Ah.

[Redback]

Hi Baz, at those voltages, your batteries are not fully charged.

They are at 70% and 80% respectively. Do you have anything running off them at the time?

If not, you need to fully charge them.

Also next time you’re out and about in the disco, after driving for a while, leave the motor idling and measure the voltage at your cranking battery.

Had nothing running off them, car has been sitting around not being used, I plan to charge the auxillary tonight for the test Friday morning and I'll charge the main with a run on Saturday.

I'll also do that test on the SC40 tonight, I'm also going to see what amps the fridge is drawing, I have a feeling it might be drawing too many amps, I'll do that Saturday.

disco 3 door, I've only ever run a 55AH battery in my Disco, never had a problem until lately.

Baz

[Redback]

13.2v is as high as the battery will go after being charged for over 24hrs, is this OK??

SC40 input is 14.20 output is 14.20.

Put the fridge in the car, voltage was 13.02v, turned the fridge on at 11.45AM, at 12.00pm the voltage is currently at 12.40v.


Baz.

[drivesafe]

Put the fridge in the car, voltage was 13.02v, turned the fridge on at 11.45AM, at 12.00pm the voltage is currently at 12.40v.

Hi Baz, if you mean the battery voltage dropped from 13.02 to 12,40v in 15 minutes, then it looks like your battery is not holding a charge.

If you get a chance, try running your fridge for a few hours.

Don’t worry about flattening your battery, if it goes flat after just a few hours, it’s stuffed anyway.

See how you go.

[Redback]

Hi Baz, if you mean the battery voltage dropped from 13.02 to 12,40v in 15 minutes, then it looks like your battery is not holding a charge.

If you get a chance, try running your fridge for a few hours.

Don’t worry about flattening your battery, if it goes flat after just a few hours, it’s stuffed anyway.

See how you go.

Hi Tim, this multimeter I have is a pain, it has some blank bits on the LCD readout, I checked the voltage around 4.00pm and it was sitting at 12.68v:eek:

Anyway I'm having a coffee right now(waking up) fridge has been running all night, battery protection is at medium on the fridge(11.4) so in about 10min I'll check it, I'm thinking if the battery is OK and SC40 seems to be working as it should(disconnected at the moment), the fridge is the only thing left.

If the temp has risen on the fridge from -1.0c it had settled to at 4.00pm yesterday, then it has to be the fridge that's the problem and this is why it's draining the battery, the compressor is running all the time trying to bring the temp down to what it's set at.

Baz.

[Redback]

OK, as of this morning fridge is sitting on 1.0c, volts are sitting at 12.55v:eek:

Not at all what I expected:confused: considering when we were at Barrinton and with the ambient temp there was 0 to 2.0c overnight, the fridge would increase in temp, one morning the fridge had risen to 7.0c from it's normal setting of 1.0c:spudnikwhat::bangin:

[drivesafe]

OK Baz now you are really pushing the limits.

Your fridge sounds like it is fine, your battery is obviously good but now it looks like your problems might be caused by a faulty multi meter.

If your multi meter is playing up, you really need a new one and if decide to get a new one, don’t spend a fortune on some top shelf brand, just go buy a $10 Dick Smith special.

These days even the cheapest multi meter is as accurate as the average RVer needs with less than 0.01 or 0.02v error, just don’t use them for measuring high voltages like 240vac, the insulation on their leads are not up to the safety needed for AC.

One more question, what is the charge CURRENT capacity of your battery charger?

[Redback]

I've been checking with 2 different multimetres and get the same values.

The charger is a Battery Fighter 1.25

[drivesafe]

Hi Baz and the reason I asked about the battery charger was that I vaguely remembered you posted some years back that you had the Battery Fighter.

With a maximum out put current of just 1.25 amps, a fully charged battery would still hold the voltage down and so 13.2v would indicate you have a fully charged battery.

BTW, your 1.25 amp battery charger would actually have your battery in a better charged state than bigger chargers would so this would explain why you fridge is running for so long.

Anyway everything ( except the multi meter ) sounds likes all working well. You will just have to wait till your next trip to confirm as much.

[Redback]

Just finished putting the car back together, it had a leak from somewhere, ended up being the AC drain inside the cab before it goes outside, the rubber tube was split causing water to drain into the and under the carpet:mad:

Anyway, battery is sitting on 12.38v at the moment, fridge is on 0.6c and all seems to be working well:cool:

Thanks Tim and Paul for your help with all of this, seems it may have been a loose connection or something else that caused the problem.

Thanks again everyone,

Baz.

[Redback]

Checked it again this morning at 6.30am, battery is sitting on 12.29, will be checking it again at 12.00pm.

Baz.

[Redback]

OK, so fridge was checked at 12.00pm, battery is at 12.26, fridge temp is 10c and erroring out (turned off) seems like the fridge is cutting out too early and looking at the temp it has been off for a while.

So looks like we have found the problem, now we just got to get Waeco to except the warrenty claim, might be a bit hard, according to Waeco when the fridge errors it has a red light that flashes, the time of the flashes determins what the problem is, the fridge is flashing once every 5 seconds, this indicates low battery, now I don't consider 12.30 low and as the cut off is set to 11.40, neither should the fridge, that would be my assumption.

OK Kerry has spoken to Waeco, they have suggested we check the cable and the volts at the plug, if these are OK and reading is the same volts as the battery, then it can only be two things, a bad connection inside the fridge at the plug or a faulty cut out causing it to cut out too early.

The fun begins, the service agent wants the car and fridge to check it all.

Baz.

[drivesafe]

Hi Baz, make sure you have a load on the battery.

Running the fridge for a few minutes before you test will be enough to give you a more accurate reading, tset while the fridge is still running.

Keep the feedback coming.

[Redback]

Hi Baz, make sure you have a load on the battery.

Running the fridge for a few minutes before you test will be enough to give you a more accurate reading, tset while the fridge is still running.

Keep the feedback coming.

Thanks Tim, the fridge is still in the car, Waeco have given us a proceedure to do before we check it, it's basically restarting the fridge and re-setting things to get it to stop erroring.

Baz.

[Redback]

OK the fridge is re-set and low battery is now set to LOW 10.8V (accoring to Waeco) fridge was running uplugged the plug from the fridge, put the multimeter on it, 12.15v, went around to the battery did the same 12.15v.

I could go on about the twirp at the sevice place, waffling on about it's your wiring, never replaced one of those, you know blah blah blah but I won't:mad:

Baz.

[drivesafe]

Hi Baz, try plugging in the fridge and testing the voltage as close to the fridge while it’s running.

It’s quite common for the wiring in a vehicle to cause a fridge, especially a Waeco fridge, to go to LOW VOLTAGE cut-out but in your case, your fridge use to work OK.

So have you changed something or is your fridge just getting temperamental with age?

[Redback]

Hi Baz, try plugging in the fridge and testing the voltage as close to the fridge while it’s running.

It’s quite common for the wiring in a vehicle to cause a fridge, especially a Waeco fridge, to go to LOW VOLTAGE cut-out but in your case, your fridge use to work OK.

So have you changed something or is your fridge just getting temperamental with age?

The only thing that's changed is the battery, which we replaced in January this year, I'll check it tomorrow, thanks.

Curiousity got the better of me, broke into the wires as close to the plug as possible, about 4" from the plug, 11.80 at the fridge and 11.71 at the battery, it took me a minute or two to get to the battery, I think it's safe to say the battery is not the problem.

Baz.

[Redback]

Checked again this morning, 11.6, decided that was low enough and reconnected everything back up, I wasn't comfortable taking the voltage down any further, we are going to take the fridge to a service agent and have it checked.

Before we do I might charge the battery again and set the cut out to high (12.0v) and see what happens.

Baz.

[drivesafe]

Hi Baz and at 11.6v, your battery is down to 20% SoC.

Thats a tad low but as long as you have it back on a charger straight away, that shouldn’t be a problem.

My personal choice is to try not to let an auxiliary battery get below 30% SoC, 11.75v, but some of the Calcium/Calcium battery manufacturers are now saying 20% SoC is fine.

Anyway, see what happens with the 12v setting.

[Redback]

OK, I put the fridge battery protection on 12.0v, disconnected the second battery from the DBS, ran it overnight, tested the battery after looking at the fridge to see the error light on, which means it's turned the fridge off.

I then turned the fridge off at the power, reset the battery protection to medium, turned the fridge back on and away it went, about halfway to work I noticed the error light was back on, I then tested the battery, with my new multimeter:D 12.3v:(

So it seems that when the battery protection is set at medium (11.4) and high (12.0v) it won't let the battery draw go below 12.3v.

So off to the service agent to see what he reckons.

Baz.