Series 2 Advice !!

[QWOPPER]

Hi all

Im thinking of purchasing a series 2 or 2a (without the head lights on the from wings). I am thinking about the SWB Truck body (ute) in partiuar because i like the way it looks. Here are my few questions:

1: I was just wondering if anyone had some tips for me or could give me some adive on problems they have had and approximate expenses of refurbishing one

2: can the different bodys (ute, wagon, soft top all in SWB) be converted between themselves?

3: How good are they off road (Im talking all types of off roading), and what are some good modifications to make them better off road. (I am mainly worried about the ground clearance. Apparentally only 248mm)

4: How good are they on road?

5: if i roll it, is there a roll cage to stop me dieing or do i need to get an aftermarket one

6: Is it worth it, because i would like to use it off road for touring as well as a classic car and as well as a fun project.

Thanks heaps for reading this and helping me decide what to do :)

:woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot: :woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot: :woot::woot::woot::woot: :woot::woot::woot:

[isuzutoo-eh]

Hi Qwopper,
I am afraid to tally the dollars gone into my 2a, but a friend spent something like 7 grand on his not yet finished project. Lets just say it needed a lot of effort and bits to get to a high standard. Get one that doesn't need much work, may cost a thousand more now but that might be two thousand less later...
I doubt i've spent more than $1500 on parts that i've actually needed/used, its the extras, two sets of tyres+rims, spare motor, diff lock, pto etc than has taken its financial toll for me!

The different body styles can be swapped easily. It's only bolted together...but finding soft top parts aren't so easy and new canvas and hoops can add to the cost quite rapidly.

They can be very very impressive off road. A member of LROCS runs 34" bogger tyres with chopped guards and reworked springs, different carby, otherwise stock mechanicals and is more capable than my 110. Short wheelbase means the ramp over angle is insanely good, approach and departure angles are also very good on SWBs, but not so good on rock steps, the angles get pretty extreme! The light weight is a major advantage in a lot of places too.

On road...they are not quick, quiet and petrols aren't frugal. Thats all I know of that side of things!

You could get a roll cage of sorts fabbed up, I had one for a while, it was merely bolted to the tub rather than chassis, so not all that sturdy. Better than nothing though. When fitting one up, make sure it'll clear the truck cab rear wall, as that sits proud of the bulkhead a few inches.

SWBs don't have a lot of room for gear, remembering if you go to wider or taller tyres you can't store the spare on the bonnet and see much so that takes up tub space. Of course people have used SWB Landies for touring for years so don't let anyone tell you it can't be done!

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Hi Qwopper

Sometimes you are better spending a little more money and buying a good/excellent one rather than fixing up a "restorers dream".

[series3]

Hi all

Im thinking of purchasing a series 2 or 2a (without the head lights on the from wings). I am thinking about the SWB Truck body (ute) in partiuar because i like the way it looks. Here are my few questions:

1: I was just wondering if anyone had some tips for me or could give me some adive on problems they have had and approximate expenses of refurbishing one

2: can the different bodys (ute, wagon, soft top all in SWB) be converted between themselves?

3: How good are they off road (Im talking all types of off roading), and what are some good modifications to make them better off road. (I am mainly worried about the ground clearance. Apparentally only 248mm)

4: How good are they on road?

5: if i roll it, is there a roll cage to stop me dieing or do i need to get an aftermarket one

6: Is it worth it, because i would like to use it off road for touring as well as a classic car and as well as a fun project.

Thanks heaps for reading this and helping me decide what to do :)

:woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot: :woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot: :woot::woot::woot::woot: :woot::woot::woot:

Hi quopper.

I think the most important things when looking at a series land rover would be investigating for rust and checking for smooth running order. Check for rust in all of the chassis and firewall, and make sure that the gearbox runs smoothly and doesn't jump out of gear. The gearboxes don't have synchromesh on 1st and 2nd but correct operation should smooth and crunchless. If it isn't regoed, chances are it Will take a few bob to get it on the road. Are you mechanically minded/able/willing? DIY'ing is the best way to save money.

I think mark is on the money about offroad ability. It took me a few trips to find my 2a's limits, and am pretty impressed with what the old girl can do; it can definitely keep up on the typical weekend warrior trip. Beyond there, anything can be modified to any degree to achieve anything. The only limiting factor in that sense is dosh and imagination. Stock, it has low weight, CoG and gearing which is a good start. My 2a has 7.50 16's and i don't really have an issue with clearance. I would love some mor articulation, and have yet to really encounter the carb starvation issue. I personally haven't worried about rollover protection.

Onroad they instill patience, in both accelerating and braking. They are very Spartan, and you can really tell what season it is outside. If you favor creature comforts, fast quiet and non-exhausting trips, it may not be the car for you.I think a well sorted 2.25 will consume as much as most other period carb fed petrol motors.

Is it worth it? There's only one way to find out!

Sam

[QWOPPER]

They can be very very impressive off road. A member of LROCS runs 34" bogger tyres with chopped guards and reworked springs, different carby, otherwise stock mechanicals and is more capable than my 110. Short wheelbase means the ramp over angle is insanely good, approach and departure angles are also very good on SWBs, but not so good on rock steps, the angles get pretty extreme! The light weight is a major advantage in a lot of places too.



do you have any photos of a modded series 2/2a? i am unsure whether if i bought one i would restore it to the original factory product, mod it slighty but still keep it basically original (diffs and new tyres maybe), or fully mod it out. This will be a second 'project car' so i will not be using it a whole lot around the city, but might do a few longer runs with it. LWB's seem to be much rarer than SWB's as well.

As a tourer, would it be a better idea to forget the whole restoring a car idea and just buying an older defender or (God forbid) a toyota LC?

:woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::w oot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woo t::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot: :woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::w oot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woo t::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot: :woot:

[QWOPPER]

also, do they have any heating? or cooling? or is it just opening up the windows:D! I have not done mechanics, but i would like to get into it. How does the original car run? How much would a diesel engine cost in total? new gearbox?

Thanks.

:p:):p

[isuzutoo-eh]

My diesel engine cost $400ish by memory, plus two days driving and overnight pub accomodation :D bought from a forum member who just picked up another 2a. Took me ages to find an affordable one after missing a few on ebay. Then I picked up a diesel specific dash panel and other 2.25D bits and bobs as I could from a local restorer/collector. Now i'm keeping the petrol donk in mine I want a 2a traytop 109 to put the diesel in...

Cooling in winter is via windows and firewall flaps. Heating, in summer, is via windows and firewall flaps. A heater, if fitted, circulates engine coolant through an electric fan forced radiator right next to your knee.

Series Landies are very easy to work on, apart from seized bolts/nuts... i'm an absolute amateur with mechanics and have struggled a few times but this forum, friends and actually reading the workshop manual helps a lot to that end. A great vehicle to learn mechanicing on i'd say.

My few photos of the modded 2a can be found here:
May 2011 | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/media/set/'set=a.10150189792020216.303682.697480215&l=8cbb706b18)
note: you don't need to join fb to view them...I hope

[JayBoRover]

Cooling in winter is via windows and firewall flaps. Heating, in summer, is via windows and firewall flaps.
:clap2::Rolling: That is pure gold! I suspect that's going to be a dash label in my S2a:cool:

also, do they have any heating? or cooling? or is it just opening up the windows!
After a while you realise the front firewall vents are very effective. I bought my S2a (first LR for me) just before Christmas and drove it through summer to wean myself off my Nissan Patrol. After a few weeks I had to use the Nissan one day for a 54km drive to a work site. It was too quiet, the radio was boring and the DJs stupid, so before half way I had turned the stereo off, turned the air con off and opened the window to let the noise and air in. The lovely looking single bucket seat of the Nissan is not as comfortable as the standard Series seat, although on hot days the sweat-wet bum and back takes some explaining in the office.

All the other Nissan drivers completely ignore me. It's a boring thing to drive. In the six months I used the Landy to see if it was going to be reliable it hasn't let me down, despite doing many 150km odd trips for work. The Nissan has let me down twice in that time despite rare use.

I also learnt a new trick the other week. During a very heavy downpour and while stopped on the Freeway in traffic, I was able to cup my hands together and have a nice refreshing, fresh water drink from the waterfall cascading in from the roof/windscreen/doortop ... much to the great amusement of the guy in a car beside me:D. Further amusement at work when I came in looking as wet as if I'd ridden a motorcycle to work:(.

I don't think I'd change it for it anything now. I even walk past the wife's twin turbo Audi to get in DeeDee (Daily Driver;)) more often than not.

Best of luck.
John B

[The ho har's]

Ahh the series vehicle:)

What everybody has said is true, if you don't want to spend lots of time and money, then get one that is in reasonable condition.

They are an extremely capable little vehicle.

Yes they are a pleasure to drive, once you get used to the fact that you will get everywhere slower, without airconditioning or heating (in some cases)
though you do get lots of waves:D

go for it;)

Mrs hh:angel:

[UncleHo]

G'day QWOPPER :)

Just a few facts on the ownership of a Series2/2a Landrover, they only have a top speed around 85-95KPH or 100KPH down a mine shaft without an overdrive,:) they have UN-boosted drum brakes,the SWB has 10 inch drums and the LWB has 11 inch drums you can fit an aftermarket booster to them, they do not have power steering,a heater was an extra when these were built,the 2.25 petrol motor will do as much as 20 miles to the gallon (about 25Klms per 4.5 litres) max speed from a 2.25 diesel is about 80/85 Kph,and as said by JoBo heating and cooling is by front vents and windows, also engine heat is via the floor and in summer is quite noticable, but to uninitiated they can come as a shock to the senses,but owners grow to love them,I have had mine for over 20 years now (1968 LWB) bought it in 86 totally rebuilt it, including a chassis straighten :(


cheers

[QWOPPER]

Thanks for all the advice everyone :BigThumb: . I bow down to you all... :TakeABow: . So What should i do if i was to buy a series two:

a: Restore it to its original beauty in all ways, and keep it clean and have a classic which is a bit of a pain to live with

OR

b: Keep the original body shape but change the underpinnings (New deisel engine, Better suspension, wider tyres, air lockers, re gearing etc, etc,)

Thanks for the Facebook link isuzutoo-eh, i liked the "serious series" very much. The only problem is the SWB ute tray is too small. Thats why im thinking LWB. The series look good when they are all modded up! :lol2: .

I am still split in two minds though. I would really like a classic, because it will keep its value and it will be really awesome to be driving around in a 1960's car, but it would be good to mod it up so that i had a good touring/off road 4x4 as well as a classic.

Please help me !

Thanks

Qwopper

[isuzutoo-eh]

In my rarely humble opinion, if you are going to get a Series body and change all the underpinnings, you might as well buy a Defender. There isn't that much difference in the bodies between a late 50s Series 2 and a 2011 Defender: bonnet, radiator position, windscreen and flares. The classic look is alive and well. But ute/truck cabs with a tub are hard to come across with coil sprung Landies.

[JayBoRover]

How about picking up the best, most original one you can find within your price range. Then start adding things to customise it to what you want but never making any irreversible change. Just "bolt on" stuff.

Keep all the standard "bolt off" stuff you removed, treat it to prevent rust and corrosion, wrap it well, label it and store it. One day, when you become older and wiser, you'll realise the value of the old girl in original trim and have everything you need to either restore it or sell all the original bits with it for someone else to restore.

In the mean time you get the enjoyment of learning all about the modifications (and the fact that the more mod's you make the more things break!), enjoy driving the modified rig (and get frustrated when someone does better and goes further in a standard rig) and all secure in the knowledge you haven't made a mistake in the long term. It will restrict you a little, but really the modifications you can't make you probably don't really need. Remember these old girls in standard trim were cutting through uncharted territory, true bush-bashing, all over the outback, long before ABS, A/C, P/W, HDC, ESC, EFI, ETC, DOHC, 5VH, etc, etc came out.:D

Just my 2c worth.;)
Cheers
John B

[QWOPPER]

The only thing that worries me a little is the skinny tyres. It looks as though the car would tip over if you acidentally shut the door too hard !!! :D:p:lol2:

Are air lockers a reversible change?

As you say JayBoRover, I will become older and wiser (hopefully :p) and then i will want an original. And they were meant and made for the toughest environments

I've been looking around carsales.com but there isn't much fro sale there. Know any other good websites?

Thanks

Qwopper

(P.S. What do you guys think about a SWB vs a LWB ---> any advantages/disadvantages to either?)

[THE BOOGER]

Re the swb v lwb off road the swb is better but if you want to carry all your gear then you cant go past a 109. A rear locker can be installed and no one will know but it will improve the off road capability heaps:D means less snatches from other on trips:p
Where to but a series? you will be hard up to find one in a car yard look in the markets section of the forum and ebay/trading post there are some good deals out there:)

[NiteMare]

i wouldn't restrict yourself to landrover forums and ebay while looking for your motor

my first was bought off ebay and was a £350 wreck, i spent time,money and effort building it up to a usable scruffy rattley daily driver and have used it for everything for the last two years

my second is a 1965 109 that i found on RetroRides almost 2 years ago which is a general custom and classic car forum, i've spent the last 6 months or so assembling it the way i want it

my third was a lucky and unusual field find that one of my brothers spotted and put me onto, after a little research this turned out to be a 1970/71 New Zealand ex-military 88" 2a, cut wings etc (almost unheard of here in England), this is now awaiting my attentions with the welder when i've finished my 109 (i also got it really cheap as the owner and myself didn't realise what he had at the time)

my fourth was only really bought because it had an overdrive in it but when i looked at it closely it turned out the chassis is almost beyond saving so it has turned into spare parts only and most of it has been sold off or shelved

i also know where there is a late Series1, i think it is a 1956/57 sat in someones garden rotting away, i really must go back sometime and chat with the owner again to see if i can rescue it as it hasn't moved in the two years i've known it to be sat there

anyway put out feelers all around your family and friends as they may spot something somewhere, i've found at least six 88" Series2's sat in folks gardens since i've started tinkering with them and looked at a few that really are only good for spare parts (one had a chassis that collapsed if you gripped it too hard all that was left was the welded corners really)

finally, if you don't know what you are looking at i'd suggest you get someone local that does to come inspect it with you as it's really easy to get caught out with garden/field finds even if they do run/drive, take a big screwdriver and stab the chassis in all the corners underneath and don't be shy as one little hole could be the beginnings of major surgery

pictures of my 88" bitsa and the work carried out
Zebedee pictures by NiteMare_08 - Photobucket (http://s259.photobucket.com/albums/hh311/NiteMare_08/Zebedee/)

and pictures of my 109 and the surgery required to put back together
My 1965 109 pictures by NiteMare_08 - Photobucket (http://s259.photobucket.com/albums/hh311/NiteMare_08/My%201965%20109/)

i hope these might give you a few clues as to what you might be letting yourself in for if you're not careful

good luck with your search, there's nothing i've found funnier or more enjoyable to drive than my old leafsprung land rover

Cheers
Pete

[JayBoRover]

The only thing that worries me a little is the skinny tyres. It looks as though the car would tip over if you acidentally shut the door too hard !!! :D:p:lol2:
Those "skinny tyres" are a heck of a lot easier to turn when you don't have power steering!!! There are many occasions where the skinny tyres perform better than the same pattern wide tyres. It's just they're not as fashionable. I recently changed from 31x10.5R15 tyres to the standard 7.50x16 tyres and removed the power steering system that a previous owner had grafted on. Putting power steering on is possible but difficult or impossible to do in a "bolt on" manner to retain ease of restoring back to original later.

[Sleepy]

235/85 16's look good on a Series 2. (Standard Defender Tyres). Only slightly bigger than 7.50's. Anything bigger and you will snap axles, break expensive bits or need to upgrade them all $$$$$

Without drifting into a tyre thread, your length of tire contact is more important than the width - in most occassions. - (doning flame proof suit)

I think, as mentioned, if you want a modified vehicle then get a Defender and you will have a more capabable/comfortable vehicle with plenty of Land Rover "spirit". However if you get a Series 2, I would go for the late Series 2A and leave it pretty much standard. Parabolic springs will improve the ride. A heater is a nice extra. Then just enjoy it. :D

[banjo]

235/85 16's look good on a Series 2. (Standard Defender Tyres). Only slightly bigger than 7.50's. Anything bigger and you will snap axles, break expensive bits or need to upgrade them all $$$$$

Without drifting into a tyre thread, your length of tire contact is more important than the width - in most occassions. - (doning flame proof suit)

I think, as mentioned, if you want a modified vehicle then get a Defender and you will have a more capabable/comfortable vehicle with plenty of Land Rover "spirit". However if you get a Series 2, I would go for the late Series 2A and leave it pretty much standard. Parabolic springs will improve the ride. A heater is a nice extra. Then just enjoy it. :D

What about power steering..My old series is good with 31s on it but harry getting atleast 33 inch...

[JDNSW]

The only thing that worries me a little is the skinny tyres. It looks as though the car would tip over if you acidentally shut the door too hard !!! :D:p:lol2:
........

Thanks

Qwopper

(P.S. What do you guys think about a SWB vs a LWB ---> any advantages/disadvantages to either?)


There are no advantages in wider tyres unless you are into extreme offroading (and then it depends on the terrain) although there are some advantages in larger diameter tyres - but disadvantages as well. And as pointed out, without power steering the "skinny" tyres have real advantages. And looks is hardly a valid reason for tyre choice.

An swb is going to be easier to drive (better turning circles, lighter steering, better acceleration, easier to park), more economical, and better offroad in rough country; but the ride will be choppy compared to a lwb, and it does not take much to fill up the back. A lwb will carry a lot more and will ride better (at least with a bit of weight in the back) but is thirstier, slower and harder to park. It all depends on what you want to use it for.

John

[MickS]

Here you go....in markets...

http://www.aulro.com/apc/showproduct.php/product/5460/cat/4 (http://www.aulro.com/afvb/../apc/showproduct.php/product/5460/cat/4)

[peterg1001]

Here you go....in markets...

http://www.aulro.com/apc/showproduct.php/product/5460/cat/4 (http://www.aulro.com/afvb/../apc/showproduct.php/product/5460/cat/4)

And that one was just passed in on ebay at $4000, so I would think there might be some room for negotiation.

I would also endorse the advice to spend the money up front, and get something halfway decent to start with.

You'll save money in the long run - I can confirm that from experience. Mark's $7000 is a pittance compared to what I've spent so far, and I'm still going.

Peter