HF Radio

[numpty]

I am looking at purchasing an HF radio and not wishing to buy new due to cost. Can anyone give me opinions on a Codan 8525?

Perry

[Lotz-A-Landies]

I am looking at purchasing an HF radio and not wishing to buy new due to cost. Can anyone give me opinions on a Codan 8525?

Perry8525 (a) is too old (only 3MHz to 18MHz). They rarely have sellcal and can't do telcall. 8525b better but still too old.

These days I suggest the 8528 as the minimum, provided it is telcall capable and programmed for 27MHz CB channels plus programmed for all your desired VK737 etc channels.

The Codan 9323 is a good set and I suggest best Codan value for money, its cable programmed rather than having to burn an EPROM of the older sets.

Diana

[p38arover]

Perry, PM sent.

Also look at QMAc HF90 - http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/1330 - originally over $7k, now under $1K

See also http://www.hfradiosales.com.au/codan_%20barrett_hf_radio_information/RADIOS/Qmac_HF90.htm

[RangieBit]

Hi Perry,

Firstly I will say I have never owned this particular HF radio though have in the past owned other Codan units. If this is anything like it's successors then its probably built like the proverbial brick ****house and should have many years of life in it yet. That said, it should have been well sited to protect it and well maintained in order for it to continue to give good service. Correctly maintained they will provide you with many years of faithful service. I've never had issues with any Codan I've had or operated, though as previously mentioned I've never owned this particular unit.

Not sure where you intend to purchase this from but would suggest you get a properly "refurbished" unit from a reputable seller. Yes, they are on eBay as well and you'll find them without looking too hard.

Now, depending on what experience you have with radios of any sort I would suggest something a little more modern might be a better choice. If you are used to operating radio equipment (were a Ham or ADF radio operator in a former life) then you should have no trouble coming to terms with this particular 99 channel unit.

No HF radio I have encountered is difficult to come to terms with but the older units do require a bit of radio knowledge or the learning curve for operation is very much steeper. They are much more complex than a UHF CB, and in untrained hands much more damaging to the RF spectrum and their operators. So, if you have never operated anything more complex than a CB I would suggest trying to stretch your budget to something a little more modern like a 9323 or if you can really stretch it an NGT. Both of these units can be obtained pre-owned. The NGT in particular is almost as easy to use as a mobile phone. There are Barrett units as well you might also consider if you don't already have a brand preference.

I suggest you have a look on this great Interweb thingy and see if you can get hold of the operation manual for the 8523/8525 and give it a read. If it makes sense to you. If you feel you could operate it without confusion then I'm sure you'll be very happy with your choice of radio.

Next, please don't consider getting a wire tap antenna to "keep the costs down". Doing so will cut costs but I can offer you assurances that you will most likely regret the decision. Go with an Autotune antenna unit. They are indeed more expensive but the convenience involved will far outweigh that initial cost very quickly in actual use.

Getting out of the vehicle to constantly change the little wire (if you don't lose it) every time you change a channel is a right PITA. Likewise they will restrict your operation to a limited number of frequencies. You will see Emergency Services vehicles with wire-tap, tuned length antennas. They can get away with it because those that use these form of antenna usually don't change frequency very often, if at all. Anyone travelling our vast country far enough and expecting to operate their radio is going to find only 12-15 frequencies very limiting. 12-15 might sound adequate but if you look at a list of frequencies for VKS737/HF-Oz/RadTel/HF-Tel/RFDS you will quickly see that number very limiting. If the frequency is not catered for on your antenna then you cannot transmit on this frequency. To do so would risk the integrity of your radio. That is you could, quite literally, blow it up. Autotune antennas don't have this issue. They can tune appropriately to whichever frequency is necessary. The naysayers will say they can't tune as accurately as a tuned length antenna which is true (and why the ES often choose wire tapped). For your intended use it makes no practical difference.

Hope these thoughts are of use to you.

Cheers,
Iain

[The ho har's]

We have the 8525B...yes it is old, we have been advised by our radio repairer to take particular care with the mic as you cannot get them anymore;) when it dies its dead forever:(

So perhaps not the best HF for you:)

Mrs hh:angel:

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Perry

Agreeing with Iain, I currently have an 8525 and and 8528 and two 9323. When buying, stretch your purse to the 9323 min.

Yes on the ATU - the CODAN 9350 ATU, try to get a "D" suffix.

Barrett is also good and their ATU are smaller than the CODAN (about the size of a large thermos flask).

Diana

[numpty]

Thanks Iain and Diana.

Yes, it was an 8525b with multitap antenna. I had an older 2 channel Wagner set which while it worked fine was very, very limited. Many years ago I successfully owned and operated an old 6810 set, so I certainly appreciate the operations and limitations of such equipment.

I will look into the 9323 and maybe you could enlighten me about the 9350 antenna. Meanwhile I,ll do some googling myself.

Perry

[87County]

Thanks Iain and Diana.

Yes, it was an 8525b with multitap antenna. I had an older 2 channel Wagner set which while it worked fine was very, very limited. Many years ago I successfully owned and operated an old 6810 set, so I certainly appreciate the operations and limitations of such equipment.

I will look into the 9323 and maybe you could enlighten me about the 9350 antenna. Meanwhile I,ll do some googling myself.

Perry

You know about tuning antennae etc ? the later auto tuners require no "tapping" like the earlier types

The 9350 should be OK (it is rebuildable) unlike the 8558 which came out about the time of the 8525 radio. All advice seems to be to steer clear of the 8558 antenna.

There is a new Codan solid state antenna but I don't know if the older radios will drive it.

I notice that radio resellers want about $900 for a reconditioned 9350 with some kind of BtB warranty - a new one would be about $1500 I guess.

Have a look at http://www.hf-radio.com.au/ and http://www.lakecomm.com.au/2ndhf.html

HTH :)

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Thanks Iain and Diana.

Yes, it was an 8525b with multitap antenna. I had an older 2 channel Wagner set which while it worked fine was very, very limited. Many years ago I successfully owned and operated an old 6810 set, so I certainly appreciate the operations and limitations of such equipment.

I will look into the 9323 and maybe you could enlighten me about the 9350 antenna. Meanwhile I,ll do some googling myself.

Perryhttp://www.on-track4wd.co.nz/antenna9350.jpg
The 9350 is about 600mm tall + the whip antenna

Has a RF coax cable and a multipin control cable. It works with the internal electronics of the set to tune the antenna to the electrical length required to the chosen frequency.

[RangieBit]

Yep,

+1 to what 87County said.

The 9350 is definitely the go. The useful glitch to that is that most of the pre-93XX series radios won't generally drive it without significant modification. Any autotune generation prior to this isn't worth consideration.

The 9350 uses a series of stepper motors to achieve the tune (helped along by a smart set of electronics). Basically the autotune tries to help the radio achieve a SWR of 1:1 in the antenna when you select Tune. It seldom, if ever, achieves this but is happy to get 2:1 or better. This tuning process can take quite a few seconds due to a number of factors and has to be done for each frequency selected.

The more recent 3040 Solid State unit mentioned achieves the same thing through the use of relays so is much quicker to do a primary tune for a frequency and almost instantaneous for subsequent selections of that frequency due to a memory facility. Not sure of its compatibility with older series radios as this is the unit of choice to go with NGT radios.

The 9350 is still an excellent unit and still going strong. They do require the latest firmware to get the best from them though. Try to get one at least at "D" series level. There are a number of accredited agents about who can service/upgrade them for you.

Due to the fact that these units are quite bulky, and recent legislative changes, the place to mount these seems to be at the rear of the vehicle. Most commonly this appears to be on a rack attached to the spare wheel mount on the rear door. When I owned my D2 this is where mine was mounted. If mounting on a bullbar (and check with your state authorities as to what is allowed) ensure that you reinforce the mounting tab significantly. These units can weigh around 6kg and, with the wind area, place a significant load on their mounting points. Alternately mount to the platform of the main frame of the bull bar. Ensure that the top of the tuning unit is above the nearest flat expanse of metal i.e bonnet or roof. This area forms part of the ground plane for the antenna and the autotuners get very upset if they start propagating the RF signal below this plane. You notice this first by your radio refusing to tune. People have been known to ignore this and have done significant damage the autotune unit and their radios.

Pricing of the 9350 is as 87county says, though I'm sure unit cost would be less if purchased as part of a complete package.

As before if you're not set on a Codan unit check out some of the Barrett units like the 250/550/950/2050. All of these use the 510/910 Autotune unit which uses relays like the Codan 3040 and is smaller as Diana described. It tunes quickly, typically a second or less, and remembers frequency settings so re-tunes very fast. Just don't get a white one as these were prone to having the body deteriorate badly. The grey versions are fine it seems.

Barrett have a newer Autotune 2019 which curiously looks a lot like the Codan 9350. This unit is intended to complement their 2050 radio.

You should find lots of info out there on these units (and the radios) and there's always folk here ready to answer specific questions you may have.

Good Luck and Happy Hunting,
Iain

[87County]

Your post was interesting Iain, good advice about aeriel mounting.....and I would think that anyone looking to spend more than $1,000 total could well look at whether it would be worth stretching to a 2nd hand Barrett 2050 package at around the $2k mark - Barretts always seem to be a little cheaper than Codans when used but not when new.

The latest efforts from each company are very attractive but seem to be over $4k for a full package - I'm told that the latest Barrett is wireless between the components - does this mean you can carry the handpiece into your camp or motel room and use it remotely (assuming the radio has power)?

[RangieBit]

I'm told that the latest Barrett is wireless between the components - does this mean you can carry the handpiece into your camp or motel room and use it remotely (assuming the radio has power)?

As best I am able to determine this may well be the case. It seems to operate its own version of a 802.11 wireless network and as such probably has similar range. I think the documentation suggests within 8 metres of the vehicle. I guess if the car is parked right outside you could operate the radio from the comfort of your motel room. I suspect the walls of the motel might be a limiting factor on range and quality though. Certainly it should work in the camp environment with very little trouble.

I miss having my Barrett 950 installed on my travels (but then on an L322 Range Rover you don't really have anywhere to mount the antenna). The new wireless 2050 is certainly tempting and could provide nice incentive to find a solution to the where to mount the antenna thing.;)

Cheers,
Iain

[numpty]

Thanks all.

I thought I'd read somewhere about steering clear of one of the autotunes (obviously the one Diana mentioned) and I am aware of the issues regarding aerial mounting.

Perry

[peter5111]

Yep,


As before if you're not set on a Codan unit check out some of the Barrett units like the 250/550/950/2050. All of these use the 510/910 Autotune unit which uses relays like the Codan 3040 and is smaller as Diana described. It tunes quickly, typically a second or less, and remembers frequency settings so re-tunes very fast. Just don't get a white one as these were prone to having the body deteriorate badly. The grey versions are fine it seems.

Barrett have a newer Autotune 2019 which curiously looks a lot like the Codan 9350. This unit is intended to complement their 2050 radio.




The 510 does not have a frequency memory. It tunes new frequencies from scratch every time. Still only takes 2 - 5 seconds so not a big deal.

Don't worry too much about avoiding the white bodied 510's if the price is right. The case can be replaced with the current 910 case. Just needs a couple of mm shaved off the bottom of the board. I am working on overhauling the 4 sets of Barrett gear I picked up recently and they all need new cases before I will be happy with them. Interesting that Electric Bug carry a few sets of 910 cases, but no 9350 spares. That says a lot about 9350 case durability if nothing else.

Despite the 2019 looking a lot like the 9350, it still uses relay tuning. I don't believe it has channel memory either, but open to be corrected on that.

The 9350 is slightly more efficient than the 3040 and will tune lower. But has longer tune time. Both Codan tuners can be made to work with other radios on a manual basis quite easily. Getting them to work properly with the TUNE button on non Codan radios can take a bit of doing but not impossible.

Pete

[peter5111]

On the topic of ATU mounting, what solutions are people using for rear mounts ?

I picked up a second hand spare tyre bracket mount, but it was designed for Barrett gear. If I fit a 9350 then open the barn door fully I will be up for a new tail light :mad:

It is going to work nicely with the 510 tuners I am working on, but I have a 9350 / NGT combination I want to fit permanently.

[RangieBit]

Thanks for the addendum Pete,

Very handy to know the 510's can be re-cased in the newer 910 form.

I know the 910/911 has memory capability and I am only presuming that the 2019 has it as well. Never got close enough to the new beast to pull one apart. Can't see a good reason why they'd take out the capability from this given the newer technology of the 2050 and all. They could have moved this into the radio electronics. The end result would be the same though.

I agree with the 9350 being one mean unit. Not sure what the hell Codan use to form the cases but I have seen one of these after a roo strike. It survived the encounter with hardly a mark on it. The same could not be said for the unfortunate skippy. Tough I think is the mildest word I could use.

Surprised about the 9350 doing damage to your tail lights potentially. I guess it has a lot more girth than the 910 though. Maybe the mount on my D2 was originally intended for the Codan as it had a 9350 and a 910 mounted to it at different times over it's life and neither fouled any part of the car. The 9350 did sit significantly higher above the roof line though given its size. I think it came from Australian 4WD Storage Systems.

Again, all good useful info to have.

Cheers,
Iain

[peter5111]

I agree with the 9350 being one mean unit. Not sure what the hell Codan use to form the cases but I have seen one of these after a roo strike. It survived the encounter with hardly a mark on it. The same could not be said for the unfortunate skippy. Tough I think is the mildest word I could use.

Surprised about the 9350 doing damage to your tail lights potentially. I guess it has a lot more girth than the 910 though. Maybe the mount on my D2 was originally intended for the Codan as it had a 9350 and a 910 mounted to it at different times over it's life and neither fouled any part of the car. The 9350 did sit significantly higher above the roof line though given its size. I think it came from Australian 4WD Storage Systems.

Again, all good useful info to have.

Cheers,
Iain

Tough 9350's : I know of one that was attached to an NT? Coppers (I think) cruiser that got rolled. Story goes it got returned to Codan for repair to which Codan replied : Why did you send us a servicable ATU ? :D

The 9350's are a one piece injection molding. For best strength and waterproofing, the antenna thread is actually inserted into the molding machine and the case is injected around it :eek: Talk about going all out to make it bulletproof.
Funny thing is the antenna was sealed so well that when the ATU goes from full strength tropical sun to monsoonal downpour they started sucking in traces of water with the shock cooling. That's why all Codan HF gear now has a small gortex breather fitted somewhere..


The 9350 isn't much wider across the base than the 910 case, but it is just enough that it will catch me out at some point. The 910 is also fatter in the middle and tapers towards each end so it picks up some clearance that way too.

[peter5111]

Forgot this one for comparison

[RangieBit]

Thanks for sharing that one Pete.

That poor ol' 910 looks like it's been through a couple of conflicts :o

Cheers,
Iain

[peter5111]

Ian,

That 910 is the flash one in really GOOD condition.... :eek:
It is a great comparison of condition though. Personally given the choice, the 9350 wins hands down.

The grey 510 has a cracked upper housing, both of the white housings are starting to fall apart and I didn't realize Barrett even made a 510 with a single vibration damper so that one is OLD..

Pity the auction photo's didn't show poor condition or I would probably have let it go. At least I picked up the matching transceivers and they all appear to be in good condition.

Starting to thrash out the details of my installation and it looks like there are qty (2) of 40A feeders running to the optional heated seats. A quick tweak with my Nanocom and I should be able to wake them both up. Factory wiring, sweet :)

The 550 will probably go under the drivers seat with the ATU on the wheel carrier mount I already have. The 9350 will end up on the bullbar with the NGT under the Pax seat. Not sure how well the two transceivers will interact with each other though. I will eventually trim down to just the Codan gear, but I need a test bench for the Barrett stuff while I am working on them.
Would dearly love to track down an IC-706MkII at a reasonable price.

The way things are going with all this Barrett gear I am going to damn near be an expert on it by the time I am done :). Already have the service manuals and software, now I just need to wrap my head around the ATU idiosyncrasies - They really are white man's magic. ;)