Dual Battery Install - 2013 110

[Willow4]

Hi all,

I spent most of today installing a dual battery setup in the 110. After a few challenges, I finally got it all done. The basic setup is:

DBS - Traxide SC160
Tray - from Devon4x4
MegaFuse Holder - Blueseas
Accessories fusebox - Narva
Batteries - Optima D34's

(I'm still note sure I'm getting the picture uploads right - so sorry if they are not in the correct order with the comments)

Here is everything laid out ready to start

60658

The first challenge was that the Land Rover 'mega fuse' does not appear to be a standard size like ANL. Therefore I had to extend cut the holes out to slots to make it fit the ANL fuse holder.

60661

I should also explain the only reason I had to change this is because the location of the battery terminal posts on the Optima batteries are further from the battery edge. Therefore the Land Rover 'mega' fuse would not fit. In this picture you can see the difference in size.

60660

Here is the ANL fuse holder and the Traxide SC160 installed.

60662

The white wire here is the dash module for the SC160. It allows you to select various modes - winching, jump start, etc. I have temporarily ran this up and stuck it next to the UHF. However I plan to get one of the factory switches (with built in LED) and convery the dash module to look more factory. Tim (from Traxide) provides detail on how to do this if you dont wish to use his supplied module.

60663

a picture of the completed install.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/
cheers,

Wayne

[n plus one]

Nice install.

FYI, the Land Rover megafuse is just that - a 'mega fuse', and you can buy holders to suit.

Also, the LR fuse holder DOES fit on the Odyssey PC1500 battery.

Just a heads-up for those who come behind...

[Willow4]

Thanks for that - I didn't realise the 'megafuse' was an actual standard - I thought it was more a general reference.

Regarding the Odyssey batteries - yes I found that out AFTER I had bought the Optima's :mad:

Anyhow - so far I'm happy with the Optima's. Will see how they go over time.

cheers.

[ProjectDirector]

Hi all,

I spent most of today installing a dual battery setup in the 110. After a few challenges, I finally got it all done. The basic setup is:

DBS - Traxide SC160
Tray - from Devon4x4
MegaFuse Holder - Blueseas
Accessories fusebox - Narva
Batteries - Optima D34's

(I'm still note sure I'm getting the picture uploads right - so sorry if they are not in the correct order with the comments)

Here is everything laid out ready to start

The first challenge was that the Land Rover 'mega fuse' does not appear to be a standard size like ANL. Therefore I had to extend cut the holes out to slots to make it fit the ANL fuse holder.

I should also explain the only reason I had to change this is because the location of the battery terminal posts on the Optima batteries are further from the battery edge. Therefore the Land Rover 'mega' fuse would not fit. In this picture you can see the difference in size.

Here is the ANL fuse holder and the Traxide SC160 installed.

The white wire here is the dash module for the SC160. It allows you to select various modes - winching, jump start, etc. I have temporarily ran this up and stuck it next to the UHF. However I plan to get one of the factory switches (with built in LED) and convery the dash module to look more factory. Tim (from Traxide) provides detail on how to do this if you dont wish to use his supplied module.

I had posted a picture of the completed install in Blade74's thread and now cant post another copy of it :angel: therefore here is the link to the previous post - post #12: http://www.aulro.com/afvb/90-110-130-defender-county/174764-second-battery-choice-2.html

cheers,

Wayne

True to your word mate, this is well done.
Looking forward doing this to my def 110.
Cheers

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[Blade74]

Hey Willow. Top job mate.

Looking at the tray it looks like you couldn't use the original land rover battery if you wanted to as its closer to 320mm long.
Guessing it means you are required to buy two new batteries as you have done?
Are the D34's ok as dual purpose cranking/deep cycle batteries?

[Willow4]

Hi Blade,

correct - you can't use the original LR battery with the Devon4x4 tray. It is built perfectly for Optima D34's or the equivalent Odyssey.

This is the first time I have used the Optima's and I have heard mixed reviews. But from what I can gather, their success depends a lot on the battery charging system. After speaking to Tim (Traxide) I'm confident this system should be fine. As a dual purpose battery (crank and deep cycle) I understand them to be excellent.

I'm hoping to finish the install next weekend. Installing the fuse box (for accessories) and running cabling to the rear of the cab.

[n plus one]

Optimas don't like heat either - so they're perfect for an underseat install.

[inside]

Shouldn't the leads that run to the dual battery controller have a circuit breaker in them? Also conduit on all the positive leads is wise yes?

[Willow4]

Just thought I would add the last part of the install.

I finally got the time to run the power cables from the battery to the rear of the Defender, install an Anderson plug on the rear bar and install a power board in the back for accessories/fridge.

First I installed a 50amp circuit breaker in the battery area and then ran the heavy duty cables Tim (Traxide) provided to the rear of the car (all connections to the aux battery are made via this circuit breaker).

As it takes a bit of effort to run the cables to the rear, I included an additional 4 15amp wires in the conduit for future use. Possible rear work lamps, etc (when funds allow). See below.

62673

I ran the cables in parallel to the factory wiring loom that runs along the left hand side chassis. Also adding heat reflective foil as per the factory loom where it runs close to the muffler. Sorry - I was a bit slack and did not take any photo's of this work :angel:

Here is a photo of some of the various components.
62671

Here is the 'power board' case prior to fitting any sockets, etc.
62670

And here is the electronic gauge. It has the following features:
- 30 amp
- voltage (volts)
- current (amps)
- power (watts)
- amp/hours
- and a few other things
62672

[Willow4]

Part way through put everything together. Here is the case with the holes cut out, merit sockets and starting to get the wires made up.

62678

For additional protection, I also included an auto resetting 30amp circuit breaker in the case. Therefore any/all accessories plugged in can only draw a maximum of 30amps. Here is the case with the circuit breaker installed and the wires going in.

62679

Again, got a bit slack with taking photos.

So here is the finished unit installed in the rear of the car on the left hand side near the rear speaker.

62681

And here it is turned on - showing volts and amps.

62682

Whilst the unit is always supplying power to the sockets, you can turn the display on or off as you choose.

The case has two merit sockets and one Engel posi-lock socket. The merit sockets have a switch to enable you to turn power on or off independently while the Engel socket has power constantly.

The next job is to install the new ARB air compressor :D

Oh bugger - more cabling .......

[Chops]

Hey Wayne, top looking job mate, where'd you source the gauge from?

[ProjectDirector]

Part way through put everything together. Here is the case with the holes cut out, merit sockets and starting to get the wires made up.

62678

For additional protection, I also included an auto resetting 30amp circuit breaker in the case. Therefore any/all accessories plugged in can only draw a maximum of 30amps. Here is the case with the circuit breaker installed and the wires going in.

62679

Again, got a bit slack with taking photos.

So here is the finished unit installed in the rear of the car on the left hand side near the rear speaker.

62681

And here it is turned on - showing volts and amps.

62682

Whilst the unit is always supplying power to the sockets, you can turn the display on or off as you choose.

The case has two merit sockets and one Engel posi-lock socket. The merit sockets have a switch to enable you to turn power on or off independently while the Engel socket has power constantly.

The next job is to install the new ARB air compressor :D

Oh bugger - more cabling .......

Hi Wayne, just sent you an email so can change notes on the defender.
Cheers

[Willow4]

Hi Chops,

thanks - I'm rather pleased with the final solution. If the case was grey (instead of black), I think it would look nearly factory :)

I got the gauge from my favourite online parts store - ebay ! There are many on there that will show volts and amps, however this one stood out as it can also do watts, amp hour remaining, % left, etc.

I have not yet calibrated it - will hopefully get onto that soon. This is required to provide more accurate amps, watts, etc.

From memory, it was about $35 from China. Very good service from the seller. Was here in a week, came very well packed with detailed instuctions for install, calibration, etc.

cheers,

Wayne

[Willow4]

Hi Chops,

forgot to mention, this gauge has the shunt built in - so no need for mounting an external shunt.

It is rated for 90v and 30amps. The seller also had higher spec versions - for example 120v and 50amp. However all of the higher spec gauges did require an external shunt.

cheers,

Wayne

[Chops]

Hi Chops,

forgot to mention, this gauge has the shunt built in - so no need for mounting an external shunt.

It is rated for 90v and 30amps. The seller also had higher spec versions - for example 120v and 50amp. However all of the higher spec gauges did require an external shunt.

cheers,

Wayne

Pardon my ignorance,, but what's a "shunt"?

[Leroy_Riding]

out of curiosity why did you opt for a yellow top cranking battery? would not a red top be better suited? higher CCA slightly lower residual but as the crank battery should not be discharged to a low voltage often/ever it seems a little redundant to use a deep cycle?

on that note, how do you find the D34 as a crank battery? I already have a D34 yellow top as my secondary battery but like the clean instal and extra space using one for a crank battery seems to give (Personally I would go Red top though) just curious how it cranks and performs on a winch compared to the factory battery?

Leroy

[Willow4]

You are pushing my electrical knowledge here - and so I am happy to be corrected by someone more knowledgable !

When measuring amps via an ammeter, a shunt provides a 'known' resistance in series with the the load. This allows a 'smaller' ammeter to be used to measure 'larger' loads.

I hope I got that right .....

[Willow4]

Hi Leroy,

I did some research and found a number of recommendations for using the yellow top and also found some that did not support the yellow tops.

And then I read an article in an English LR magazine (just can't find it at the moment) and the article showed an install using two yellow tops and a Blue Sea isolator. It was highly recommended configuration by a prominent LR specialist.

So I bit the bullet and went with them and based my install on the article - but used Tim's USI-160 isolator instead of the Blue Seas. I also spoke to Tim a number of times on the phone.

So far, the yellow top cranks the defender with no issues what so ever. I can not tell any difference from the original battery.

Whilst I don't have a winch yet (will try and sneak that purchase in shortly), Tim's USI-160 can be set to winch mode and will join the two yellow tops together for winching. If you seen one - have a look, its a very cleaver bit of kit.

Overall I am very impressed with both the yellow tops and Tim's isolator.

[rovers4]

You are pushing my electrical knowledge here - and so I am happy to be corrected by someone more knowledgable !

When measuring amps via an ammeter, a shunt provides a 'known' resistance in series with the the load. This allows a 'smaller' ammeter to be used to measure 'larger' loads.

I hope I got that right .....

A meter (the basic movement) of any type can only handle small currents going through it. In fact, because of the very small current, it is able to measure voltage without loading the circuit - altering the voltage it is reading.

A Voltmeter usually has a basic meter movement/display, with a resistor in series with it to allow calibration. Further resistors (called "multipliers" can be switched in to measure higher voltages. A basic circuit measures D.C.
A rectifier(diode) allows for AC.

An Ammeter (still the same movement/display) is wired accross a resistor of known low value and measures the voltage developed on the resistor as the current flows through it. THIS RESISTOR IS CALLED A SHUNT.

Higher currents can be catered for by adding further shunts so that the resistance value decreases. i.e. more current is required to give the same voltage to the display. A switch that adds the shunts can therefore be labelled as increasing the current range.

An Ohmmeter uses an internal battery and some mulltipliers to measure the current flowing through the external object. The result is shown as resistance in ohms.

Put the lot together and you have a MULTIMETER. It could also include various other functions such as Capacitance, temperature, frequency and sound level. Specialist units are used by mechanics for dwell and tacho.

Rovers4.

[Chops]

Thanks boys,, so is this in the system as part of the unit, or do you have to do it all separately?

I'm sorry,, I don't do electrics,,:eek:

I have the same unit installed in my car as supplied by Tim (Drivesafe), and so far am very happy with it. My fridge runs 24 hours a day, and hasn't skipped a beat since being installed :D

[Willow4]

Hi Chops,

with this particular gauge - yes the shunt is built in. So all you need to do is connect your power input (positive and negative 12 volts from your aux battery) and then connect your load (accessories like your fridge, etc). Then the 'brains' inside the gauge does the rest!

[n plus one]

Hi Leroy,

I did some research and found a number of recommendations for using the yellow top and also found some that did not support the yellow tops.

And then I read an article in an English LR magazine (just can't find it at the moment) and the article showed an install using two yellow tops and a Blue Sea isolator. It was highly recommended configuration by a prominent LR specialist.

So I bit the bullet and went with them and based my install on the article - but used Tim's USI-160 isolator instead of the Blue Seas. I also spoke to Tim a number of times on the phone.

So far, the yellow top cranks the defender with no issues what so ever. I can not tell any difference from the original battery.

Whilst I don't have a winch yet (will try and sneak that purchase in shortly), Tim's USI-160 can be set to winch mode and will join the two yellow tops together for winching. If you seen one - have a look, its a very cleaver bit of kit.

Overall I am very impressed with both the yellow tops and Tim's isolator.

Yep, I've had a good run from yellow tops and the USI myself - I can even confirm that the USI keeps going when submerged for hours on end (not recommended though!)

Now running Odysseys, which seem to be better again.

[Leroy_Riding]

I might have to invest (in the distant future that is!) in another D34 and one of these 'fancy' Isolators then

so correct me If I am wrong but this Isolator gives you modes like this:

- Primary and Secondary batteries disconnected (from each other)

- Primary and Secondary batteries connected 'one way/Diode' for charging Secondary battery

- Primary and Secondary batteries in Parallel for winch or 'self jump-start'?

seems like a good bit of kit.

Leroy

EDIT: wonder how running 3 D34's with two of these Isolators or a special 3way would work? the ability to parallel all three for Winch and or parallel any two together for either winch or deep cycle duties. . . that is more up my alley :)

[n plus one]

I might have to invest (in the distant future that is!) in another D34 and one of these 'fancy' Isolators then

so correct me If I am wrong but this Isolator gives you modes like this:

- Primary and Secondary batteries disconnected (from each other)

- Primary and Secondary batteries connected 'one way/Diode' for charging Secondary battery

- Primary and Secondary batteries in Parallel for winch or 'self jump-start'?

seems like a good bit of kit.

Leroy

EDIT: wonder how running 3 D34's with two of these Isolators or a special 3way would work? the ability to parallel all three for Winch and or parallel any two together for either winch or deep cycle duties. . . that is more up my alley :)

I'm sure Traxide will be along shortly, but I can confirm that a second auxiliary D34 works fine with this system - just run it in parallel with the 'primary' auxiliary ala camper trailer-style arrangements.

[Leroy_Riding]

I'm sure Traxide will be along shortly, but I can confirm that a second auxiliary D34 works fine with this system - just run it in parallel with the 'primary' auxiliary ala camper trailer-style arrangements.

somehow in my head I though s diff setup would be needed(*facepalm*) but if you have two 'secondary batteries in parallel then when winching you effective do have 3 in parallel, given that proper cables are used this should be fine I guess. . . but if in the 'camper trailer' setup chances are the cabling is thin and not rated for winch currents so you would want to be able to disconnect the third battery in that arrangement. (if using smaller gauge cable to the 3rd that is)

Leroy

[Willow4]

Leroy,

here is the link to the USI-160 at Traxide. It has both the install instructions and explains the various mode.

http://www.traxide.com.au/files/USI160_Install.pdf

I haven't setup a second aux battery, so I'll let others (or Tim) explain the best way to do it.

[n plus one]

somehow in my head I though s diff setup would be needed(*facepalm*) but if you have two 'secondary batteries in parallel then when winching you effective do have 3 in parallel, given that proper cables are used this should be fine I guess. . . but if in the 'camper trailer' setup chances are the cabling is thin and not rated for winch currents so you would want to be able to disconnect the third battery in that arrangement. (if using smaller gauge cable to the 3rd that is)

Leroy

If you actually had the third. (i.e. 2nd auxiliary) battery down in a camper trailer, you should have that cable run protected (say with a 50amp auto reset circuit breaker at each end if the run) which would address high current drain events (i.e. winching type situations).

[Leroy_Riding]

If you actually had the third. (i.e. 2nd auxiliary) battery down in a camper trailer, you should have that cable run protected (say with a 50amp auto reset circuit breaker at each end if the run) which would address high current drain events (i.e. winching type situations).

I understand that part, I was more thinking along the lines of having 3 batteries in the car itself, and possibly a 4th in a trailer. having the ability to have a proper 3 way setup would be great.

something that allowed all three in parallel or any given 2 in parallel or all 3 disconnected from each other just adds some versatility to the setup that I guess most wont see beneficial, but to me I see it as something I would like. that and there is a photo on the forum somewhere of 3x D34's under the seat in a Defender :)

I also like to take my 'toys'(RC Helicopters which require there batteries to be charged) with me and I'm also a little scared of the dark so that means lots of lights, so being able to have 2 batteries for deep cycle use and still maintain one for cranking(without having to run the car at night in a campsite to charge my deep cycle back up), or run 2 for winching without the extra stress of the fridges and lights running off the same 2 batteries. . though by its own right a 3 battery setup with the two secondary batters permanently in parallel I'm sure will more than suffice. . .

Leroy

[drivesafe]

If you actually had the third. (i.e. 2nd auxiliary) battery down in a camper trailer, you should have that cable run protected (say with a 50amp auto reset circuit breaker at each end if the run) which would address high current drain events (i.e. winching type situations).

Right on the money n plus one.



Hi Leroy and don’t take this as some form of slagging. It is not meant to be, but you are over thinking everything.

Consider this, if you keep your batteries, ALL of them, parallel wired at all times, you will have a number of advantages.

First one and going on your need for lots of lights, by keeping all your batteries connected, you will not only have far more power available for running your lights, but even if you don’t need anywhere near that much additional capacity, it will still mean you will not be discharging all your batteries anywhere near as low as you would when using only one or two for the same job.

This in itself has a number of advantages, like because none of your batteries are discharged that low, this will help to extend the life span of all your batteries.

But there is an immediate advantage in that when you do hit the road, because none of your batteries are that low, you will fully charge all of them in a shorter drive time, meaning are far more likely to actually have more power available at your next stop, than you would if you only use some of your batteries while camping.

The other advantage is that if all your batteries are constantly at the same level of charge, you will not have energy being wasted when the batteries of different charge levels equalise when the motor is off.

[quaddrive]

Hi Willow,

Can I trouble you for the ebay sellers link or name?

Thanks

[Willow4]

Hi Quaddrive,

I can't find the link at the moment, however I just checked my history and the seller's names was 'elite.element'. So you should be able to track it from there.

Let me know if you don't have any luck, and I'll dig a little deeper.

cheers,

Wayne

[Cracka]

G'day Wayne

I have scoured ebay but have not had any luck, where did you get the case for your sockets and gauge.

Thanks

Mick

[Willow4]

Hi Mick,

the seller for the case was 'Iiron88'. If you search for 'D.I.Y 4WD,Caravan,Boat,Engel,Cigar Socket,Power board' you should find them.

cheers,

Wayne

[Cracka]

Thanks Wayne, copy and pasted that desc and found them.

Mick