Q+A defender (what can go wrong)

[pickstock]

So this is a little more of an introduction about me and a few questions and comments.

Firstly about me
Im just a young kid (compared to others around the traps, im only 21) with ambitions. I work in the caravan and RV industry in Adelaide and am working on setting up a Camping and 4wd website for it (a lot of the suppliers are the same)
Any questions about stuff id be happy to help out with.

Anyway
Are they breaking down as often as people say?
Whats the big issues, what breaks or causes the breaks?
what are my options if things go wrong (i was thinking ls1 if engine breaks)
what can the Australian defenders tow? ( i could look this up but lazy)


cheers for the answers guys

[Sue]

Anyway
Are they breaking down as often as people say?

That depends on who you talk to. I bought mine new in 2011 and while I've had some warranty work done on it (without any problems from the dealer) it's never broken down. The car is nearly at the 100,000k mark now.

Whats the big issues, what breaks or causes the breaks?

Lack of maintenance. My understanding is that these cars need regular servicing etc I also think that how it is used would probably play a part in this as well.

what are my options if things go wrong (i was thinking ls1 if engine breaks)

New car or 2nd hand?

what can the Australian defenders tow? ( i could look this up but lazy)

Mine is a short wheel base 90 and is rated at 3.5t and from memory a towball weight of 240kgs


cheers for the answers guys

See my answers above.. :) I am sure that others will be along with more information for you soon.

[Wallaby Ted]

So this is a little more of an introduction about me and a few questions and comments.

Firstly about me
Im just a young kid (compared to others around the traps, im only 21) with ambitions. I work in the caravan and RV industry in Adelaide and am working on setting up a Camping and 4wd website for it (a lot of the suppliers are the same)
Any questions about stuff id be happy to help out with.

Anyway
Are they breaking down as often as people say?

As above tends who you talk to, I have had a number of Land Rovers, Series 2a, 3, 110 and Defenders all have been second hand so once I fix the problems it had and maintain it properly then no. The Defender I bought at nearly 12 months old (2010 model) and the only major problem has been an intercooler hose that rubbed through and this can happen on any make.

Whats the big issues, what breaks or causes the breaks?

Same as above they need to be maintained properly. Depending on what you are looking at looking at the problems are different on on each model.

what are my options if things go wrong (i was thinking ls1 if engine breaks)

It will depend on what type of engine it is and what breaks, I have fixed a V8 County with a piece of cardboard in the distributor.

what can the Australian defenders tow? ( i could look this up but lazy)

From the Defender Specs
Unbraked Trailer 750kg
Braked Trailer 3500kg

cheers for the answers guys

Hope that helps.

Richard

[pickstock]

sorry really should of been more specific

Im looking for second hand around the 10 000 to 20 000 mark (big jump i know)

im not sure what engine i want, probably a turbo diesel 200 or 300 TDI

Ive done a bit of work on a Dakar car and that used standard land rover transfer case and drive shafts so i know they are good. Just a bit worried because talking with my mechanic he has pretty much said he wont touch them (probably will for services but not major work)

thanks guys
spike

[redrovertdi]

sorry really should of been more specific

Im looking for second hand around the 10 000 to 20 000 mark (big jump i know)

im not sure what engine i want, probably a turbo diesel 200 or 300 TDI

Ive done a bit of work on a Dakar car and that used standard land rover transfer case and drive shafts so i know they are good. Just a bit worried because talking with my mechanic he has pretty much said he wont touch them (probably will for services but not major work)

thanks guys
spike


Both those engines are from the 1990s and i doubt very much you will find any thing with that mileage unless you add another zero. my Defender has 436000ks and lots get replaced as it wears out due to work and play. I love it...

[Greyfox]

sorry really should of been more specific

Im looking for second hand around the 10 000 to 20 000 mark (big jump i know)

im not sure what engine i want, probably a turbo diesel 200 or 300 TDI

Ive done a bit of work on a Dakar car and that used standard land rover transfer case and drive shafts so i know they are good. Just a bit worried because talking with my mechanic he has pretty much said he wont touch them (probably will for services but not major work)

thanks guys
spike

This is the same old story with most mechanics, they all reckon they would not touch one if there life depended on it.
Most of these mechanics I think are scared of them for whatever reason.

I have a 2000 TD5 that is 5 cylinder turbo diesel, it is a great veichle, only had the starter motor (brushes) and the clutch master cylinder fail on me

The Defender is a great solid veichle and will go where most veichles will not go.

Parts are not thar dear and if you are slightly mechanical
Minded you will be amazed at what you can do on a Defender.

Also think of the Defender as a blank canvas, you can add and do whatever you want to do to it, where if you had a Toyo, etc you wold not .

Hope this helps and welcome, it is good to get some young load into Defenders.:D

[Didge]

Parts are cheap compared to Jap cars. If you spend $10k - $20K you'll probably get a reasonable TD5 which has a lot more get up and go than the TDi's. Funny that Jap car owners are asking things like "Is that old thing still going?" and the answer is yes, they're generally reliable; won't let you down with a show stopper mechanical problem any more than your jap cars. My old 300TDi has manual everything. If I drop the key in the water, it still works. if my hands and arms work, so do the windows and door locks. There are no electrics or electronics, computer, etc to let you down, not that they do that very often anyway. The problem with electronics for the average punter is diagnosing the cause of the problem. All diesels require regular maintenance but the 200 & 300TDi can tolerate poor quality fuel more so than modern diesels. My 300 has had no major issues in 245000kms and it has only been the bolt on ancillary items under the bonnet that have worn out prematurely. eg clutch master cylinders seem to leak prematurely, as do standard rear axles and drive flanges but all are easily fixed at a reasonable cost. I 2nd all of greyfox's comments.
Get one and you'll join an exclusive club where every time you get in it , you'll get a special feeling and you'll be on the look out for others to wave to. That doesn't happen in a Toyota or Nissan. Wish I'd got one when I was your age, you won't regret it :D

[JDNSW]

As the others have said. Most mechanics are frightened of them, because, being relatively rare, they are unfamiliar, and not worth the effort of learning because they may not see another one for twelve months.

The dealer network is not good outside the major cities, and even there many of the dealers are not interested in older examples. In my experience, dealers are not a good or cheap source of parts, but in general parts for all except very old models are readily available and cheap from a number of non-dealer suppliers.

My 110 is approaching 600,000km and the only show stoppers have been an alternator failure and a problem with the starter solenoid (both Nippon-Denso on this model), and a broken gearlever, so I doubt that it can be called unreliable. On the road within hours in all three occasions. Just drove on a 2000km round trip to Brisbane and back with no worries or problems.

John

[Didge]

Wow, that's a serious amount of clicks for any motor but it's the isuzu isn't it?!

[pickstock]

yeah i was talking about how much i was hoping to pay
ive read all the books and am very interested its just the fact its a lot of money to spend for me at the moment, this would be my first reasonably expensive car as well.

I sort of am mechanically minded but barely have the time to do it so will probably palm it off.

i was under the impression the td5 was less powerful than the tdi200

Im thinking when i get one ill do some basic mods, like the bar work and mild lift kit, ATW intercooler. Stuff more for protection of the equipment than for outright power.

[Didge]

Td5 goes heaps better, believe me but its also the first one with electronics. 200 & 300TDi both have 83kw and the TD5 has 91kw power, they have 255Nm, 285Nm and 300Nm torque respectively - according to wikipedia anyway.
Yeah, its not an insignificant amount of money and its nice to hear someone your age actually thinking it is a lot. Too many young people think they need to pay a fortune.
Mine is stock standard height and I've not really had any issues with clearance and approach/ departure angles.
Don't get sucked into thinking you need all these expensive mods - as soon as you start jacking the car up, you'll introduce more problems and it'll cause more expenses.

[bushrover]

Im thinking when i get one ill do some basic mods, like the bar work and mild lift kit, ATW intercooler. Stuff more for protection of the equipment than for outright power.

For 10-20 big ones you will get a Defender with every modification you could possible want. One thing i will say about mechanics that won't work on a Land Rover........................ they must be pretty useless, Rovers are one of the easiest vehicles to work on, especially a Defender. Their limited Rover experience is matched by their limited skill.

You will get every single part on the net, all at reasonable prices and the help you will get on here will solve any problem you have. You will even get offers of help from inmates close by if you are really in trouble. Don't hesitate to buy, but do check history first.

Rick

[JDNSW]

Wow, that's a serious amount of clicks for any motor but it's the isuzu isn't it?!

yes.

John

[JDNSW]

For almost all people a lift is quite unnecessary and simply an unnecessary cost and source of future problems. Same applies to oversize tyres.

There are however some worthwhile modifications - bullbar - but you will be hard pressed to find a s/h Defender without one; headlight relay (absolutely necessary in my view); long range fuel tank; radiator chaff guard.

Modifications to mine include all of the above plus driving lights, central locking, cruise control, water tank, folding side steps, four gear front diff (as in 6x6, good idea for Isuzu engine).

John

[Didge]

JD, can you elaborate on the 4 gear front diff please
Cheers gerald

[weeds]

i was under the impression the td5 was less powerful than the tdi200
.

200tdi and 300tdi are probably on par, TD5 has more killerwasps

[GoldCloverLeaf]

My Td5 has been faultess really and have kept it longer than any other car.... and i've had many like 20 + cars in the last 12 years or so!

And yes, very easy to work on and plenty quick, especially when chipped/remapped :twisted:

[isuzurover]

...

i was under the impression the td5 was less powerful than the tdi200

...

It is the other way around. The Td5 is ~125 Bhp vs 111 for the 300tdi and 107(?) for the defender version of the 200tdi.

Power can easily be increased in all 3, but the TD5 is by far the stronger engine, and capable of huge power outputs with the right upgrades.

200tdis are uncommon.

If I were you I would buy one of the perenties currently being sold by the army (assuming you can live with the lack of creature comforts). They are fitted with the Isuzu 4BD1, which can readily be turbocharged to produce even more output than the above engines, and will outlast them as well.

The added advantage is you can probably find more mechanics willing to work on them.

[MLD]

If you want a tow vehicle towing larger than a camper van consider the newer CR diesel utes (Navara, Triton etc) or a 100 series LC. As much as i love my defender i wouldn't consider it a tow vehicle.

I've spent way too much money on mine. I'm too far down the trail to return to stock, but there is a-lot to be said for a set of lockers (+ axles), standard sized mud tyres and stop the modifications there. That set up will take you everywhere you would want to go (even if you might have to take a different line or approach to the modified trucks). Keeping it simple should avoid undue stress on parts. I flog out suspension bushes on a regular basis (roughly every 6 months) and that's on a modest 35mm lift. There old adage rings true, a modification to one item shows up the deficiency in another. You start chasing solutions to problems created by modifications.

Otherwise my defender is pretty reliable. What goes wrong is generally stuff i've ignored in regular maintenance or items that are stressed because of modifications. Rarely are they a show stopper, merely an inconvenience during a trip. TD5 with 375,000 kms on the Odo and no signs of slowing up.

ps: Don't listen to Mike. He has a misplaced interpretation of 'plenty quick'. No land speed records will be set by a defender, nor will you lose your licence for speeding. Expect to cruise at 95 / 100 km/h and be content to get to your destination 10 min later than if in a normal car.

MLD

[GoldCloverLeaf]

ps: Don't listen to Mike. He has a misplaced interpretation of 'plenty quick'. No land speed records will be set by a defender, nor will you lose your licence for speeding. Expect to cruise at 95 / 100 km/h and be content to get to your destination 10 min later than if in a normal car.

MLD

Don't listen to Mark either, 375k's is a crazy place to begin modifying any car! But it does show how good the Td5 goes when maintained, although some of these horespowers obviously dissapear with age and mileage as the tolerances loosen up as with any engine.

I don't really feel the need for more power, i can easily keep up with traffic on hills at 110kph even when loaded up, although variable vane turbos and bigger intercoolers sound like fun to me, it will still do 140KPH as is but that will change soon with the 4.11 gears but who cares... my acceleration will improve. It's quicker than the 3.9 V8 RR i had :)

[JDNSW]

JD, can you elaborate on the 4 gear front diff please
Cheers gerald

The diff centre fitted to the front Rover differentials on most rigid axle Landrovers have two "planet" gears. The 6x6 Australian 110s were fitted with differential centres with four "planet" gears, as part of the beefing up for the increased axle weight and power. I had one of these fitted shortly after I got the vehicle, as the shaft with the two gears was flogging out the holes in the carrier. This is a function of the extra weight on the front axle because of the heavy Isuzu compared to other engines, and the pulsating torque resulting from a four cylinder engine that pulls strongly at very low rpm. The two gear centre does not seem to give trouble with other engines, and the rear Salisbury axle seems to hold up without complaint.

John

[pickstock]

so 4 spider gears??

I looked at the perentes (sp) but read that they couldnt be registered and the cost for an older model put me off them.

Im going to keep my eye out for them on gumtree.

I am pretty set of what i want body wise though and the duel cabs seem to be at a premium.

I need a towing vehicle for camping and the odd time i have to move a caravan for the boss. Hence the reason to get some more torques out of it, and put coolers for dam near everything on it.

[isuzurover]

so 4 spider gears??

I looked at the perentes (sp) but read that they couldnt be registered and the cost for an older model put me off them.

...


Don't believe everything you read on the internet. They can be registered.
Yes they are expensive for what they are, but costs will come down, and they are a lot better built than (newer) civvie models.

[pickstock]

Im now starting the think a perenty (sp) would be decent apart from the izuzu motor (I dont know enough about them so if anyone could elaborate)

But the fact they are wider is pretty good (im a fairly big guy) and 4 inches is a fair amount when it comes to my arm being inside the door or not.

[JDNSW]

Im now starting the think a perenty (sp) would be decent apart from the izuzu motor (I dont know enough about them so if anyone could elaborate)

But the fact they are wider is pretty good (im a fairly big guy) and 4 inches is a fair amount when it comes to my arm being inside the door or not.

The only Perenties that are wider are the 6x6. While these have some advantages, they do have the disadvantage that in at least some states they require a truck (light rigid I think) licence, and incur much higher registration costs than the 4x4s. While the turbocharged Isuzu is significantly more powerful, the vehicle is a lot heavier, and also is lower geared, so that highway speeds would normally be lower.

The 4x4 Perenties are little different from the contemporary civilian Isuzu engined 110s, except for trim, body type (mostly ragtop), and the lack of power steering, with the notable exception of the galvanised chassis and the spare storage underneath.

John