Monster 6 Turbo Diesel into a 101. [Archive] - Australian Land Rover Owners

Sitec

5th December 2013, 04:47 PM

New thread time! Having thought about where to locate this 'conversion thread', the decision (with a little help) was made to place it here as this is 'Room 101' after all!! So, now we move on to dispel the myth that 101's are not set out to accept a big diesel.. Brute has started the ball rolling with his Monster V8 Diesel, but I think he needs a challenger!! ;) Anyway, most of you have seen my 101 thread which has pics of said donk in it, but for those who have not, here it is in its stripped down 'ready for fitment attempt 1' state. I've now cut away and removed the chassis, lowered the gear linkage so the lever seal sits 25mm above the rocker covers. I've also made an exhaust manifold guard to help deflect some of the heat away from my left arse cheek! The hydraulic PTO unit has been removed, and a plate made to cap the hole. Once the diesel is in and proven, then the hydraulic rear mounted winch will be another project. I've also capped the PAS drive hole with a 'blind seal' which is just like a normal seal but with no hole in the middle... When the PAS project happens, this will be popped out and the truck pump refitted.

spongie

5th December 2013, 04:50 PM

And then....

Bigbjorn

5th December 2013, 04:53 PM

don't keep us in suspense. What is it?

Sitec

5th December 2013, 04:53 PM

A few will notice that I've also removed, straightened and reversed the sump.. Cummins had the foresight on the 6Bt to make it reversible. I've also modified the oil pick up pipe as the genuine part to suit the reversed sump was silly money!! :D Usual Cummins story it seems. Thankfully, the local CNH dealer is only 5 min down the road, and this engine is fitted in several headers and tractors so sump gaskets, filters, front pulley seals etc are easily obtained and at a lot lower costs than Cummins!! Here's the modified pick up pipe.

Brute

5th December 2013, 04:54 PM

Looks like you might at least have some room to work at each side. I don't have that luxury:)

Sitec

5th December 2013, 05:09 PM

Brian, its a UK sourced Cummins 6Bt out of a Leyland Daf 45, 5.9 straight six turbo diesel engine (also found in US Dodge Rams). Power is anywhere between 100 and 500 BHP reliably, and I've been told u to 1000bhp if we want to have a laugh!! Now, having driven my 101 for nearly 500 km, one thing I've noticed is that they like to run warm over here.... so with this in mind, a few days ago I've bought a Dodge Ram fan hub and pulley out of the states, which which will bolt onto the front of the block and put the fan roughly where it sits with the current V8. I'm going to use the original truck fan that came with the engine as its in great condition and HUGE!!! By doing away with the viscous coupling, I can keep it close to the engine and even closer to the rad which will mean minimal cowling. Overkill...? Probably, but its better with more than less, and as the engine is flat out at 2800/3200, it won't be that noisy.... and if it is, great! You'll hear me coming!

Sitec

5th December 2013, 05:20 PM

Here's the new exhaust guard that will hopefully deflect some of the manifold heat down and out. I'm also going to re clad the engine cover with insulation as there's not a lot of the original stuff left!!! The gear linkage is close but it does clear everything by 5mm, and the lever should sit on the flat area between the original lever hole and the RH edge of the engine cover..... Still not 100% sure if that turbo is big enough!!! :D

Sitec

5th December 2013, 05:26 PM

Looks like you might at least have some room to work at each side. I don't have that luxury:)

Hopefully so.. From what I can see, the compressor will be close to the LH chassis rail but I'm hoping it'll sit just above it as I don't plan to scallop the chassis anywhere and really don't want to. I've worked out that the front prop is going to have to have a carrier bearing mounted on the side of the bell housing just to get the drive around it! Here's a pic of the second set of front springs.. The second leaf will find its way under the 101, and the first leaf will sit under the bench ready for a trailer that I'm planning later next year.

amazing

5th December 2013, 07:02 PM

minimal cowling....

not too minimal...took cowl off my 101 when doing some job and couldn't be bothered to screw it back on....after a bit (serious) offroading two blades snapped and the rest damaged by stones....doh!..so keep at least the bottom shielded.

without the viscous coupling the fan is going to run pretty fast it may be noisier than the engine.....(or not...)

looks like a great project.

101RRS

5th December 2013, 07:27 PM

So, now we move on to dispel the myth that 101's are not set out to accept a big diesel..

Is there a myth? - the original issue came up a couple of years ago when discussion was about putting an Isuzu in and it was explained that while it could be done it it would require some modification and that was not wanted by the poster.

So there is no myth as such. Anything is possible it just depends on how far you want to modify. Franken101 will reflect this philosophy.

It will be great to see your 101 up and running with all its mods.

Garry

101RRS

5th December 2013, 07:50 PM

If your current engine is running hot I would say that you might have an issue with your current cooling system as mine runs spot on. I do not have a viscous coupling on my fan and it is not particularly noisy even when the engine is well up the rev range so with your max around 3500rpm you shouldn't have too much noise from the fan.

One small mod that my 101 has got that you might want to consider is fluting the body work either side of the engine - in particular the removable access panels. This does help the flow of air through the engine bay and no doubt helps with cooling a bit.

Garry

200tdi ayre

5th December 2013, 08:10 PM

Sitec

5th December 2013, 10:36 PM

Ooh it's noisy you can hear streggels big purple one a way off ;)

Its Nick Steggel's truck that got me started on the 6Bt's... I'm now in contact with him, Ash and Tom, the three Cummins fella's in the UK. There's also a vid called Cummins Land Rover by 'Mr2Jags' which has a great note inside the cab when he stretches its legs up the hill! I was originally looking for another Nissan Fd6 out of a UD truck, as I'd done it before, but once I'd heard and seen the Cummins and looked into it, the engine and box combo seemed to be ideal, and cheep out of the UK....

Garry, I've already removed the two side panels, in an effort to help with the cooling. I've not been game enough to let it get hot, but it will happily sit between the 85deg mark and that little red line.. which seemed high, but guess its not really.. I tested the thermostat out of the Cummins and it opens at 90 deg, so the gauge will be up near that red line with the diesel.... I'm also going to get a deeper core put in the 101's radiator to help.... No doubt the Melrose trip will test it out!!

Amazing, Im planning on trying to duct more air in thru the rad and intercooler area, and hope to have a 50mm shroud around the fan. I'll see how much room there is once its sat in there! :)

Epic_Dragon

7th December 2013, 06:09 PM

your 101 is so cool :D

isuzurover

8th December 2013, 10:04 AM

Nice work.

Here's the new exhaust guard that will hopefully deflect some of the manifold heat down and out. I'm also going to re clad the engine cover with insulation as there's not a lot of the original stuff left!!! The gear linkage is close but it does clear everything by 5mm, and the lever should sit on the flat area between the original lever hole and the RH edge of the engine cover..... Still not 100% sure if that turbo is big enough!!! :D

Heat wrap and a turbo jacket will help even more...

Sitec

8th December 2013, 08:22 PM

Nice work.

Heat wrap and a turbo jacket will help even more...

Yeah, I'd thought about that, but as its a big old turbo, I thought it might be better running with some air around it.. If it was water cooled unit I'd have gone down that route.. Cheers tho. :)

DasLandRoverMan

8th December 2013, 10:02 PM

So when do we see it going in?

Sitec

9th December 2013, 06:02 AM

Yesterday was to be V8 removal, but I had to work, so it'll prob be the coming weekend.. Still waiting on the adapted gear b4 I can put the transfer case together, and then it'll go in as one. :)

Dougal

9th December 2013, 06:59 AM

Yeah, I'd thought about that, but as its a big old turbo, I thought it might be better running with some air around it.. If it was water cooled unit I'd have gone down that route.. Cheers tho. :)

Water cooling of turbos is only for hot-shutdown. When running the oil does all the cooling. There is nothing to fear with jacketing the exhaust housing and manifolds, but you want to keep the compressor side open to air.

DasLandRoverMan

9th December 2013, 09:02 AM

What plan did you decide on for the input shaft?

jazzaD1

9th December 2013, 10:26 AM

What plan did you decide on for the input shaft?

and for the fate of your axles:o

101RRS

9th December 2013, 11:26 AM

and for the fate of your axles:o

At the moderate state of tune being proposed I don't think there will be an issue noting that 101 axles are not the same as defender axles - they are much larger and heavier duty.

I have only ever seen one break but then using the torque of this engine at the wrong time could always cause an issue.

A 101 has the axles that Defenders and Discos should have had.

Garry

spongie

9th December 2013, 07:55 PM

Just probably not the ratios!!!

Only problem with the 101 axles are they are not really a land rover axle so buying in more than the 6/7000 of them that were bought would probably have broken Rover.

Sitec

9th December 2013, 09:25 PM

Just probably not the ratios!!!

Only problem with the 101 axles are they are not really a land rover axle so buying in more than the 6/7000 of them that were bought would probably have broken Rover.

Ah, but they now have the right ratios! :) Re shafts and CV's, they're massive! As for the input shaft, yes, as planned the 50mm ZF output shaft is being welded to the input shaft of the LT... Just waiting on that and I'll wrap the other thread up. Have found a guy in Adelaide whose suppose to be 'the must nuts' with this kinda thing!

LandyAndy

9th December 2013, 09:54 PM

Dougal

10th December 2013, 06:52 AM

There is a J30 Jeep in town at the diesel mechanics shed,its 95% built with one of those Cummins mojos.This thing has 500hp,dana running gear and an intercooler of huge proportions.
The builder has done another in the past,bulletproof motors,and parts available anywhere.
Tells me it will cruise at 120kmh towing a large van and use less than 12lts/100km.
ENJOY
Andrew

500hp and towing are mutually exclusive unless he's got compound turbos. You can hit 500hp with a single turbo, but you end up with no boost or torque at normal towing rpm.

Cruising at 120km/h and towing a large van are fine, but 12 litres/100km while doing so is complete fiction. Here are the fuelly results for Dodge Ram 2500's with the Cummins: Dodge Ram 2500 MPG Reports | Fuelly (http://www.fuelly.com/car/dodge/ram%202500/diesel%20l6)

Average is around 15 litres/100km. For some reason these engines bring out all the exaggerated mpg claims.

Sitec

10th December 2013, 11:55 AM

500hp and towing are mutually exclusive unless he's got compound turbos. You can hit 500hp with a single turbo, but you end up with no boost or torque at normal towing rpm.

Cruising at 120km/h and towing a large van are fine, but 12 litres/100km while doing so is complete fiction. Here are the fuelly results for Dodge Ram 2500's with the Cummins: Dodge Ram 2500 MPG Reports | Fuelly (http://www.fuelly.com/car/dodge/ram%202500/diesel%20l6)

Average is around 15 litres/100km. For some reason these engines bring out all the exaggerated mpg claims.

Ahhhh, love it.. All the negativity!!!! I'm not planning 500hp, as the LT230 would explode, and the diffs would too!!!! 12 litres/100km... Wow! 15 litres/100km... Ideal! 20 litres/100km. Yup, I can cope with that... It'll still be better than the V8 that has just used 200 litres to do no more than 300km!!!! Yeah, granted the 'bent 8' sounds great and has really grown on me but nah, the diesel has to happen purely for usability and economy!

101RRS

10th December 2013, 01:46 PM

20 litres/100km. Yup, I can cope with that... It'll still be better than the V8 that has just used 200 litres to do no more than 300km!!!!

You really do have a dud V8 in your 101 - I can manage 20l/100km in my V8 101 cruising along the highway doing 90kph. I can also get 40l/100km if I try offroad but nowhere anything as bad as you are getting.

You should not really be comparing your performance and economy improvements when you put your diesel in with your current V8 arrangement.

You will need to compare with a well sorted standard V8.

You will certainly get performance improvements and better economy but I don't believe in the order you think you will achieve.

Garry

roobar_and_custard

10th December 2013, 04:21 PM

There's only ne way to find out... stick the big engine in and give it a go...:D
Until you get that done, we're all armchair critics...

Ian.

Mick_Marsh

10th December 2013, 04:39 PM

I think people should realise, Sitec has done this sort of thing before. I think he knows full well (and better than us) what he is doing.
He is also in contact with others who are using this motor.

Dougal

10th December 2013, 05:50 PM

Ahhhh, love it.. All the negativity!!!! I'm not planning 500hp, as the LT230 would explode, and the diffs would too!!!! 12 litres/100km... Wow! 15 litres/100km... Ideal! 20 litres/100km. Yup, I can cope with that... It'll still be better than the V8 that has just used 200 litres to do no more than 300km!!!! Yeah, granted the 'bent 8' sounds great and has really grown on me but nah, the diesel has to happen purely for usability and economy!

Negativity? Nope. Just correcting the fantasy of a 500hp tune that tows well while delivering unbeleivable fuel economy while towing at high speed.

The 6BT will be a great upgrade. Just take all the internet claims with a big dose of salt. Most of them are using this to work out their mileage.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

Sitec

10th December 2013, 07:37 PM

You really do have a dud V8 in your 101

Nah, I have Bojan's 3.9 on knackered carbys, that's running 3.5 diffs (which it pulls well... Right up to a recorded 120kph (on private roads of course)), and I have a lead RH foot, and love overtaking things just for that look that ya get...:o And yup, done it before, and the 5.7 Nissan would do over double the kms the V8 would and still happily run 110kph+ often! :)

LandyAndy

13th December 2013, 09:13 PM

Negativity? Nope. Just correcting the fantasy of a 500hp tune that tows well while delivering unbeleivable fuel economy while towing at high speed.

The 6BT will be a great upgrade. Just take all the internet claims with a big dose of salt. Most of them are using this to work out their mileage.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=69851&stc=1&d=1386661789

Perhaps I could give you my mans phone number and you can ring him and tell him he is full of poo.
He is a heavy diesel mechanic and specialises in custom work.There is nothing he would enjoy better than a kiwi on the tellingbone telling him he dont know what he is talking about:):):):):):)
Andrew

Dougal

14th December 2013, 06:48 AM

Perhaps I could give you my mans phone number and you can ring him and tell him he is full of poo.
He is a heavy diesel mechanic and specialises in custom work.There is nothing he would enjoy better than a kiwi on the tellingbone telling him he dont know what he is talking about:):):):):):)
Andrew

Can I interest you in a bridge for sale?

isuzurover

14th December 2013, 07:17 AM

There is a J30 Jeep in town at the diesel mechanics shed,its 95% built with one of those Cummins mojos.This thing has 500hp,dana running gear and an intercooler of huge proportions.
The builder has done another in the past,bulletproof motors,and parts available anywhere.
Tells me it will cruise at 120kmh towing a large van and use less than 12lts/100km.
ENJOY
Andrew

Have to say I agree with Dougal on this one. The VDJ79 wagon I hired (4.5V8) averaged 14.26 l/100 sitting at 120 with 3 people, a light load and no big caravan.

There is no way you can get the same efficiency from a ME diesel as from a commonrail.

12 L/100 is possible, but not while towing.

123rover50

14th December 2013, 07:31 AM

I have the 6.2 ex Hummer V8 Diesel in my Forward Control Landy.
With the auto boxes I used to get 3 & 4 K,s per litre. Now with the MSA box I get 5 K,s per litre or 20 litres per 100 as long as I stay around 90 kph.
It weighs 5 ton but:(
Keith

Dougal

14th December 2013, 09:33 AM

12 L/100 is possible, but not while towing.

And certainly not at 120km/h either.

To burn 12 litres/100km at 100km/h (i.e. 12 litres/hr) in a very efficient mechanical diesel (BSFC 220g/kwh) you're only producing ~60hp at the crank. Likely 45hp at the wheels.
To burn 12 litres/100km at 120km/h (i.e. 14.4 litres/hr) you're talking 75hp at the crank.

Can a 60-75hp engine push one of these down the road at 120km/h while towing a huge van?
http://www.jeeptruck.com/sale/aw0004/Jeep_01.jpg

Crystal ball says no.
Logic says no.
Maths says no.
Coast-down tables say no.
Aerodynamic drag says no.
Some diesel mechanic says yes.

Mick_Marsh

14th December 2013, 09:53 AM

Hey! Guys!

I know threads have a tendency to go off topic but, please, this thread is about a diesel in a 101. If you want to talk about nondescript Jeeps, start your own thread somewhere else.

I want to read about 101's.

Sitec

14th December 2013, 12:09 PM

I knew the fuel was getting low so a blast to work and the CFS station was all that I was prepared to risk today... We never made it it the CFS station... It started faltering just as I was passing home.. The fuel pump did its 'Im dry' rattle, and we coasted into home! Here is where 'Mick' stopped for the last time as a V8 petrol 101! Not quite the workshop but near enough! Tractor to be deployed. Out with the spanners this avo! :)

spongie

15th December 2013, 05:40 AM

Bit extreme isn't it?I'm changing engine as I've ran out of petrol

Mick_Marsh

15th December 2013, 07:37 AM

Bit extreme isn't it?I'm changing engine as I've ran out of petrol
We live in a land of extremes here spongie.

Sitec

15th December 2013, 09:58 AM

Indeed we do Mick... We take gearboxes out with tractors!! :D

Sitec

15th December 2013, 09:59 AM

Lots if space for something bigger tho!!!! :)

spongie

15th December 2013, 10:32 AM

My old series had the engine taken out with a massey Telehandler

Sitec

15th December 2013, 07:32 PM

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A_rqizXl6CA

Here's another vid of Nicks truck.. The 101 should have a nice 'in cab' note to it!! :D

101RRS

15th December 2013, 07:50 PM

Yep sounds like a tractor engine:o

Sitec

15th December 2013, 08:07 PM

Yep sounds like a tractor engine:o

That's a good job then... As I likes tractors! Arrh!

Disco Muppet

15th December 2013, 08:09 PM

Sounds awesome :cool:
Better than the noisy lawnmower sound of a Rover V8 ;) :tease:

Sitec

15th December 2013, 08:15 PM

Sounds awesome :cool:
Better than the noisy lawnmower sound of a Rover V8 ;) :tease:

Yeah... Think you have to be a diesel nut to love it... I have grown to love the V8 burble the past few weeks but sat running on the workshop floor with no muffler, the Cummins does sound awesome!!!! :D

DasLandRoverMan

15th December 2013, 08:16 PM

Indeed we do Mick... We take gearboxes out with tractors!! :D

Could just be the perspective of the photo, but I'm damn sure I had a pedal tractor bigger than that when I were a 'youngun', not that I'm overly old now, but it was still 20 years ago...

I see where you're coming from with an engine change because it ran out of fuel.
I changed the V8 in my 110 for another one because the Dizzy packed up*
I also swopped the Diesel engine for another because it was easier than swopping the turbo in situ.

I have the itch to swop the Mazda for something bigger at the minute...

*I should add it went from a knackered carby 3.5 on a ropey LT77 for a half decent 4.2 efi on an autobox, just before someone suggests doing the dizzy would have been easier...

Sitec

15th December 2013, 08:26 PM

Could just be the perspective of the photo, but I'm damn sure I had a pedal tractor bigger than that when I were a 'youngun', not that I'm overly old now, but it was still 20 years ago.....

Ha! Yeah, he's a beast! That's MaxFactor the tractor... All 23hp! (Case 234 that's a Mitsubishi underneath the red paint!)

As for your possible diesel conversion.... Do it! You know you want to own a Cummins powered Fender!! :wasntme:

DasLandRoverMan

15th December 2013, 08:31 PM

I don't need persuading, just funding...

isuzurover

15th December 2013, 09:10 PM

Ha! Yeah, he's a beast! That's MaxFactor the tractor... All 23hp! (Case 234 that's a Mitsubishi underneath the red paint!)

Tractordata says only 18 hp... ?
TractorData.com International Harvester 234 tractor engine information (http://www.tractordata.com/farm-tractors/004/7/0/4702-international-harvester-234-engine.html)

spongie

15th December 2013, 11:14 PM

Are we really going start that again

Sitec

16th December 2013, 07:18 AM

Are we really going start that again

Hell yeah!! This is important high power figures we are talking about here Spongie!!

Das.. I think the 18hp is at the shaft.... (Tho when we dynoed mine at work a few months back it nearly flipped the dyno over with all the power!! We managed 13hp at the shaft before we lost sight of the tractor for the smoke!!:D)

I did look at dynoing the Cummins b4 I fitted it, but the gearbox output shaft goes the wrong way for the PTO dyno. :)

spongie

16th December 2013, 07:51 AM

We blew head gasket on a mf35 on dyno lol.

Dougal

16th December 2013, 08:53 AM

We blew head gasket on a mf35 on dyno lol.

No great loss, throw in a AD3.152 instead.

Sitec

16th December 2013, 07:51 PM

Now there's lots of space in the center of my 101! Just a few more bits and bobs to pull off tomorrow evening and I'll take it into work and introduce the bits I can't usually reach to the steam cleaner. :)

sheerluck

16th December 2013, 08:01 PM

DasLandRoverMan

17th December 2013, 03:51 AM

It's possible, but having tried shoving one around the yard sans engine and box, I can tell you it's ****in heavy, and you'll not get much speed up unless you're heading downhill...

I think the 18hp is at the shaft.... (Tho when we dynoed mine at work a few months back it nearly flipped the dyno over with all the power!! We managed 13hp at the shaft before we lost sight of the tractor for the smoke!!:D)

I'm sure there's plenty of innuendos in there relating to powerful shafts, whose is bigger etc...

Sitec

21st December 2013, 08:22 PM

So, today was spent removing all the items that will be in the way, or no longer required.. Choke cable, CDL switch and piping etc, steel heater hoses, coil, battery leads etc. I've also decided to remove the original engine and trans mounts from the chassis as the original mount angle is very steep and not suited to the heavier diesel. I've take detailed measurements of their positions, and spent several hours cutting them off using thin disks, so they can be refitted neatly if required. Not a great pic as it was late, but here's a shot of where the front right mount was.

Sitec

21st December 2013, 08:34 PM

Having removed the V8, LT95 and hoses etc, the space left is surprisingly big... Or so I thought. Having stripped the chassis, pto's, wiring, etc off the Cummins it looked surprisingly small.... Or so I thought... And then the two meet. That holes tiny, and that engine is bloody massive! Having measured up, it'll all fit nicely once in, but getting it in will be another story. I had planned to leave the engine and box together but to get the nose of the engine down below the two overhanging seat plates is not going to happen with the box attached. The compressor will sit overhanging the LH chassis rail just behind the LH side access cover, so along with the turbo on the RH side, the engine will have to be lowered in where the gearbox sits and then slid forwards into position.

Sitec

21st December 2013, 08:37 PM

Here's as it was left this evening, sat atop the 101. Hopefully I'll have it sat roughly in position tomorrow. :)

Brute

21st December 2013, 09:27 PM

I reckon you are right with the engine mounts, mine has stretched the rubbers sideways so I think I will make up some adaptors to sit the mounts flatter if it all goes ok.

It does look a big unit

DasLandRoverMan

21st December 2013, 09:57 PM

Sitec

21st December 2013, 10:17 PM

Just a thought here... But when I did the auto conversion on my old GS I found the space available (and access in general) improved greatly when I undid the 8 bolts holding the rear body down and stuck it out of the way, not to mention the extra 8 or 9 inches of space that appears as the hole in the rear tray doesn't line up with the crossmember in the chassis...

Another 6 or 8 bolts has the roll bar off and you'll have enough space you could pretty much swing the engine through the front of the truck.

It's not a big job to open up the space so why not make it easier for yourself?

Lifting is the issue... The tractor wouldn't touch it, and the beam its all slung on is at about its max... Good call re the rear tub but as the transfer case handbrake drum will end up under that cross member Im prob going to have to separate the engine and box.. I'll see how the first hour of the day goes tomorrow! :) Thinking we might hang the engine from the roof, and the box from the FEL, then I can tip the nose, and slide it in, and then roll the 101 back and lower the box in. Watch this space!

DasLandRoverMan

21st December 2013, 11:04 PM

A lifting beam and a block and tackle is all you need!!! Sling it off balance and perch on the end to set it level!!!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/12/223.jpg (http://s460.photobucket.com/user/DasLandRoverMan/media/16DD5139-9AA2-41F3-A85C-AB6C0CE357EB.jpg.html)

In this case I got the point of balance wrong, but by the time I realised it also occoured that I couldn't be arsed sorting it.

Sitec

22nd December 2013, 12:39 PM

Well, after a re jig this morning moving the pulley block to the central point of the engine and using Das's strap idea around the box attached to the loader I was able to lower it in nose first. The things that I thought would be tight are not, and the things I thought would clear are tight. The compressor head touches the LH side panel just in front of the LH access panel, and the boost compensator atop the pump is very close to the piece of alli that the LH seat squab sits on..... but it'll fit!

Sitec

22nd December 2013, 12:54 PM

So, I now have two options... Option 1. Move the engine a further 40 mm back and fit the large engine driven fan. This option will help with the front prop clearance, but not with the rear, will guarantee good cooling, but will also mean the gear lever will be a little further back than I'd like (or has to be modified).
Option 2. Move the engine forward 60mm, and try and use a large electric fan in front of the intercooler/blower motor assy. With this option, the compressor head would be in front of the LH middle cab support bar and I could relieve the alli in front of it to allow the engine to come to the left. The front prop would be shorter but if the engine went 50mm to the left, this would help with prop clearance and rear prop length. It does however involve a little bit of tin work modifying.. (Something Im trying to avoid). The gear lever position would be ideal tho.

With both options, as the engine sits (pictured), bump stop to axle clearance and sump to diff clearance are similar, but with about 15mm more between the sump and diff. I was thinking I'd have to make a two piece front prop but if I can get the engine to the left another 50mm and down a little, I'll be able to get around the front prop issue, whilst still hoping it'll clear the diff nose as its moved to the left a bit!!!

Dougal

22nd December 2013, 02:44 PM

Blower fans are useless, so that should help your decision.

chazza

22nd December 2013, 02:48 PM

So, I now have two options... Option 1. Move the engine a further 40 mm back and fit the large engine driven fan. This option will ... guarantee good cooling, ...
Option 2. Move the engine forward 60mm, and try and use a large electric fan ...

It depends what you want to use it for, but if you intend to do any heavy off-road work or towing, the electric fan will probably be insufficient.

Davies Craig and Kenlowe both recommend keeping the viscous-coupling-fan for other land Rovers in the above situations,

Cheers Charlie

Sitec

22nd December 2013, 03:12 PM

Cheers fellas, yeah I was coming to that conclusion. The original truck viscous coupling is huge and was mounted to the crank, but I have a Dodge Ram fan hub and pulley coming from the states so plan to mount the original truck fan direct to that, or the V8 fan. Both are a decent size but fairly slim. Here's a pic of the engine right forwards (option 2) and the gear lever is in the ideal place, but the front RH engine mount will have to be a work of art and involve the exhaust down pipe, the sump well is very close to the front diff flange. Weight placement will also not be so good here. Will follow up later with a pic of option 1.

DasLandRoverMan

22nd December 2013, 07:29 PM

Sitec

22nd December 2013, 09:39 PM

Probably an awful lot easier to move it back and extend the gear linkage.
On the subject of engine mounts, would it be any easier to use the ones it sat on in the truck (right up the front of the block) possibly making a crossmember to sit them on, or would diff clearance present issues?

I had planned to do exactly that, but on the RH chassis rail exactly where the mount needs to be is the brake bias valve (or at least I think that's what it is).. Either way there's a network of brake pipes that I don't plan to move. There's also the two pressed plates that support the rad there, and I don't want to alter them as they are sturdy and will also be carrying the intercooler. And yes, the diff will cause issues with the engine forward.. With it set back, I've got a better chance of a one piece front prop too. I've played around with the gear lever this afternoon, and ideally that lever mount needs to be almost touching the rad to be in the ideal position.

DasLandRoverMan

22nd December 2013, 10:06 PM

Surely leaving the bracket where it is and extend the lever forward to a comfortable position? The original lever is about half a mile long as it come up through the cover anyways.

This is getting slightly confusing conversing between the board and facebooks...

Sitec

22nd December 2013, 10:20 PM

That whole lever assy is only held on my two M8 bolts, and is all mounted nicely with a swivel ball and gater, so if I was to extend the lever it would resemble the actions of the the original 101 setup! It'll be easy to relocate it and just add 100mm of tube to the link bar.

nrs91

22nd December 2013, 11:36 PM

speak my name and I shall appear...

When I did my 90 I left the chassis standard as I had a view to fitting a galv one later on... so this means I have the sloped mounts... and yes they REALLY dont like 500kg of Cummins sat upon them... however I will be upgrading to QT Services HD engine mounts when they finally get stock in (been three months now....)

the issue with engine mounts and downpipe is a common one... my down pipe is close to the mount but turbo position and use of a Dodge manifold (like Ashley and Tom have) does alot to improve this.

my 90 is the only vehicle ive driven which will reach its geared top speed... I have had it to 3200rpm in fifth... it was only then that the BMW along side me started to pull away haha... (private road yadda yadda yadda)

as for economy... I cant help but give the throttle a good prod (that noise) and my normal driving style returns me 22mpg (UK) which when compared to the much less powerful tweaked 200Tdi (that I kept blowing up) that returned 18-22mpg (UK) isnt bad at all... when towing my caravan (driving steady) I get 35mpg (UK) ... as for the pulling power I use the landy to move my 5,000kg living van and shunt 7,000kg broken cabover trucks around the farm... dont even drop into Low box.

Im glad people are inspired by what I have done and im interested to see what they come up with as no-one has the answer. I was going to drop a 6BT into my 101 next... but I have a Scammell and ERF to fix so the 101 will have to get soner or later.

If I ever get around to doing my 101 i will put emphasis in driving position, prop length/angle and weight balance... in that order.

Looking forward to your updates Simon... keep me in the loop, any Q's just ask :)

Heres some inspiration:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL68B82DD616BF6523&feature=mh_lolz

Thanks
Nick Steggel

Sitec

23rd December 2013, 06:17 AM

Dougal

24th December 2013, 05:25 AM

nrs91

24th December 2013, 05:44 AM

The v8 mounts arts indeed on the wrong angle for diesels, I am working l on a bolt on solution to roughly halve the angle for my isuzu mounts to stop the engine moving vertically as much . But space is limited.

its not the mount plates that are the issue its the rubber mount style. Look at the QT services HD captive mounts (the engine wont drop out if the mount fails)

Dougal

24th December 2013, 07:29 AM

its not the mount plates that are the issue its the rubber mount style. Look at the QT services HD captive mounts (the engine wont drop out if the mount fails)

It's the angle of the mounts, the rubber mounts aren't particularly failure prone but the angle required for vibration isolation and vertical support on an alloy V8 is completely different to the angles required for vibration isolation and vertical support on a cast iron inline vertical diesel.

The V8 mounts are at 60 degrees from horizontal, I will bring mine back to around 40 degrees from horizontal.

I have only had one rubber mount fail. It was a very old rubber mount and the vehicle had been crashed pretty hard at the time.

The QT captive mount design is too rigid and not suitable for diesels IMO.

nrs91

24th December 2013, 08:47 AM

It's the angle of the mounts, the rubber mounts aren't particularly failure prone but the angle required for vibration isolation and vertical support on an alloy V8 is completely different to the angles required for vibration isolation and vertical support on a cast iron inline vertical diesel.

The V8 mounts are at 60 degrees from horizontal, I will bring mine back to around 40 degrees from horizontal.

I have only had one rubber mount fail. It was a very old rubber mount and the vehicle had been crashed pretty hard at the time.

The QT captive mount design is too rigid and not suitable for diesels IMO.

mine uses 200Tdi mounts which are the same as V8 IIRC, the angle of the mounts trys to tear the mounts apart delaminting them... when i use the QT mount which is based on a suspension bush it will ensure that if the worst happens the cummins wont travel far (wouldnt want to pick it up from the side of the road) but also gets rid of the angle issue. with four of these mounts (two for engine two for boxes) the whole drivetrain should be well held and damped... also if i get abit cocky I could play with different spec polybushes to get the right vibration damping characteristics but doubt id bother... even when the PAS pump was touching a chassis web and the compressor touching the wing (both issues fixed now) the vibration/noise wasnt much greater

Dougal

24th December 2013, 11:31 AM

Have you considered transaxle mounts from Fwd cars? Similar style to the qt, but much larger to allow more vibration isolation.

Sitec

24th December 2013, 09:12 PM

I hadn't, as I plan to use the existing mounts, but mount them like the truck gearbox mounts in a much flatter position, around 20 to 30 deg. This will still centralise the engine. I also plan to build in an un bolt able catch plate (in the event of it ever being down side up).. The Nissan in the old 101 had a few chain links bolted between each mount for the same reason. Here's a pic of the fuel pump in relation to the LH seat mount. The compressor head is under this plate and about 15mm from the engine bay side wall.

Sitec

24th December 2013, 09:18 PM

Starter clearance is a similar 15mm off the RH Chassis Rail, so I guess that's where it'll sit! The hose between the engine and chassis is the brake vacuum line.. something I'd forgotten about until I was removing the V8... I'll prob source one of those small belt driven vacuum pumps off a Peugeot Diesel or similar.

Sitec

24th December 2013, 09:22 PM

And here's a shot of the front prop temporarily in place (another part that fell of Bojans 110 that's parked in the yard!):D. The angle is a lot better and with the 3.54:1 diffs the drone should no longer be there! :)

nrs91

24th December 2013, 09:29 PM

Have you considered transaxle mounts from Fwd cars? Similar style to the qt, but much larger to allow more vibration isolation.

could be a possibility but the QT mount is a straight replacement so i will give that a go first, im pretty certain four suspension bushes will sufficiently dampen the 6BT as it runs much smoother than a four pot.

@Simon
LRB381 Ford Transit Alternator is what I used for 12v charging and Vacuum for the brakes. Recon ones are around the £100 mark however i believe a Td5 or a TDCi alty also has a vacuum pump on the back :)

nrs91

24th December 2013, 09:40 PM

Sitec

24th December 2013, 09:46 PM

Simon
LRB381 Ford Transit Alternator is what I used for 12v charging and Vacuum for the brakes. Recon ones are around the £100 mark however i believe a Td5 or a TDCi alty also has a vacuum pump on the back :)

Hi Nick.
I'm retaining the 24v start and charge as I didn't want to have to buy another starter or alternator... I have provision for 2 x N70ZZ's within the new LH fuel tank (now containing diesel). Was going to look into driving something of the alternator but then thought the old Pug 205 pump would be easy slung under the flat drive belt. I have a spare flat type alternator pulley that came of a MF 8240 alternator... It'll be near to running when I get to that bit.... Have mounts to make, exhausts, 4 core into the rad, intercoolers, gear linkage, props, sump to scallop out, handbrake, work out the air clutch, etc etc etc yet! Hoping Ebay UK will come up with the goods on the pump! :)

Sitec

24th December 2013, 09:49 PM

Simon your clearance looks similar if not better than mine.. Prop looks good but does look like the box is tail end down so will probably improve in final fitment. If you struggle for rear prop room you can angle the rear diff up and put a small lean back on the box... Also Rakeway sell a short rear output, reduces rear output by 75mm and goves the perfect opportunity to upgrade to x-brake disc handbrake

Ha! Yeah, I have the tail of the box lower (or should I say engine nose higher to clear the Salisbury pumpkin), and had looked at maybe lifting the rear diff nose a small amount. Looked at the Rakeway handbrake assy too.. They any good? Would that disk hold a 2.5 tonne 101 with big tyres on high ratio diffs with a loaded trailer?

spongie

24th December 2013, 11:17 PM

I am going x brake on mine... But it will be long after you are finished

nrs91

25th December 2013, 04:53 AM

Ha! Yeah, I have the tail of the box lower (or should I say engine nose higher to clear the Salisbury pumpkin), and had looked at maybe lifting the rear diff nose a small amount. Looked at the Rakeway handbrake assy too.. They any good? Would that disk hold a 2.5 tonne 101 with big tyres on high ratio diffs with a loaded trailer?

the rakeway short housing is meant to be a tough bit of race kit... and the X-Eng X-Brake is very good kit, ill fit mine when i fit the box they use the brake mech off a JCB loading shovel (17t odd) and they were tested with a fully laden 110 and trailer on a steep grade. personally i think the tyres will loose grip first...

Air Clutch is pretty simple bud... just use a series 3 109 brake master with a remote reserviour for the clutch master and then feed air into the air part of the slave.

Im tempted to try use the compressor intake with a vacuum reserviour for the brakes... dunno how well it would work though

Sitec

25th December 2013, 08:05 AM

Im tempted to try use the compressor intake with a vacuum reserviour for the brakes... dunno how well it would work though

That's a gud idea... There would be vacuum there... especially with an M10 washer tacked in the end!!

Might revisit the Rakeway site too!:)

Sitec

25th December 2013, 08:32 AM

Do these have a speedo drive, and any idea of cost? :)

nrs91

25th December 2013, 10:46 AM

Do these have a speedo drive, and any idea of cost? :)

not sure dont think so... If i needed to do the conversion i was either goin to have an electric rpm counter on prop or use the abs sensor to give a feed to td5 speedo but more headaches than its worth... Im looking for mechanical simplicity all round to tie into my goal of a retirement trip round aus in 45yrs time lol

350RRC

25th December 2013, 08:55 PM

Bit extreme isn't it?I'm changing engine as I've ran out of petrol

We change wives here when they run out of oil.

DL

Sitec

27th December 2013, 01:05 PM

Ok, so with all the festive bollocks out of the way, I've managed to get back into it. The fan hub assy turned up, so using this I was able to gauge the final position of the engine fore and aft. Using blocks atop the front axle and below the gearbox, I was able to lift and lower the engine to help decide on its position too. After an hour of lifting, lowering and rolling, the final position was settled upon. Looking thru the starting handle hole found the center of the front pulley to be exactly where it was with the V8. The rear of the gearbox is about 50mm lower to assist with the rear prop angle, engine cover fitment, rear floor fitment, and various other pipework. Once settled upon I was able to roughly mark the chassis with chalk the areas that needed to be cleaned to accept the mounts and a few other things. Then it was time to lift it back out.. :)

Sitec

27th December 2013, 01:09 PM

Here's the fan hub from the US, that was on a Dodge Ram. The four holes to bolt it too were where they should be on the block, but needed tapping out to remove the rust etc!

Sitec

27th December 2013, 01:14 PM

Here's the only mod I have had to make t allow the engine to move to the left a little. This cut out is where the compressor head sits. Just below the cut out, you can see where the top of the shocker mount has been shaved to clear the compressor body. Below that is one of the four freshly cleaned chassis sections ready to accept the new engine mount plates.

Sitec

27th December 2013, 05:21 PM

The first of the engine mount plates made.. This one (LHS) was not too bad. Just a few spacers around the oil fill tube. The original cast Leyland Daf mount plates put the rubber mounts out over the radiator support plates, so this had to be made instead! Tomorrow is the RHS... Which has to work around the lower coolant hose, the turbo oil return line, and limited bolting points!

DasLandRoverMan

27th December 2013, 07:33 PM

Looks like a better day for it down under...

I was considering spending some time in the workshop on projects various today, but the howling winds and driving rain leaves the Lego F1 car the Mrs bought me for Christmas as the more tempting option...

Homestar

27th December 2013, 07:54 PM

Not wanting to rub it in, but it was 23 out on the Golf Course today where i am on holidays, with a lovely sea breeze blowing across the front 9 we were playing...:)

Not sure what it was like in Simons part of the world - nice and warm I would think.

nrs91

27th December 2013, 11:11 PM

nice sunny day in england... scorching couple of degrees C with a windchill... so im gunna shove disco in shed to do some work haha

anyway looks like youve had a very productive festive holiday... cant wait for the next instalment!

DasLandRoverMan

28th December 2013, 03:22 AM

Oh flower O Scotland!!! When will we see, yer like again!!!

Who am I kidding, off to Australiashire on the wolds!!!

Sitec

28th December 2013, 06:22 PM

And the right hand mount plate..... This ones stepped to get around the turbo oil return hose. The two rear most holes were previously unused so needed tapping out. With the three original mount holes and these additional holes and the plate being 12mm I don't think it'll move far. It'll be lift back in first thing tomorrow and start setting up the rubber mounting support plates.

Sitec

29th December 2013, 06:59 PM

Well, the engine is back in for the second time now, having made room for the compressor. Its allowed the engine to sit a little more to the left, giving me just enough room for a one piece prop at the front!! Here's compressor to chassis clearance as it sits now.

Sitec

29th December 2013, 07:03 PM

Homestar

29th December 2013, 07:23 PM

Glad you had your priorities straight and saved that Vineyard... A world without wine is not worth considering.:D

....you did save it... Right???

Sitec

29th December 2013, 07:28 PM

Glad you had your priorities straight and saved that Vineyard... A world without wine is not worth considering.:D

....you did save it... Right???

Yeah, we saved it! The bombers did one very well placed drop and then we spent the rest of the avo jumping between vine rows chasing little pockets of fire! SWMBO would have given me heaps had we not as she's a keen drinker too... There'll b a few consumed at Melrose I can see!!! :D

Mick_Marsh

29th December 2013, 09:04 PM

Yeah, we saved it! The bombers did one very well placed drop and then we spent the rest of the avo jumping between vine rows chasing little pockets of fire! SWMBO would have given me heaps had we not as she's a keen drinker too... There'll b a few consumed at Melrose I can see!!! :D
I think at the last gathering, Bartagunyah was sucked dry.

DasLandRoverMan

29th December 2013, 10:05 PM

isuzurover

29th December 2013, 11:48 PM

Wine? Wine?!?!? There's a lot more to be said for a cold and well brewed hops based concoction.

Please tell me there's decent ale (failing that Guinness) available out there!!!

Nice job with the engine by the ways.

I'll bet you haven't yet tasted a good Barossa or Clare Valley Shiraz?

However there are plenty of good beers here - some of the wineries even make beer:
Knappstein Enterprise Winery & Brewery (http://www.knappstein.com.au/)

None of it is served warm and flat though, so you may not like it... :D :p

DasLandRoverMan

30th December 2013, 05:17 AM

Warm flat beer? What sort of a savage do you take me for!!!

Proper ale with some gas about it served well chilled is the way to drink.

slug_burner

30th December 2013, 01:22 PM

Having got the engine back in and sat where I want it it was mount time!!!! Not for long tho as the CFS pager dropped for a Vinyard Fire!! Here's how far I got tho. I've started with the gearbox as its the easiest to get too, and once supported, it means I can lift and lower the engine nose to assist with making and locating the front mounts!

Once the mounts are in place will you be able to remove the gearbox from under the vehicle? I suspect that that may not be a concern if access from the top is easy.

Sitec

30th December 2013, 10:09 PM

Once the mounts are in place will you be able to remove the gearbox from under the vehicle? I suspect that that may not be a concern if access from the top is easy.

Under or above.. Its quite a lump tho so I'd be dropping the transfer box off and then dealing with it. It so say had a new clutch not long before I got it, and judging by the copper slip on mounting bolts etc and marks on the bell housing I'd say it has been done, so hopefully won't be pulling the box out. :)

Sitec

31st December 2013, 07:38 AM

Here's the rear left gearbox mount tacked in place and looking like it should be there. I've used the heavier LT Gearbox rubbers which are 75 mm wide. These worked ok with the old Nissan, but didn't like the steep angle on the original chassis mounts. I've addressed this by running a lot less of a taper.

Sitec

31st December 2013, 07:49 AM

Here's the right hand gearbox mount. There's slightly more room on this side as the earlier mods beside the compressor have allowed the engine to sit slightly to the left. Having settled on the final location, these two gearbox mounts are now welded in situe. Today I'll be continuing with the engine mounts. I've lifted the nose of the engine 3mm above the decided position (a guestamate of how much the mounts will squash with the load). Once the front mounts are finished and the engine/box combo are sat on the mounts, Im then planning to make a centrally mounted rear mount using some poly bushes and an M14 bolt. More to follow on this, but as I've used the truck gearbox mounting points I think a lightweight pin mount at the rear will assist with the transfer case support, and act as a good locator to stop fore and aft movement when off road. It would also act as a 'catcher' should the vehicle ever end up 'down side up'!

nrs91

31st December 2013, 08:56 AM

lookin good... id pick off the standard transfer box mount if your worried about weight... also its on the right side for the torque twist

Sitec

31st December 2013, 12:17 PM

I looked at using that mounting point, but the 101's chassis sits high compared to the transfer box location. Whatever I'd have had to have made would have been ungainly and had to have dropped over 100mm to be in the right place.. That's what led me to a top mount.. It probably does not need one but I've got to mod the middle x member to clear the handbrake drum so will build it into that.

Sitec

31st December 2013, 12:24 PM

Here's a pic of the front right mount. All are tacked in place with enough to support the engine and box. Once the engine is out for paint and sump mods, I'll weld them up and paint the inner rails.

Sitec

31st December 2013, 12:35 PM

With the engine in place I'm able to look to making prop shafts. I'm using other props rather than cut the originals. This way everything stays complete should I ever want to put it back. For the front prop I was going to use the prop that 'fell off' the rear of the 110 in the yard.. but having measured up, marked up the 115mm that needs to be removed and then chopped it, I was horrified to find the tube is only 2mm thick!!! Is this normal!!!!??? Now looking for a Series 109 rear prop as I would assume they are thicker.... Anyone got one lying around?

Sitec

31st December 2013, 12:39 PM

Once cut, there's no point leaving it in two pieces so I've measured it all up and set it up for welding.

Sitec

31st December 2013, 12:44 PM

Prop welded. With it in place I can see what I have to cut out of the sump. Kicking myself for rushing ahead and reversing the sump! Hey ho, the engine would not have even sat in the chassis had I not!
This afternoon will be spent having a bit of a workshop blitz!

101RRS

31st December 2013, 02:03 PM

What are you intending to do to the front suspension to carry the extra weight?

chazza

31st December 2013, 03:07 PM

...I was horrified to find the tube is only 2mm thick!!! Is this normal!!!!???

Sounds right to me, I remember cutting one up years ago and it wasn't very heavy. I have a u/s 109" one in the shed I think; I can cut the end off it, if you are desperate to know,

Cheers Charlie

Sitec

31st December 2013, 03:21 PM

What are you intending to do to the front suspension to carry the extra weight?

Its sat on its springs ATM with engine in situe, and has only dropped 10 mm... The rad is empty tho, there's no ROPS, engine cover, exhaust etc but I have a second set of front springs which I plan to split. I'll use the lower leaves on the nose of the 101 and the single leaves that are left for a camp trailer that I plan to build.... after the diesel is done! Here's a pic, along with the new slightly longer than original 12.9 Cap Head Bolts and heavy washers. It worked out about ideal with the Nissan last time and also gives a 15mm lift to the nose (not that a 101 needs to be any higher!!). :)

Sitec

31st December 2013, 03:23 PM

Sounds right to me, I remember cutting one up years ago and it wasn't very heavy. I have a u/s 109" one in the shed I think; I can cut the end off it, if you are desperate to know,

Cheers Charlie

Hi Charlie.. Define u/s... I'm about to put a wanted advert in the right section for exactly that... A 109 rear prop! If its just joints and flanges, I can change them.. If its splines then its not so good..... Cheers!:)

Sitec

1st January 2014, 05:24 PM

So, today was going to be a chilled day, but as SWMBO managed to hurt her foot last nite she's been resting inside all day. Nursing duties done and Im given the green light to hit the man cave!! Now the engine and box are located, I can start with making/adapting all the surrounding stuff.. With the temporary front prop on and at a nice gradual angle, it was time to look at the rear. The rear angle was no worse than the original, but as the prop is only 480mm long and will have a lot more torque running thru it, I've decided to lift the diff nose so it matches the output shaft. Now I know Salisburys don't like nose lifts, but Im not talking a lot. I've loosened the U Bolts and lifted the nose to match the output shaft. This opened up an 8mm gap on the mounting flats, so I've now tapered the mounts by removing 8mm from the front to lift the nose.

Sitec

1st January 2014, 05:30 PM

Here's a shot of the axle now its been bolted tight again. The U Bolts have pulled up nicely, and the castings are sitting nicely against the springs. The diff nose flange has lifted a max of 30mm so not a lot and this has lessened the prop angle and put the two mating flange faces parallel. This can only help the situation, can't be spotted unless you really look and wouldn't affect the vehicle if I had to refit the LT95. :)

Sitec

1st January 2014, 07:37 PM

After a chilled lunch I got back into it and made the rear prop. Here it is resting in place. Short but not too steep! :)

Homestar

1st January 2014, 07:43 PM

Sitec

1st January 2014, 07:57 PM

Top job, the angle on that back prop looks fine.

Are you tempted to stick a jerry can of diesel on top of the engine, jump start it and run it up and down the driveway....:angel:

Are you planning to get the prop shafts balanced or see how they go first.

I'd be very tempted but Im still waiting on the drive gear to be welded. He said mid Jan so its making me get on with it all! I'm going to remove the engine again to weld up the mounts and paint the chassis.. (Seriously considering Das's suggestion of lifting the rear tub off to access the middle x member, manufacture the exhaust, clean the chassis and paint it all). I've still got intake pipes, intercooler pipes, compressor plumbing, exhaust and brake to build/fit, and the transfer case to rebuild so have a bit to do yet!

Re props, the rear one is so short there'd be very little issue I think, and the front one I'll see how I go. Prob going to swap it out for a thicker walled Series LWB prop so it might just be temporary. Don't fancy the chances of a prop with 2mm wall thickness up against Cummins torque in lo box!

DasLandRoverMan

1st January 2014, 08:14 PM

Ten bolts man!!! Stop messing about and just do it!!!

Nice job otherwise.

Sitec

1st January 2014, 08:23 PM

Ten bolts man!!! Stop messing about and just do it!!!

Nice job otherwise.

Ok ok!!! So fellas, tomorrows job is removing the rear tray because Das says so!!! More to follow!! :D

nrs91

2nd January 2014, 08:11 AM

looking good Si... plenty of progress!
regards prop thickness etc i think the UJ will snap before the wall thickness becomes an issue mate.
looking forward to next installment!

isuzurover

2nd January 2014, 11:14 AM

Some things to think about wrt props:

Below is a pic I took showing binding angle of stock disco I and II front shafts and a Nissan shaft.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/01/1584.jpg

http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt84/bushie39/PropShafts.jpg

LR 109/110/130 props are a smaller diameter than ideal, but rarely seem to fail. Diameter is less critical on shorter prps liuke you have.

Disco 1 rear props on the other hand I have seen fail.

Given the torque you will have available I would be inclined to use heavy wall tube - and also 1350 unis and high angle yokes (or a DC shaft).

goingbush

2nd January 2014, 12:09 PM

Sitec

2nd January 2014, 01:37 PM

If its any use heres how they did same on my car,
note they raised nose of diff by using wedged spacers btwn spring and spring perch . (arrow points to barely visible spring perch) Transfer case is horizontal, so they used DC on both ends of prop.
I dont really know why they pointed the rear diff uphill ??

Front diff sits level, no DC on front. Oil fill holes are the same on both ends, I thought the rear diff should have more oil to account for raised nose.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2014/01/1577.jpg

runs silky smooth, no vibes anywhere.

I take it that's under the Daily...? The shaft looks to come in at exactly the same plain as the diff nose.... Wonder why there's a double cardy joint there.... I'm not too worried about the rear prop.. Short tho it is it has wide angle ends, and thicker 3mm tube wall thickness. Its the front shaft (ex 110 rear) that only has the 2mm wall thickness and worries me.. Given, the tube is larger diameter, but this is actually a pain as its close to the bell housing and the sump will need modifying. A smaller 109" rear prop would have the smaller tube but thicker wall. I've been offered one in QLD but am going to see if any turn up in SA over the next week. :)

goingbush

2nd January 2014, 01:56 PM

Yes, its the Daily,
what about an 1980's jeep cherokee front prop, I used one in a V8 Auto conversion about 20 yrs ago because of clearance issues , it was about 1.5" dia and bulletproof.

Sitec

2nd January 2014, 07:37 PM

Well, as Das said, 12 bolts and a little assistance with the tractor and I have something similar to what Stuee's been looking at for the past few months! But of course now I can see all of it, I'll have to clean and paint it!!! At least it'll make manufacturing the exhaust and removing the old drop plate easier!!! :D

Homestar

2nd January 2014, 07:49 PM

Nothing a quick pressure wash and a couple of cans of paint from Bunnings wouldn't fix...:angel::wasntme:

Oh yeah, that's right - that's just me...

bee utey

2nd January 2014, 08:02 PM

I'm told the old Rangies with the 727 torquflite trans ran a solid steel driveshaft.

Sitec

2nd January 2014, 08:28 PM

I'm told the old Rangies with the 727 torquflite trans ran a solid steel driveshaft.

Yeah, this crossed my mind... We have some 40mm o/d tube at work that was bought in for a specific job.. It has a wall thickness of 10mm!!! As Nick (Nrs91) said tho with his experience I'll wreck the joints before I snap the shaft, so Im tempted to see how it goes. The greatest torque will be in 1st and 2nd low... With this in mind, I won't be giving it the beans when in these gears. When at 110kph pulling out to overtake a B Double, the power will be there but it'll be nowhere near what it would be accelerating hard in 2nd or 3rd!

Mick_Marsh

2nd January 2014, 08:38 PM

Nothing a quick pressure wash and a couple of cans of paint from Bunnings wouldn't fix...:angel::wasntme:

Oh yeah, that's right - that's just me...
Yep. That's just you.

nrs91

2nd January 2014, 10:57 PM

To be honest your more likely to bust a halfshaft or cv :) there should be minimal shock loadings in the lowest gears if anything will make ot fail it will be 3rd 4th or 5th low when you find the ground again lol

keep up the good work!

spongie

2nd January 2014, 11:12 PM

Dougal

3rd January 2014, 04:57 AM

I'm told the old Rangies with the 727 torquflite trans ran a solid steel driveshaft.

In the front?
I have a solid front shaft in my rrc, originally from a discovery that had cat converters. I haven't seen the setup myself but the us guys keep talking about it.

nrs91

3rd January 2014, 05:34 AM

Shouldnt you be working? JCBs aint gonna design themselves

haha been on stock take all day... boring... and i posted on lunchbreak ;)

goingbush

6th January 2014, 01:42 PM

check this out

http://asheville.craigslist.org/pts/4274273234.html

Dougal

6th January 2014, 01:52 PM

check this out

Cummins 5.9 Complete Engine (http://asheville.craigslist.org/pts/4274273234.html)

That is VERY expensive. You'd get a whole 6BT powered dodge for a fraction of that.

goingbush

6th January 2014, 03:03 PM

That is VERY expensive. You'd get a whole 6BT powered dodge for a fraction of that.

which one ???

dodge cummins | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR11.TRC1.A0.Xd odge+cummins&_nkw=dodge+cummins&_sacat=0&_from=R40)

isuzurover

6th January 2014, 03:40 PM

which one ???

dodge cummins | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR11.TRC1.A0.Xd odge+cummins&_nkw=dodge+cummins&_sacat=0&_from=R40)

Whole parts vehicle $3k buy it now (6BT).
Dodge RAM 2500 Base Standard Cab Pickup 2 Door | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dodge-Ram-2500-Base-Standard-Cab-Pickup-2-Door-1995-dodge-ram-cummins-diesel-4-x-4-parts-truck-rust-/331100416516?forcerrptr=true&hash=item4d171f6a04&item=331100416516&pt=US_Cars_Trucks)

Commonrail 24V version of 6BT currently at $4500
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dodge-Ram-3500-SLT-Cummins-DRW-Automatic-4dr-Autos-2002-dodge-ram-3500-cummins-turbo-diesel-4-x-4-/321290733086?forcerrptr=true&hash=item4ace6b861e&item=321290733086&pt=US_Cars_Trucks

Most of the vehicles in your list are too new to have a 6BT

goingbush

6th January 2014, 03:54 PM

Im a troll AND I suck at searching.
just got too much time on my hands, bored as **** house sitting in bloody Sydney , its driving me crazy.

Dougal

6th January 2014, 04:07 PM

Ebay vehicle search is completely missing for me too. I can search parts and accessories, but not vehicles.
Even browsing in private mode (not logged in) it's no good.

But here's one listed on 4btswaps.com whole pickup for far less than that engine.
http://greensboro.craigslist.org/cto/4274247623.html

Sitec

6th January 2014, 07:29 PM

CUMMINS 6B GOOD RUNNING COMPLETE ENGINES. | eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CUMMINS-6B-GOOD-RUNNING-COMPLETE-ENGINES-/261362081365?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CommercialVe hicleParts_SM&hash=item3cda64de55)

Or you could forget the over priced stuff in the states, the ridiculously priced stuff in Oz, and do what I did and buy one out of the UK, pay $450 in shipping and $500 for customs/washing etc and have an engine at your door in 8 weeks for under $2000..... ;)

Homestar

6th January 2014, 08:33 PM

Must.... Resist.... Impulse.... To buy..... Cummins engine.... For 101...:D

Sitec

6th January 2014, 09:56 PM

Must.... Resist.... Impulse.... To buy..... Cummins engine.... For 101...:D

You know you want to!! :D Have a drive of mine at Easter and then make your decision! (You might hate it!)

Homestar

6th January 2014, 10:17 PM

You know you want to!! :D Have a drive of mine at Easter and then make your decision! (You might hate it!)

I seriously doubt I'll hate it - I'm more worried that I will love it...:D

The 6BT is close to my favourite engine - I've worked on heaps of them, and it was an engine I was fully qualified on at Cummins. They are damn near bullet proof and I don't recall ever seeing a seriously stuffed one. I worked on a genset once powered by one that had 47,000 hours on it - it had only ever had regular services, 1 new turbo and 2 water pumps in all that time - it was still running fine when it was finally removed from service. Also worked on the 6B that powered a ferry - 25,000 hours - again, only doing a water pump on it.:)

spongie

6th January 2014, 10:22 PM

He's tempted me now you know

Mick_Marsh

6th January 2014, 11:38 PM

I think Gav is about to get a project 101.

nrs91

7th January 2014, 05:14 AM

do it... you wont regret it... im the devil on everyones shoulder haha...

DasLandRoverMan

7th January 2014, 06:43 AM

Go on!!!

Plenty help finding an engine over here and getting it sent out. Could probably turn up a 101 for the job too...

Dougal

7th January 2014, 08:14 AM

rangieman

7th January 2014, 09:22 AM

In Australia an Isuzu 6BD1T or 6BG1T might be similar money.

The layout on the Isuzus is opposite (intake and exhaust on other sides) which may or may not solve some packagin problems. The Isuzus are also a dry sleeved engine. Rebuilds are quick and very cheap if they need it.

These 6bd1t and 6bg1t engines are like rocking horse poo here :( I know ive been searching for months to repower my FSR , Rebuilt the 6bd1 cheap as i paid a mechanic for a in chassis rebuild new liners pistons ect inc labour $4500.00:D

Dougal

7th January 2014, 11:55 AM

These 6bd1t and 6bg1t engines are like rocking horse poo here :( I know ive been searching for months to repower my FSR , Rebuilt the 6bd1 cheap as i paid a mechanic for a in chassis rebuild new liners pistons ect inc labour $4500.00:D

They might be all snapped up to repower bedfords. I'm talking to the Isuzu agents about this right now. Isuzu has a long-block program for all their common diesels. The pump that's spat the dummy is a 6BD1. Oil pressure and water temp cut-outs failed. It still runs but sounds like hammers inside a tumble-drier.

Still awaiting prices. http://isuzudiesel.com.au/media/180411/ISZ7281%20Diesel%20LBlock%20Bro.pdf

Cylinder liners aftermarket are $80 each. Pistons about $500 for a set. But genuine cylinder kits are about $500 a piece and well worth it if you drive a vehicle yourself. They are matched set in four different grades to suit different tolerance bores.
Big difference in blowby and NVH when you get the factory stuff right.

Sitec

7th January 2014, 05:13 PM

do it... you wont regret it... im the devil on everyones shoulder haha...

Sooo, u still thinking of selling yours.....? You're in the right place to source another Cummins and ZF..... :D:wasntme:

goingbush

7th January 2014, 05:35 PM

wonder if a Cat V8 and Allison would fit a 101

http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/unanderra/other-automotive/bedford-yrt-bus/103527989

you could use whats left to store all your landy bits in. (or live in it when the missus kicks you out when she finds out what you bought)

nrs91

7th January 2014, 05:38 PM

Never sell my girl, i have a good contact for engines n boxes in scotland

DasLandRoverMan

7th January 2014, 07:39 PM

Do tell?

Wouldn't mind a half decent/cheapish one if it's 'local'.

nrs91

8th January 2014, 05:05 AM

Do tell?

Wouldn't mind a half decent/cheapish one if it's 'local'.

top side of edinborough bud the guy i just got my box off lol

DasLandRoverMan

8th January 2014, 07:09 AM

Local enough. How expensive is he?

nrs91

8th January 2014, 06:54 PM

Local enough. How expensive is he?

well he does me a good rate n he said hed do the same for my mates like will drop him a message n see what hes got

Sitec

20th January 2014, 07:16 PM

Well. After a week or so landscaping, sighting Bojans container, and the last three days fighting fire, I managed to get back into it!! I managed to get into gear at lunch time, and get back to the exhaust manufacture. I've looked at both 3" and 4" pipe. I've settled on 3" as 4" was going to be difficult to route thru the vehicle chassis etc. 3" is also slightly bigger than the turbo's outlet, and I'd previously sourced a large 3" muffler from Gumtree!

Sitec

20th January 2014, 07:24 PM

I'd originally planned to run the exhaust outlet out in the same position as the original, but this then required a flex link, running the pipe ip the RH side of the engine and box, under, over or around the LT230 to the LH side, then back across to the right and out. This made for a lot of work and left limited room for the future planned fitment of a Hydraulic winch and oil tank. I then remembered how an Iveco truck I had was setup. The exhaust outlet is just in front of the rear RH wheel (still behind the last side access to the vehicle), and the whole system will be affixed to the engine and gearbox, negating the need for rubber mounts and flex joints.

slug_burner

20th January 2014, 10:55 PM

Mick_Marsh

20th January 2014, 11:41 PM

I suspect that unless you can separate the cargo area from the passenger space you will not be able to get away with that on a soft top. Ok on a truck.

Pretty sure that the exhaust has to be behind the last opening window. On a soft top that probably means the exhaust has got to be out the back not the side. Then again not all roadworthy testers know the detail.
From Vicroads:
VSI-8
There must be no escape path for exhaust gases other than
the exhaust outlet, and the vehicle must continue to comply
with the noise emission standards applicable to it
VSI-126
The exhaust system of a vehicle must not pass through
the cabin or any passenger area and must be free of leaks.
Condensation drain holes are not leaks.
The exhaust system must be fitted with an effective
silencing device and all exhaust gases must pass
through the device.
All mountings must be secure and the exhaust system
must have adequate clearance between all other parts
of the vehicle and the road.
Unshielded parts of an exhaust system, other than the
outlet, must not protrude beyond the profile of the vehicle
other than on the underside. The outlet must be located
so as to avoid direct entry of gases into the passenger
compartment and must not extend beyond the plan of
the vehicle.
Your probably getting confused with a vehicle over 4.5t GVM, which a 101 isn't.

If you have any verifiable information to the contrary, I'd be very interested in reading it.

slug_burner

21st January 2014, 01:10 AM

dseddn

21st January 2014, 02:04 AM

From SA website italics mine, it is still open for interpretation with the rag top as to where the last widow is.Engine and exhaust modifications - Government of South Australia (http://www.sa.gov.au/subject/Transport%2C+travel+and+motoring/Motoring/Vehicles+and+registration/Vehicle+standards+and+modifications/Engine+and+exhaust+modifications)
Vehicles also must meet the following requirements:

Vehicles may be fitted with extractors provided that any emission control devices which were originally fitted to the original manufacturer's exhaust system, including catalytic converters, are re-connected and operational.
The extractors must not foul any part of the steering, suspension, braking or fuel systems.
Catalytic converters and exhaust sensors that have been replaced are to be positioned in the same exhaust flow location as in the original system.
The exhaust outlet exit must be behind the last door or window opening on the side or rear of the vehicle.
The exhaust outlet must be as close as possible to the outer edge of the vehicle, but not outside or underneath the vehicle.
If the exhaust system is not underneath the vehicle and can come into contact with people, it must be shielded
The exhaust outlet must extend at least 40 mm beyond the furthermost outboard or rearmost joint of the floor pan which is not continuously welded or permanently sealed and which could permit direct access of exhaust gases to the passenger compartment, but not beyond the perimeter of the vehicle when viewed in plan
The exhaust outlet, if to the side of the vehicle, must discharge to the right hand side of the vehicle and downwards at an angle to the horizontal of not less than 15 degrees and not more than 45 degrees.
The exhaust outlet, if to the rear of the vehicle must discharge at not more than 10 degrees above or 45 degrees below the horizontal.
The vehicle must have 100mm ground clearance.

DasLandRoverMan

21st January 2014, 03:39 AM

Doesn't look like it would be that convoluted to leave the silencer there and run it pretty much straight back from there, perhaps a little kink around the shock absorber then 90 degrees a d out the back corner over the spring like the standard system, not hugely convoluted, not consuming much space and shouldn't see any problems with the rules either?

nrs91

21st January 2014, 04:25 AM

i think where it is now would be fine... its a solid sided van as such... probs best asking a tester tbh.
I prefer UK rules... haha

Sitec

21st January 2014, 06:18 AM

It's fine where it is. Having just taken it over the pits, the guys there said a side exit exhaust is fine so long as its behind the last door or window on 'said' side. With a 101, that is classed as just behind the front wheel. All Iveco Dailys have it in the position pictured and have no issues. Das, to run it to the rear, it would have to swap sides as the load bias valve and its associated clutter is on the right. I'd also have to keep it under the chassis leaving room for the winch....:)

Homestar

21st January 2014, 06:29 AM

Agreed - fine where it is. The standard exhaust on these run out the side, only behind the back wheel. It is still not behind where you can open the canvas up, but is legal.

nrs91

21st January 2014, 08:36 AM

agreed! i love it! nice work!

Mick_Marsh

21st January 2014, 08:38 AM

ADR 42-1 covers some details re exhaust location and angles of outlet but it does not speak of windows etc. I'll see if I can find something on the outlet vs opening in the vehicle. I see JDNSW makes a similar comment in a thread but does note quote the source.
This is why I require confirmation.
ADR 42-1 is from the third edition ADR's. Mostly it applies to vehicles manufactured on of after 1st July 1992.
Due to the age of the vehicle, the second edition ADR's apply. There is no ADR 42 in the second edition.
You must apply the correct rule, standard or regulation to the vehicle.

cooee

21st January 2014, 05:14 PM

hi sitec

I think where you run your exhaust is perfect looks greatlook forward to when you start it up keep up great work you are on same wave lengh as me on exhaust system
cheers cooee

Sitec

25th January 2014, 08:13 PM

Well, after more fires and finally 'hitting a brick wall' and running out of go on thurs I had a few hours in the shed (which has lots of space now as Bojans stuff is no longer in it!!!!). The rad is back out and in the car ready to be fitted with a larger core. (Any input as to what core people use would be great). So it was time to se if the intercooler will actually fit in the hole provided... It does... Just. I have it clamped in place to see that it clears the steering arm.. which it does. I've also removed the gear lever and chopped the linking arm and am going to mount the lever where I want it and glue a piece of tube in. It would have been right had I not shifted the engine back 100mm to make room for an engine driven fan. Right decision tho, as with the intercooler up front, there's no room for an electric fan!

nrs91

25th January 2014, 10:29 PM

that intercooler is a spot on fit!

As far as rad goes my Cummins runs fine on a full width land rover rad with 2" ports (when i had the standard rad the small ports meant it ran slightly hotter) rarely gets upto half temp unless i give it pain (45psi of boost) even in our scorching 28degC summer ;) thats without a fan
will sit on half if not slightly more when working it hard at low speed offroad but the fan will keep it to around 1/3rd on gauge...

Basically any upgraded rad suitable for keeping a tweaked rover v8 cold in your environment will keep the cummins happy provided you have it modded to 2" ports so flow isnt restricted

Sitec

25th January 2014, 10:38 PM

that intercooler is a spot on fit! As far as rad goes my Cummins runs fine on a full width land rover rad with 2" ports.... Basically any upgraded rad suitable for keeping a tweaked rover v8 cold in your environment will keep the cummins happy provided you have it modded to 2" ports so flow isnt restricted

Cheers. Yeah, plan to get the ports opened up to sut the top outlet on the 6Bt, and get a 4 core center fitted. I'm also going to run a full time fan. Know it'll b a little noisy but better than being hot. The borrowed V8 I had seemed to want to run warm, but it did have enough go to pull 3.5 diffs so was doing well! Hopefully have my gear back in a few days, so will be able to rebuild the transfer case! :)

nrs91

25th January 2014, 10:44 PM

I also had mine baffled so both ports were on the drivers side to suit the cummins, made piping it up alot easier!
cant wait to see your gearbox plan coming together :)

DasLandRoverMan

26th January 2014, 02:47 AM

Shouldn't need baffles for a 101 radiator, just bigger outlets and move one to the opposite side of the tank, can't think if it would be top or bottom.

Most interested to see what comes of the transfer gear.

nrs91

26th January 2014, 03:59 AM

Shouldn't need baffles for a 101 radiator, just bigger outlets and move one to the opposite side of the tank, can't think if it would be top or bottom.

youd need a baffle to send it through the cores or itl just come in the end tank and straight back out... path of least resistance n all that

Dougal

26th January 2014, 04:48 AM

Where did you get the intercooler? It looks a great fit but I can't see the inlet and outlet.

DasLandRoverMan

26th January 2014, 06:30 AM

youd need a baffle to send it through the cores or itl just come in the end tank and straight back out... path of least resistance n all that

Tanks are top and bottom on a 101 though...

nrs91

26th January 2014, 07:04 AM

Tanks are top and bottom on a 101 though...

ah fair enough not looked at mine in great detail lol

Sitec

26th January 2014, 07:26 AM

Where did you get the intercooler? It looks a great fit but I can't see the inlet and outlet.

NEW Front Mount Intercooler Tube FIN Design 510x300x76mm W 3 0" Outlets | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/New-Front-Mount-Intercooler-Tube-Fin-Design-510x300x76mm-w-3-0-Outlets-/121260598960?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1c3bb1e6b0&_uhb=1)

Hi Dougal. The intercooler came from this guy. It actually came with the wrong outlet sizes, and he was very quick to rectify that and has been very helpful since with other stuff. Top ebayer! :)

Sitec

26th January 2014, 07:29 AM

Most interested to see what comes of the transfer gear.

Me too! Spoke to him earlier this week, and I should have the welded gear back in the next few days. I was going to have a new one made, but because he has not got the random tooling to suit the weird Land Rover gears, I've had to go with the welded option. Will post pics in the 'ZF 5-42 to LT230' thread in the projects section once I get it back. :)

DasLandRoverMan

26th January 2014, 08:00 AM

Good a stuff, looking at helping a mate building a Cummins 130, and a nice solid adapter to copy for it would be great!!!

Hehehe

nrs91

26th January 2014, 08:18 AM

Das when i redo mine ill make drawings and try and make CAD docs of all I do so it would be a simple sent of drawings to make then it would just bolt up and drop in... theres so much interest I might consider making simple kits

Dougal

26th January 2014, 08:47 AM

Good a stuff, looking at helping a mate building a Cummins 130, and a nice solid adapter to copy for it would be great!!!

Hehehe

You've seen this one?: Cummins ISB 5.9 24 valve into a landrover (http://www.4btswaps.com/forum/showthread.php?31777-Cummins-ISB-5.9-24-valve-into-a-landrover&highlight=140)

Different approach again.

DasLandRoverMan

26th January 2014, 07:39 PM

nrs91

26th January 2014, 10:40 PM

You've seen this one?: Cummins ISB 5.9 24 valve into a landrover (http://www.4btswaps.com/forum/showthread.php?31777-Cummins-ISB-5.9-24-valve-into-a-landrover&highlight=140)

Different approach again.

aye I cant help but wonder how that D3 box will hold up to the mighty cummins lol

Dougal

27th January 2014, 07:16 AM

I'd been keeping an eye, one has to wonder how the Disco 3 box will hold up to the engine.

Saw the vehicle in LRO a few years back, can't say a Land Rover the length of a Canal Barge and powered by a 6.2 V8D really blew me away, but they still think they're a good engine in the UK, and each to their own...

Funny isn't it. 6.2 litres of diesel V8 sounded great the first time everyone heard about it.

aye I cant help but wonder how that D3 box will hold up to the mighty cummins lol

Given it's an EFI engine I think he may be sticking with the original tune. The D3 box should be fine for that for a short while. Official max torque is 472Nm for that box. I'm not sure where he got the 600ft-lbs from:
http://disco3club.co.uk/gallery/albums/userpics/10057/308_03_02.pdf

Sitec

29th January 2014, 08:10 PM

Interesting thread that one... If he's taking a 6.2 out to fit a 5.9, those GM V8's must really be a bucket of snot.. Perhaps Brute is doing the right thing! Either way, so am I!!!:twisted: Right! Back to it... with more vengeance now as its the only 101 with a Monster Diesel once again!! :) So, after getting over the shock of the rad quote, I've decided to run with the three core rad with bigger inlets and outlets and see how we go. While the rad is out, its given me room to play with the intercooler and air intake pipework. The Cummins head is slightly different to most and has an inlet manifold built in, but with a top plate that's removable (allows for water to air intercoolers and other different applications). The plate that came with mine had a fairly tall inlet pipe that was 50mm higher than the top of the engine, and was going to fowl the engine cover. It was also facing rearward. After the headache of removing/listening injector pipes to be able to get the old one out, it was time for a trial fit of the new one I have made over the past few evenings. It looks as if it'll work well... Here's old and new side beside each other. I was surprised how small an inlet the original had... No more than 50mm id..

Sitec

29th January 2014, 08:25 PM

Here's it in situ with the start of the pipework resting in place to see how it'll work. Each intercooler pipe will run inside the front wheel arch and into the cooler.

Homestar

29th January 2014, 08:29 PM

Looks better than factory.:). Also looks like a tight squeeze in there.:D

Sitec

29th January 2014, 09:01 PM

Looks worse than it is.. I could have got a Signature Engine in there!! ;) Once the air cleaner to turbo 3" cross over pipe goes in and a few other bits, it'll start to get busy! Still thinking about how to get a vacuum pump in there too!:D

Brute

29th January 2014, 09:37 PM

Looking good Simon. Maybe I'll have to find a cummins :)

Sitec

30th January 2014, 04:14 AM

Looking good Simon. Maybe I'll have to find a cummins :)

Now that's a plan!! :D

DasLandRoverMan

30th January 2014, 06:58 AM

Looking good Simon. Maybe I'll have to find a cummins :)

Just shout if you need a hand.

Sitec

31st January 2014, 11:08 AM

With the inlet manifold mod done, and refitted, I am able to cut the hole in the engine cover for the new lever position. With a bit of measuring, re measuring, checking and checking again, I had a marked section for the lever. 4 hole saw holes and a few jigsaw cuts had me a hole! Here's a pic of the trial fit. The lever is in a much more 'usable' position than the original, and of course has that all important 'overdrive' 5th gear. :)

spongie

31st January 2014, 05:01 PM

Wow! Looks professional that better than factory

nrs91

1st February 2014, 03:51 AM

just how i imagined it when i was thinkin of doin my 101 lol
look at home that stick does! keep up the good work!

Sitec

1st February 2014, 07:17 AM

So, as its a week of 40ish degrees here, it kinda puts a dampened on working in a 45deg workshop. Not one to give up tho, last night I looked at the 'to do' list and selected something that's one of those 'easy jobs'... Front spring upgrade! So in the dusk of yesterday (now only 38 in the shed), I got into striping the spare springs I have and modifying the lower leaves to become the third leaf under Micks nose. Here's what they look like ready for fitment. The original top leaf won't go to waste, as it'll be the main leaf on my 'proposed' camp trailer down the track.. Once I find some spare 6 stud hub assemblies! :)

Sitec

1st February 2014, 08:30 AM

Ok, so after a 5am start to beat the heat, I've got the third leaf in on both front springs. Its sat the nose back up where it should be, and given me that all important 15mm clearance between the sump and axle case should I ever sit it on both front bump stops! I set the engine sump up at the same height from the axle as there is bump stop to axle clearance when it was on the two leaves. The hard now gives me that safety net!

Sitec

1st February 2014, 08:35 AM

Here's the longer M12 x 220 bolts (12.9 grade as per original spec). I have a stash of M12 heavy washers that come in on the Krone Swadrow's at work, so each bolt has one of these to spread the load. It all looks like it should be there too!! :)

nrs91

1st February 2014, 11:31 PM

nice work buddy!

Sitec

2nd February 2014, 10:54 AM

Right! Decision made to pull the engine out for the last time this morning. There's only so long you can work around the lump! Whilst out, all the mounts will be welded up, the chassis mounts will be welded up, the sump modified, the gear linkage welded, the front gear lever support finished. This will also get a diagonal support to the head which will act as the front lifting eye. The x member behind the transfer case will be removed and replaced by a one piece unit with a transfer case support mount. Whilst the engine is out it'll allow better access to the radiator and intercooler area so I can mount the cooler correctly and look to running some of the pipework. I can also measure the exhaust down pipe and try and source a flange to suit it.

Sitec

2nd February 2014, 01:22 PM

Here's the 4 mounts that bolt to the Cummins and ZF. With the engine out, I can weld these and paint them ready for the final fit. Its got too dam hot for this today tho! Should have got up earlier. That said, the engine is now clean, wire brushed off, and after the sump mod, a few other tweaks here and there, it'll be ready for a coat of paint.

stuee

2nd February 2014, 03:19 PM

Very jealous of your fabrication and engineering skills. You need to develop a conversion kit once you're done :wasntme:

DasLandRoverMan

2nd February 2014, 06:48 PM

Looking good so far, still patiently awaiting the video of first fire up and drive off!!!

Sitec

2nd February 2014, 08:36 PM

Looking good so far, still patiently awaiting the video of first fire up and drive off!!!

I have a CFS/Workmate primed with his GoPro! It has to be sooner rather than later as Melrose is getting ever closer! :)

Sitec

5th February 2014, 02:32 PM

Very jealous of your fabrication and engineering skills. You need to develop a conversion kit once you're done :wasntme:

I'd love to have the time and energy too, but I know it'd never be worth it as it'd be a costly kit... Engine mounts, chassis mounts, modified sump and pick up, transfer case gear and plate, exhaust, bespoke props, rad mods, fan hub and adaption boss, inlet manifold... The list goes on.. :D As for the skills... Well, sometimes I wonder if they are there too... The sump that I rotated, modified the pick up pipe and refitted using a new gasket.... Well, that came back off a few days ago! Someone forgot he was going to have to cut a bit out for front prop clearance!! Oops!! Anyway, here it is sporting it's new 'dent' to clear the front prop!

Sitec

5th February 2014, 05:19 PM

Here's the new gearbox x member in place. I had planned originally to leave the original in place, and use the LT95 handbrake assembly/drum etc, but on closer inspection, there was no way it was going to fit on the back of an LT230.. With the larger drum on the LT 230, either the gearbox had to be really low to clear it or a new cross member had to happen.... so it did! This one will suit my transfer case support mount as well.

DasLandRoverMan

5th February 2014, 05:48 PM

Spot the new metalwork!!!

You're probably right about conversion kits, there's enough work involved you wouldn't be able to make it worthwhile without the whole lot costing thousands.

A set of drawings of everything that needs to be made, where it needs to be welded into the truck and a list of parts required for the job made available on a CD so people can build their own and charged out at $50 would be an easier way to go.

Saying that, I doubt there's enough people in the world wanting to do the same as you'd make enough to retire on...

spongie

6th February 2014, 10:48 PM

Si, that looks blooming tidy fella! same location just one piece and higher?

Sitec

7th February 2014, 11:09 AM

Si, that looks blooming tidy fella! same location just one piece and higher?

Hi Spongie. Yup, exactly the same place, the top is flush with the top of the chassis, and the underside of it is 100mm down, giving enough room for the larger handbrake drum to sit underneath it. I've used a piece of 100 x 100 x3 RHS as this matched the width of the old x member and is exactly half the 200mm depth of the chassis rails. The two plates you can see are to carry the rear of the transfer case. I'll be using an M14 bolt and two poly bushes that are pushed into a piece of tube that will be located using the top 2bolts on the transfer case PTO cover. Might even make a fresh plate with the mount as part of it yet.. (Time dependant!)

spongie

7th February 2014, 06:03 PM

Laughable that your crossmember looks better than the factory job

Homestar

7th February 2014, 06:07 PM

Laughable that your crossmember looks better than the factory job

I was just thinking it would be nice if Si could knock up a whole new chassis for me of that quality.:D:angel::wasntme:

Sitec

11th February 2014, 03:16 PM

Mmmmmm, I'll be restoring mine before I'd be making chassis's... That said, of all the Land Rover Chassis produced, the 101's would be the easiest to replicate! So, the paint gun came out and the engine is now all a Massy/Agco grey! At least it looks half respectable now!! Got the gear back too... (Pic in the ZF5-42 to LT230 thread in projects!) Very happy, and so was the guy who did it.. Said it welded beautifully! We'll see.... :D

Homestar

11th February 2014, 03:32 PM

Similar colour to the Cummins Charcoal which always looked good - nice job, very smart.:)

spongie

11th February 2014, 04:05 PM

Oh that look so familiar!

spongie

11th February 2014, 04:07 PM

Do I spy fuel Tank in background? ;-) where are the link pipes etc located :)

Sorry to copy but imitation highest form of flattery and all that :)

Sitec

14th February 2014, 06:28 PM

Never try and fit a decent sized intercooler to a 101!!! Talk about a squeeze!! The one I selected is now fitted using some fabricated brackets to match with the radiator's original fixing points. The major work was re jigging the handbrake lever so that it'll still work using the original cable, lever and mounting holes. This involved a small plate being welded to the handbrake lever support bracket, and the two cable support holes being deepened so that the cable runs nearer to the body. It works tho and looking from the outside, you'd never know!!! :D

Homestar

14th February 2014, 06:43 PM

Nice job, looks like a tight squeeze.

Sitec

14th February 2014, 06:49 PM

Nice job, looks like a tight squeeze.

Very!! The intercooler has to go in from the engine side, with the rad out, and the left hand upright pivoted back towards the rear of the vehicle. Here's a pic of the LH outlet hole where the supply pipe will run under the arch and into the inlet manifold. I'll try and get a better pic of the handbrake mods. The one I took was very unclear. :)

buffaroo

15th February 2014, 03:30 AM

Thats what i call a large intercooler, as wide as the Rad ?

Sitec

15th February 2014, 03:56 PM

Thats what i call a large intercooler, as wide as the Rad ?

Yup, as wide as the rad. I'd have gone deeper, but when the steering is on full LH lock, there's a steering joint about 10mm from the rad.. It just clears my intercooler bottom support.... 2mm! :D

Sitec

16th February 2014, 10:47 AM

Not such a productive day yesterday as got sidetracked by a trip to Moorook Shelter in the Riverland, but with the assistance of Craig and his lathe I was able to make up the exhaust flange required to finish the exhaust. Easier now than when the engine is in (which will be this avo!). :)

Sitec

18th February 2014, 08:11 PM

Progress so far.. The engine and box are in for the final time! The exhaust is all welded up and ready for heat paint. (I know it won't last long, but at least it starts out tidy!). The LH pipe from intercooler to inlet manifold is made, painted and fitted (waiting on the thurs city trip to collect pipework for the RH intercooler pipework, exhaust clamp, and shims for center diff..). The fuel supply line is connected, all the fittings are fitted on the air tank. The earth leads are all in place, and I've made a new 24v supply lead along with a 12v supply lead to connect to the original leads that were attached to the V8 starter. This will run the lights, wipers, heater, gauges etc. I've mounted two 40 amp relays in the cavity behind the front right wheel along with a 12v insulated terminal. One relay will be the IGN relay, (12v switched from key) supplying the fuel injection pump, an alternator exciting/trigger wire with inline 24v globe on the dash, and a wire to the second relay which is the starter relay. (also triggered by a 12v supply from the key in the start position). Tomorrow, I hope to wrap the wiring up, along with the fuel return line and clutch supply line. Having this cooler weather has helped with motivation no end!!:p

Sitec

20th February 2014, 09:21 PM

Ok, here's a pic of the RH intercooler link pipe in the process of being made. Bit of a maze this one as the turbo outlet is just on the inside of that void where the fuel filler inlet sits.

Sitec

20th February 2014, 09:23 PM

Here's the pipe in place for a trial fit. :)

Sitec

20th February 2014, 09:28 PM

spongie

21st February 2014, 01:16 AM

And here's the left hand supply pipe fitted. The RH pipe is now drying after painting. Fitment tomorrow. I also managed to get the clutch working yesterday... with air assist. Not as light to use as I thought it was going to be but still a lot better than standard! Makes that 'hiss' when used too!! :D

hopefully mine will be half as tidy as this when its done, only one pipe going out through the arch the other comes out of the intercooler and along the inside of the engine cover/inner wing

Dougal

21st February 2014, 07:04 AM

Sitec

22nd February 2014, 09:38 AM

So how are you keeping the insides of the pipe clean while you weld it? I've had some bad experiences in the past with slag on the inside of welded pipes. Now I only weld where I can physically see and clean the inside of the joint.

I've had the same! Turbo impeller wheels don't like balls of slag! With each join, I've made sure that they contact all the way round with no gaps to fill... then before welding, using a flap disk I sand a small mitre on the outside edge of each pipe giving me a 'v' to fill with weld. I then tack the two pieces together using 4 tacks spaced evenly. I then weld from atop each tack to the next. (So at no point does it burn thru and form that ball of weld on the inner side). Once continuously welded, the new join gets sanded flat. The pipe then gets cleaned before starting the next join. Each join can be inspected with a torch to make sure there's no 'bits' waiting to fall off... Once complete, I then thread some string thru the tube, and pull a rag thru several times. The ends then get capped and a litre of petrol is swished up and down inside removing the fine stuff.. then Brakeclean, and then the air line.... and only then am I happy that there's nothing in there and I'll paint and fit it.

Sitec

22nd February 2014, 01:34 PM

So, yesterday avo as we're leaving work, Dan our new apprentice at work (also a CFS mate) pipes up... "101'ing tonight? Wanna hand?" Well, yeah and yeah!! So once home, he's like 'what ya want me to do'.. One of the many jobs that need doing is routing and connecting the 101 throttle cable to the Bosch pump. There was a support bracket for the original Daf cable still on the engine. We sized up what was needed and I sketched roughly what I want. 20 min later and hey presto! A plate for the job. He'll b fittin it today as he's keen to do more! :)

Sitec

22nd February 2014, 07:07 PM

Well, apart from an RCR call and a late start, it was a relatively un disturbed day. Throttle cable now fitted, and operates as it should. The capillary temp sender is now fitted in the back of the Cummins head. With a bit of re drilling, tapping etc and some magical 'Blue Max' the original plug at the rear of the head was modified to suit the 101's temp probe. I'm thinking the back of the head is the best location as this is the area that usually suffers the most heat. Even if the gauge reads on the high side in its 'normal' position, at least it should be fairly accurate.

Sitec

22nd February 2014, 07:19 PM

Next on the agenda was the air intake pipe from the filter to the turbo inlet. This had to be 3" as it matches the turbo housing, but it also had to have an outlet for the compressor pick up pipe, which is conveniently located at the rear of the engine! Here's the finished product. :)

DasLandRoverMan

22nd February 2014, 07:41 PM

Looking good so far. Can't be that far off driving now?

Sitec

22nd February 2014, 08:37 PM

Not far at all... I have Dan the apprentice pushing to fire it up.... He turned up with batteries today!!... but, I want to finish everything correctly. I'll prob look to getting the transfer box together tomorrow, and the final bits of machining to make the t'fer fit the main box. (Ill b able to wrap the other ZF to LT thread up then!).. Rad hoses, fan boss, vacuum pump bracketry, heater hoses, and air valve to control the compressor (Nick has told me what valve I need) to do. Once the transfer box is on then it'll be muffler system on and stand back!!! :D Can't wait to hear the 6 pot rumble!! :twisted: