Help... Think I'm going to lose my mind.

[Crimdog]

I'll try and make this are short and concise as possible.

- got my lower control arms replaced about 6months or so ago.
- still didn't feel right, left until next service ( local LR guys good rep), told me could be a strut.
- left it till next service ( I do about 500-1000kms for work). Took it to LR- said contol arms need doing????!!!
- took it back to local guy, replaced the right arm, faulty. Said left one was fine.
- clunk and feel of the car was worse!!!
- took it back again, replaced right contol arm again.
- still not right, took it back again.
- checked everything else it could be as they didn't want to have to replace it again... Tried a britpart (instead of genuine)
- feels better but still not right.
- took to LR for another service- said control arms need replacing!?!?!?
- ahhhhhhhhh
- took it back to local guys- he got wound up. Said the arms and bushes are fine. He then rang LR And had a go at them for a dodgy diagnosis and for missin the fact I had a split cv boot.
- LR going to look at it again Monday!!!

Questions
- if I have a wobble in what feels like the front and aprently it's not LCA, wheel bearings, cv etc. What could it be? I get back lash when on and of the accelerator, and the steering wheels wobbles and pulls when I tap the breaks. And also on on the hwy. some days worse than others.
- why am I burning through lower contol arms? Surely not that many parts are faulty!

Thanks
cDog

[ADMIRAL]

Pretty hard to assist when we don't have the benefit of the up close inspections, your local guy and the LR dealer have had.

You talk of a clunk, and then it is a wobble ? Which is it, and when do you experience it ?

The lower arm ( rear bush seems to be the worst ) has a lot of flex or compliance even when new. Possibly to cope with the huge variance in suspension heights, and the resulting changes of front arm geometry. In my experience this lower bush or the adjacent balljoint give a clunk when faulty. This noise seems to occur when mounting kerbs or hitting road irregularities.

If your issue is more of a wobble under brakes, yes the lower bushes can still contribute, but I would look harder at the wheels, tyres, hubs/bearings and the brake rotors, and anything associated, such as the ABS etc.

Drivetrain backlash ? Is this another issue ?

Sounds like you need to spend a little time, and try to isolate exactly what is occuring and under what conditions. The more specific info you can gather, the easier it will be to try and pinpoint an issue.

[Scouse]

LR had a bulletin out a couple of years ago detailing repairs involving replacing steering racks, steering wheels, brakes.....depending on VIN.
I'm sure it's been discussed on this forum section as it affected quite a few D4s.

[Scouse]

A quick search in this forum section has brought up these threads:
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/d3-d4-rrs/180668-steering-wheel-vibration-while-braking.html


http://www.aulro.com/afvb/d3-d4-rrs/133315-wheel-wobble.html

[Scouse]

Google even brings up the bulletin:
http://www.disco3.co.uk/gallery/albums/userpics/11102/TSB317V4-D4_wheel_wobble.pdf

[Graeme]

Check for looseness in the steering column that may be caused by a clamp bolt not tight. My D4 had some similar characteristics after the body was R&R'd and the clamp bolt wan't fully re-tightened. However overall I would suspect worn tie-rod ends or rack inner joints.

[Epic pooh]

What year is the vehicle and how many km's ?

Britpart LCA are harsher than OEM.

From my experiences, I agree with what Graeme has said -> lower steering column shaft and rack ends should be inspected very closely.

[Tote]

Worthwhile checking your swaybar links as well I had one that was faulty and had movement in it, it was clunking though but it definately made the front end feel funny. You need to undo one end to feel if it is worn though.

Regards,
Tote

[Crimdog]

thanks for the feedback guys.

"You talk of a clunk, and then it is a wobble ? Which is it, and when do you experience it ?"

Both -
the wobble is more pronounced on the hwy, anywhere between 80-120kms/h but not always!

- wheels have been balanced and aligned
- i have tried 2 different sets of wheels

the clunk was the typical one that worn LCAs create when you tap the brake etc. Since the latest replacement LCA that has stopped but i am still getting a clunk and a jerk when im on and off the accelerator, again not always.


Graeme - is there an easy way to tell if the tie-rod ends or rack inner joints are the culprit?

Im taking the car back to LR tomorrow - they rang me today and are trying not to admit they kooked it, told me to bring it back in and look at it with them.

[Graeme]

Tie-rod ends and rack inner joints can be checked by jacking the lower suspension arm (rather than the chasis) to get the wheel off the ground but to keep the wheels in about their usual plane. Grab the wheel and shake it left then right a few times preferably while someone else holds their hand around the joint to feel for movement.

[ADMIRAL]

Tie-rod ends and rack inner joints can be checked by jacking the lower suspension arm (rather than the chasis) to get the wheel off the ground but to keep the wheels in about their usual plane. Grab the wheel and shake it left then right a few times preferably while someone else holds their hand around the joint to feel for movement.


Or...if you ( or your repairer ) have access to a 4 post hoist, get the vehicle up in the air, ( wheels on the hoist..don't lift ) have the motor started, and the steering wheel moved sharply 1/4 turn each way repeatedly while someone checks for play in the rackends and tierods. You may be able to feel play by squeezing the tierod boot, ( while the steering linkages are moving back and forward ) same for the rack boot. If you are lucky there may even be a sharp cracking or knock. Note this is not something I would recommend anyone without experience gets involved in. We don't want crushed fingers or the like.

[Crimdog]

Would that tie in with a metallic creaking sound I get now and then when I am on full lock. Only ever on right hand down and usually when reversing into a park or something alike.

[Scouse]

Sounds like dry lock stops.

[Crimdog]

So took the disco into LR again. The reason they reckon the right LCA is shoot is because it's rock hard. I mentioned that it is a britpart arm and that the are aprently a lot stiffer. The tech said that it is to stiff and would be causing all sorts of problems regarding how the car feels.

Ahhh now I have one mechanic that's says its fine, one that says its not... Time to get a 3rd opinion I guess.

Also asked about tierod ends, tech said he checked them and they are fine.

Scouse- I thought itight be dry stops aswell, but they are not dry.

[Epic pooh]

I can say from experience that the britpart ones are definitely stiffer and harsher than oem.

Were they fitted at the correct height ? Is the car sitting correctly at the front and at even heights ? The proper procedure for doing lca involves bolts being done up with the arms at a specified height and then calibration of sensors. If not done properly this would contribute to your symptoms. But probably not to the noises you have (although if the bushes are twisted maybe, who knows).